Merged Bitcoin - Part 3

psionl0 said:
This is not true at all. You don't need a fully developed exchange to facilitate trade or learn the current price of a crypto. Exchanges are just a convenience. As with any other product, you just have to check the ads to see what sellers are asking or buyers are offering.
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Hmm...

This is true but only just.

You can buy bitcoin from anyone that has some to sell, all you have to do is give them money, and hope that they'll type your wallet address into their wallet software (and the amount of bitcoin you've bought), and wait for the network to validate that transaction...

However, you would need to find a person with bitcoin to sell, and that person has to be trustworthy.

In real life (meatspace) you can buy foreign currency from any person, but in practice people prefer to deal with currency exchanges because of similar problems.
 
novaphile said:
In real life (meatspace) you can buy foreign currency from any person, but in practice people prefer to deal with currency exchanges because of similar problems.
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That much is true. Crypto exchanges are the most convenient way to facilitate large volumes of crypto trading.

But that is a long way away from claiming that bitcoin couldn't exist without bitcoin exchanges (or that you would never know about the price of bitcoin).
 
psionl0 said:
That much is true. Crypto exchanges are the most convenient way to facilitate large volumes of crypto trading.
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what novaphile described wasn't mere convenience, it was practical necessity. Currency trade as we know it can't exist without currency exchanges.

"Yeah but you could still exchange currency on an individual to individual basis without currency exchanges" doesn't alter how fundamental they are to a viable system.
 
lomiller said:
what novaphile described wasn't mere convenience, it was practical necessity. Currency trade as we know it can't exist without currency exchanges.

"Yeah but you could still exchange currency on an individual to individual basis without currency exchanges" doesn't alter how fundamental they are to a viable system.
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I'm surprised that you would call bitcoin a "currency" and a "viable system" (not that there is any merit to your argument whatsoever).
 
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Bitcoin existed without exchanges. And there are still countries where you can't authorize to any exchange, yet you can do bitcoin transactions.
Exchanges certainly help, and are certainly needed to get the market cap.
 
Stankeye said:
Where did you get that info about both parties?

Not even the WaPo has mentioned any donations FTX made to republicans.
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Top execs of FTX donated $57 million to Democrats and $22 million to Republicans according to this article.

After the collapse of FTX, a number of journalists reported on the fact that FTX executives deployed significant donations to political leaders in the United States. During the most recent election cycle leading up to the U.S. midterms in 2022, reports claim that Sam Bankman-Fried donated more than $40 million to Democrats via super PACs and direct contributions. Furthermore, reports also claim that FTX Digital Markets’ co-chief executive officer Ryan Salame gave $22 million to Republicans.
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Although I do note that I got zero results for Salame's name at Open Secrets.
 
psionl0 said:
Even then you don't need an exchange because we know precisely how many bitcoins have been mined so to get a market cap all you need is a price.
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I mean THE market cap bitcoin has, $315B atm. Without exchanges bitcoin was insignificant IT oddity. Only exchanges allowed it to be headline topic.
 
psionl0 said:
This is a case in point. Deliberately using cryptos and crypto exchanges interchangeably in an attempt to muddy the waters.
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No it wasn't. I said the fraudulent exchanges appear because of the nature of the asset [crypto currency] they deal in. I said there is a relationship between the unregulated nature of crypto currencies and the fraudulent exchanges that deal in them, not that they are identical.

It's somewhat telling that you can only engage in this thread by misrepresenting other people's arguments.
 
psionl0 said:
Even then you don't need an exchange because we know precisely how many bitcoins have been mined so to get a market cap all you need is a price.
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How do you get a price without exchanges? How do you get hold of Bitcoin without exchanges?

At the basic level, I could find somebody who has got some Bitcoin and we could agree between ourselves what I should give them in return for their Bitcoin, but, as soon as you have a lot of people trying to get gold of or get rid of Bitcoin, exchanges will start to appear.

Unfortunately, the unregulated nature of crypto currency makes it easy for exchanges to create scams.
 
psionl0 said:
No, cryptos are just digital assets. Nothing in them technically causes exchanges to be risky.
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OK.

It is the politics of cryptos that resulted in shonky exchanges.
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You just contradicted the sentence before.

You couldn't trade bitcoin on regulated brokerages/exchanges.
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I would dispute that. You could regulate crypto trading just like you regulate trading on the stock market or commodities.
 
Two things.
1. Bitcoin is an amazing piece of software, genius by any measure.
2. Nothing can stop it going to zero or a trillion.

But there is no chance technically that it does.not print new lows below 15k.
Do not purchase this nonsensical "asset".
 
psionl0 said:
This is not true at all. You don't need a fully developed exchange to facilitate trade or learn the current price of a crypto. Exchanges are just a convenience. As with any other product, you just have to check the ads to see what sellers are asking or buyers are offering.
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Other people have hit around this, but it's going to destroy liquidity when people can't easily value something in relation to the dominant currency. Given that bitcoin's relevance is as a store of value and speculation tied in with that making it far less liquid would cause it to collapse.

Whether bitcoin being strictly barter is bitcoin existing is a question of taste, but a coin would end up being more worth a pizza than a car and irrelevant to the lives of almost everyone.
 
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