Drag Shows!!

[Thermal]

I won't ask you that, but I will ask you how your specific, detailed, and in depth answer to that question is different from your answer to the question "why do you enjoy snowboarding?"

Because, according to this guy called arthwollipot, asking "why" is not amenable to satisfactory answers. My top-of-my-head Top 20 list would be a very satisfactory answer by any standard. Asking why I love it (primary motivation) is not the same as what I get out of it (end result).

 

[Dr. Keith]

The comparison to comedy is apt. Most drag shows are no more sexual than burlesque shows, but with an added layer of make believe. And far less serious.

Dueling piano bars rarely provide better music than a dedicated band, but can provide a great night of fun if your in the right mood.

 

[TragicMonkey]

The comparison to comedy is apt. Most drag shows are no more sexual than burlesque shows, but with an added layer of make believe. And far less serious.

Dueling piano bars rarely provide better music than a dedicated band, but can provide a great night of fun if your in the right mood.

I'm not much for live entertainment but I would definitely pay money to see drag queens hurl pianos at each other. I am a culture vulture, and have enormously high standards.

 

[mgidm86]

This sort of overreactive legislation makes me so angry. It doesn't support my view, nor my arguments. It just makes everything more politicized in a way that ends up drowning out the actual argument that I and many females are making.

Exactly! This is the point I have been making all along. It is an agenda disguised as morality. You are being used to further their own hateful and extreme agenda.

Who was the one that first compared black face to drag? Mary Cheney, a Republican political activist, go figure.

They don't care about you or any women that are outraged, they care about the power and the votes they will get by firing up the outrage machine and getting normal everyday people involved.

It happens over and over. Same exact method, different subject.

Look how many people they, Republicans, convinced not to wear masks and get vaccinated. They find a way to get people outraged and they obey, even if it means risking their own life. And it works.

This is so ******* obvious.

I have a few more posts to make then I'm out of here.

 

[Stacyhs]

I'm not much for live entertainment but I would definitely pay money to see drag queens hurl pianos at each other. I am a culture vulture, and have enormously high standards.

Don't morgues get rather boring after a while?

 

[arthwollipot]

Because, according to this guy called arthwollipot, asking "why" is not amenable to satisfactory answers. My top-of-my-head Top 20 list would be a very satisfactory answer by any standard. Asking why I love it (primary motivation) is not the same as what I get out of it (end result).

You've made me curious now. How about you lay on me the top 5 of your top 20?

 

[Robin]

Bold assertion Do you have something to support that?

Just my long experience of people.

Do you have anything to back your assumption that fans of drag acts would not be fans of women's fashion shows?

I'm afraid I didn't understand any of the above

I didn't think I would have to spell it out.

Women who wear work boots and hard hats are not dressing as men (as your analogy suggests). They are simply wearing apparel appropriate to their work.

Work boots and hard hats are not men's clothes. At least not in the twenty first century.

 

[arthwollipot]

Actually in my anecdotal experience, such that it is, the biggest fans of drag shows are gay men.

 

[Robin]

Some comedy is fine for children. Some drag is absolutely not.

And some drag acts are fine for children and some comedy is absolutely not.

So the analogy holds. Unlike the pole dancimg analogy.

Recall the kids at the "It's Not Going to Lick Itself" drag performance club.

Depends on the context and the age of the children. Nobody gave the context. What was "it"? If it was something like cancer then it seems a harmless double-entendre of the type pantomime dames famously made, like "It's nice to have something to suck' on, isn't it?".

It was always assumed to go over the heads of children.

The important thing is for parents to know what is going to be in store. I took my kids to a basketball game when we got free tickets., I hadn't been to one for years. My kids were asking why the ladies at half time were sticking out their bottoms and showing their underpants. I didn't even realise there were cheerleaders at basketball games. I thought that was football.

To me that's way more inappropriate for children and much more likely to give a negative image of women to children.

But I don't hear that condemned by the anti drag crowd. There were no warnings on the advertising material, at the tickets or the doors

That seems to be accepted.

 

[The Atheist]

Nice to see American hegemony extending to NZ, where protestors have copied their idiotic American filth and shut down a drag story time.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/distr...rary-drag-reading/UTQGWO5IHBBKLHVZ4NA4J6KBAQ/

Given there were a whole 3 protestors, it's a pity a couple of the dads didn't just remove them.

 

[SteveAitch]

Pole dancing doesn't have to be sexual.

Though it might make future Olympics more interesting.

 

[wareyin]

Once again, I will point out that if you look across the various splits, you have a total of six females who have taken part in this discussion. Two of us are vocally opposed to drag, two others have expressed at least mild dislike of drag, and you have ONE female who has expressed support for drag.

So even here, on this site, which is FAR from being well-balanced in terms of representation on the basis of sex, you have more females against drag than for drag.

You're still trying to limit the discussion to the people in this thread that you know are female. Why? You don't know the plumbing of everyone involved, and I'm pointing out that your 2 against, the only 2 against you've been able to muster, is vastly overwhelmed by the multitudes who actually vote with their feet and attend drag shows.

 

[Thermal]

You've made me curious now. How about you lay on me the top 5 of your top 20?

No way José. If the Human Sacrifice Thread is any indicator, that's a derail that will result in a mod breaking down my door with bolt cutters in hand.

And we both know why you are doing it: to Socratically lead to the conclusion that what you get out of something equates to why you like it. So cutting to the chase: I go to the dentist to maintain the health and hygiene of my teeth, and forestall future problems. That's the benefit I get out of it. Are you going to gotcha me with "therefore, you like going to the dentist"?

