Cont: The Biden Presidency (3)

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Beelzebuddy said:
I'm not expecting much of the primary season next year, but on the off chance we do have someone come out of left field, you're welcome to demonstrate this sentiment.
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As you somehow missed the next sentence: "I would be crapping on a candidate who was working to help the next right-wing demagogue win by lobbing grenades when (s)he could not win."

Your unconnected to political reality opinion about how viable someone out of left field would be against a sitting President in the primaries not withstanding, of course.
 
wareyin said:
As you somehow missed the next sentence: "I would be crapping on a candidate who was working to help the next right-wing demagogue win by lobbing grenades when (s)he could not win."

Your unconnected to political reality opinion about how viable someone out of left field would be against a sitting President in the primaries not withstanding, of course.
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So I was right the first time, you could have just said so.
 
Aridas said:
Just because...

Bernie Sanders endorses Biden, rules out 2024 bid of his own

Also,

House Republican admits he can't find any Biden crimes
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James Comer is one of the worst of the MAGA gang.

From the highlighted article:

“Well, we found a lot,” Comer vaguely drawled, “That's certainly unethical.
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Am I the only one experiencing déjà vu here?

We found a lot that should be illegal, although the line is blurry as to what is legal and not legal with respect to family influence peddling.”
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Only a MAGA politician could say that with a straight face and not burst out laughing at the sheer audacity of it.
 
Beelzebuddy said:
So I was right the first time, you could have just said so.
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No, the simple fact that you either can't see or pretend not to see the qualifiers included made you incorrect the first and the second time.

Sanders recognized that lobbing grenades this time would have a similar effect to his acts in 2016, and decided not to do so.
 
Debt ceiling/McCarthy
The bill passed in a narrow 217-215 vote. Every Democrat voted against it, as expected, along with four Republicans: Andy Biggs of Arizona, Tim Burchett of Tennessee, Ken Buck of Colorado and Matt Gaetz of Florida.
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Any further tinkering will not get the same 217. if the bill just increases debt 1.5 trillion with no cuts, they will lose those and more. So it will need 5-10 democrats to pass next time. I don't think McCarthy has the skills for that. Biden will not talk till some further version passes.
 
wareyin said:
No, the simple fact that you either can't see or pretend not to see the qualifiers included made you incorrect the first and the second time.

Sanders recognized that lobbing grenades this time would have a similar effect to his acts in 2016, and decided not to do so.
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This is an example of someone seeing what they want to see.

Sanders isn't running in a primary against a sitting president for what would be a whole host of reasons from futility to his not feeling up to the job given his age and he had a heart attack last time he tried. He also, as he has done before with both Clinton and Biden, is supporting the Democratic nominee.

Which to someone not obsessed with blaming progressives for Trump is not all that interesting.
 
Suddenly said:
This is an example of someone seeing what they want to see.

Sanders isn't running in a primary against a sitting president for what would be a whole host of reasons from futility to his not feeling up to the job given his age and he had a heart attack last time he tried. He also, as he has done before with both Clinton and Biden, is supporting the Democratic nominee.

Which to someone not obsessed with blaming progressives for Trump is not all that interesting.
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Sure, if you ignore what Sanders actually said, it's only because he doesn't feel up to the job.

Move along, nothing to see here, I will help elect the next right-wing demagogue if I want.
 
wareyin said:
Sure, if you ignore what Sanders actually said, it's only because he doesn't feel up to the job.
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He gave a standard statement. Of course he isn't going to go into detail because he has no reason. He's not running and he supports the presumptive nominee. It's barely worth notice.
Move along, nothing to see here, I will help elect the next right-wing demagogue if I want.
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At this point obsessively blaming progressives for past and future Democratic party failures is an excellent way to bring that about.
 
Suddenly said:
He gave a standard statement. Of course he isn't going to go into detail because he has no reason. He's not running and he supports the presumptive nominee. It's barely worth notice.
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Sure. So barely worth notice that it made the news. So standard that it's literally something 2 progressives on this forum are arguing against.