I mean, I get cheering a drag queen on. They are living their life honestly on their own terms, and thumbing their noses at an established social convention. My kind of people. But that doesn't make it an interesting thing to me. What I am asking is what other posters see in this. Is there something they actually like about it, or is it a trendy acceptance gesture? And before you say it, there is nothing at all wrong with a trendy acceptance gesture and show of support. I marched in the Pride Brigade (as an ally) in my town's Halloween Parade last year. I'm not actually into gay people, but I am big into their rights and dignity. The argumentation ITT seems to run along other lines, though, so I'm asking for clarity.

 

[Darat]

I keep rolling back to "why does the audience like drag?" Like, I get the performers doing what they like. Expression and all. And of course their friends and others who share a similar lifestyle. But do the people who like seeing men in dresses also get fired up to see women dressed as lumberjacks? I mean yeah, drag kings are out there, but much like pole dancers, there is a solid majority only going in one direction. There's not much happening in the Drag King Story Hour front, by contrast.

Drag viewers of the forum: what are you getting from seeing men in dresses that you are not getting from women in workboots and hardhats? If it's about glamor, do you spend a similar amount of time at female fashion shows? Or is it again just something about specifically guys in women's clothes that compelled you to buy that ticket?

Most drag performances are cabaret, some will be more on the likes of singing and dancing, some more on the likes of comedy, so people are going to see a cabaret show.

Why people like those style of shows will be varied.

 

[Thermal]

Just my long experience of people.

Do you have anything to back your assumption that fans of drag acts would not be fans of women's fashion shows?

It'd be stellar of you'd stop putting words in my mouth. I have pointedly made no such assumption.

I didn't think I would have to spell it out.

Women who wear work boots and hard hats are not dressing as men (as your analogy suggests). They are simply wearing apparel appropriate to their work.

Work boots and hard hats are not men's clothes. At least not in the twenty first century.

We are not talking about work clothes. Skip the hard hat if it's throwing you off.

The discussion here is laser focused on men in women's clothes. Why are posters so vocal about seeing men dressed as women, and noncommittal about women dressed as men?

 

[JoeMorgue]

You'd think people were running down the streets trying to avoid drag shows, stepping around one only to run smack into another from this thread.

Half this board probably couldn't find a drag show in the next 24 hours if they actively tried to seek one out.

 

[Darat]

Actually in my anecdotal experience, such that it is, the biggest fans of drag shows are gay men.

It certainly came out of the gay culture and still has it hooks in that culture, but by the late 70s the major venues that were based around drag acts were catering primarily for the female audience, and for a straight audience. For example Foo Foo's Palace in Manchester, the audience was predominantly female and straight males:

...snip... Lammar bought his first club, the Picador in Shudehill, located in Manchester's city centre, in 1971. He subsequently took over Celebrity, another city centre venue. Located in Dale Street, he renamed it Foo Foo's Palace, and the club became well-established.[3] Lammar worked behind the bar, serving customers in full drag, before doing two turns as the cabaret entertainment, with two support acts in between. He would surprise audiences at the end by appearing as himself, minus the drag. Coachloads of hen parties would visit from around the country to see him perform. Foo Foo's Palace was also a favourite venue for Manchester United footballer players, and it was patronised by showbusiness personalities. ...snip...​

 

[Thermal]

And some drag acts are fine for children and some comedy is absolutely not.

Right. And some acting is appropriate for children, and some not. And some topics of conversation. And multiple other behaviors. It's so trite am observation as to be meaningless.

So the analogy holds. Unlike the pole dancimg analogy.

Your analogy is an obvious truism. Pole dancing performers are overwhelmingly sex specific, which was the point. So no, my analogy is actually relevant.

Depends on the context and the age of the children. Nobody gave the context. What was "it"? If it was something like cancer then it seems a harmless double-entendre of the type pantomime dames famously made, like "It's nice to have something to suck' on, isn't it?".

I'm not going to sit here and pretend the "lick itself" neon sign at the gay bar was in support of cancer research or treatment, or intended to be so.

It was always assumed to go over the heads of children.

The important thing is for parents to know what is going to be in store. I took my kids to a basketball game when we got free tickets., I hadn't been to one for years. My kids were asking why the ladies at half time were sticking out their bottoms and showing their underpants. I didn't even realise there were cheerleaders at basketball games. I thought that was football.

To me that's way more inappropriate for children and much more likely to give a negative image of women to children.

But I don't hear that condemned by the anti drag crowd. There were no warnings on the advertising material, at the tickets or the doors

That seems to be accepted.

Which is like saying you went to a boxing match and felt you should have been warned about violence in the ring or scorecard ladies in bikinis. Claiming oblivion to what has been around for generations and that you are paying to see only gets you so far.

 

[Thermal]

Most drag performances are cabaret, some will be more on the likes of singing and dancing, some more on the likes of comedy, so people are going to see a cabaret show.

Why people like those style of shows will be varied.

Thats the kind I have seen in Atlantic City, usually as part of a variety review performance geared entirely at adults, with pretty graphic adult humor. Posters here seem to be avoiding this and talk about other drag they see. That's what I'm asking about.

 

[Thermal]

You'd think people were running down the streets trying to avoid drag shows, stepping around one only to run smack into another from this thread.

Half this board probably couldn't find a drag show in the next 24 hours if they actively tried to seek one out.

I'll walk you into four clubs right now in Atlantic City that specialize in them. Two are very close to where I park to surf there and I've seen patrons in and out of them for decades.