Suddenly said:
At this point obsessively blaming progressives for past and future Democratic party failures is an excellent way to bring that about.
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Yes, tell us all about how bad the Democratic party is. In what way would that ever backfire?
 
Beelzebuddy said:
I'm only pointing out you'd still be upset with any potential candidate, because to be a potential candidate they'd have to compete, and competition is inherently divisive. Showing that you're a better pick than Biden is going to involve saying bad things about Biden.
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Why would it require saying bad things about Biden?
 
Tero said:
House GOP offering deal to Biden
https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/30/politics/republicans-debt-ceiling-tom-emmer-cnntv/index.html
saying "these are Biden-Pelosi numbers" and completely ignoring the inflation in between. I guess it's just for Biden to suffer this, since he "caused" the inflation!
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It's not really a deal, it's just a way to block the very effective "Republicans don't even have a set of demands" talking point. Give up Student Loan Forgiveness? Add more work requirements to the social safety net? Repeal Green Energy tax credits? Increase the deficit by $100 Billion dollars to protect wealthy tax cheats? And that's before we get to massive cuts to pretty much every non-defense discretionary programs.

It's a joke to think Democrats should accept any of it, especially when Joe Biden can wave his 14th Amendment wand at any time and make the Debt Ceiling disappear completely.
 
Random said:
It's not really a deal, it's just a way to block the very effective "Republicans don't even have a set of demands" talking point. Give up Student Loan Forgiveness? Add more work requirements to the social safety net? Repeal Green Energy tax credits? Increase the deficit by $100 Billion dollars to protect wealthy tax cheats? And that's before we get to massive cuts to pretty much every non-defense discretionary programs.

It's a joke to think Democrats should accept any of it, especially when Joe Biden can wave his 14th Amendment wand at any time and make the Debt Ceiling disappear completely.
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:confused: Tell me if I'm wrong.

That's the Amendment which says guilty of insurrection can't hold office. Are you suggesting Biden clean the rat's nest out of the House?

Great idea but it would require a months or years-long judicial action whereby they were convicted first, would it not?

Though I would love to see Biden initiate this action, ... maybe after he's reelected so that isn't hanging over his head. And by that time the debt ceiling issue would have been resolved.


I think he should consider minting that trillion dollar coin just to thumb his nose at McCarthy.
 
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Skeptic Ginger said:
:confused: Tell me if I'm wrong.

That's the Amendment which says guilty of insurrection can't hold office. Are you suggesting Biden clean the rat's nest out of the House?

Great idea but it would require a months or years-long judicial action whereby they were convicted first, would it not?

Though I would love to see Biden initiate this action, ... maybe after he's reelected so that isn't hanging over his head. And by that time the debt ceiling issue would have been resolved.


I think he should consider minting that trillion dollar coin just to thumb his nose at McCarthy.
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The 14th Amendment is a big one with multiple sections. Section 4 reads:
Section 4
The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.
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It was added because after the civil war, the north and south had both borrowed a lot of money. The Union states did not want to pay for the Confederate states share of the war, and were also worried that the Confederate states would try to play weird political game regarding paying for the Unions share. (Crazy, I know)

Regardless, our modern Debt Ceiling is clearly unconstitutional.It was created by accident during World War One as a way to make borrowing money easier for the Congress, by setting up a single source of debt spending, rather than having to authorize each instance of debt spending individually. As the national debt grew and expanded, Congress saw no particular need to get rid of it, as it provided politicians on both sides of the aisle a regular opportunity to pontificate about the debt (rather than actually fix the debt).

It was only in the modern era that people realized that the debt ceiling could be used as a source of extortion. But the Constitution is clear. Congress may get to decide what to put on the national credit card, but the 14th Amendment says we must pay the credit card bill.

Biden has no obligation to play the GOPs game with the debt ceiling.
 
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wareyin said:
Sure. So barely worth notice that it made the news. So standard that it's literally something 2 progressives on this forum are arguing against.
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Statements that are press releases do wind up in the news, yes. Arguing that it's standard, yes.
Yes, tell us all about how bad the Democratic party is. In what way would that ever backfire?
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It would speak a progressive split from the party into existence. Which is always the drawback to scapegoating those you need to win elections..
 
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