kurious_kathy explain this.

[AnotherSillyAlias]

First of all I will indirectly answer something I see about the OT. Many things in there seemed very harsh. But keep in perspective God was trying very hard to have Isreal be Holy and set apart. They were disobedient in many ways...and if you ask me he doesn't order it, It's more like he let's sin run it's course. He says he will turn peolpe over to their sins if they don't repent! It's a repedative consequence.
And as for David...he blew it with Bathsheba, but he did repent and ask God's forgiveness for it once he had been convicted. Was there a consequence for his sin? Absolutely.
I often question God on how he dealt with men in old days that had many wives? In the new testament we have teachings in 1 Corinthians 7 of how marriage and relationships are suppose to be. I'm thankful for these teachings myself. The disfunctional family has always been an issue. It can create way too much pain in peoples lives.

Nice evasive tactic but it won't fly. How about you answer a DIRECT question with a YES or NO answer. No preaching, no evasions, no excuses or other nonsense, just YES or NO.

Does your god condone and order the raping of women and the killing of children?

Remember, YES or NO is all that is required.

 

[kurious_kathy]

So. Everything God did is justified then? ordering rape? Killing of children?
How does that justify ordering rape and the killing of innocents?

Who are we to question anything God allows. I don't really see as he ordered it...but I would have to reflect on it a bit.
What comes to my mind is when God ordered King Saul to kill all the pagan people that were evil in the sight of God. Saul got in big trouble for not following through with what God had commanded him to do. He lost everything because he rebelled against God as well. This is more of the lesson to me in what not to do. I have heard it said people can be used as an example ...good or bad.
God can and does intervene in wiping out evil people when he see's it is needed. Painful, yes. I just trust that he is the righteous judge and in total control. This does not mean I like seeing people destroyed. But if they are evil I like justice way more than seeing evil people get away with hurting others. Don't you?

 

[Ducky]

Who are we to question anything God allows. I don't really see as he ordered it...but I would have to reflect on it a bit.
What comes to my mind is when God ordered King Saul to kill all the pagan people that were evil in the sight of God. Saul got in big trouble for not following through with what God had commanded him to do. He lost everything because he rebelled against God as well. This is more of the lesson to me in what not to do. I have heard it said people can be used as an example ...good or bad.
God can and does intervene in wiping out evil people when he see's it is needed. Painful, yes. I just trust that he is the righteous judge and in total control. This does not mean I like seeing people destroyed. But if they are evil I like justice way more than seeing evil people get away with hurting others. Don't you?

By that logic then, in the name of God it is allowable to rape and kill? Remember God TOLD men to rape and kill. The quotes are above.

Doesn't sound like justice, but it does sound like evil people getting away with hurting others.

Try again.


Your logical fallacies this time were:

Argument from incredulity, appeal to authority and non-sequiter.



ETA:

Nice evasive tactic but it won't fly. How about you answer a DIRECT question with a YES or NO answer. No preaching, no evasions, no excuses or other nonsense, just YES or NO.

Does your god condone and order the raping of women and the killing of children?

Remember, YES or NO is all that is required.

Please answer ASA also.

 

[slingblade]

Elisha and the Two Bears
(2 Kings 2:23-25)

23 Then he went up from there to Bethel; and as he was going up by the way, young lads came out from the city and mocked him and said to him, “Go up, you baldhead; go up, you baldhead!” 24 When he looked behind him and saw them, he cursed them in the name of the LORD. Then two female bears came out of the woods and tore up forty-two lads of their number. 25 And he went from there to Mount Carmel, and from there he returned to Samaria.

Oh, but this is just allegory. Even though we get the guy's itinerary, and the exact words the kids teased him with, it's still just allegory.

MOM: Where is 'e, your brudder?

SON: Oh! 'E alle bloody! Big bear, 'e eat 'im! 'E alle gory!

Yup. That explains that.

 

[AnotherSillyAlias]

God can and does intervene in wiping out evil people when he see's it is needed. Painful, yes. I just trust that he is the righteous judge and in total control. This does not mean I like seeing people destroyed. But if they are evil I like justice way more than seeing evil people get away with hurting others. Don't you?

Ahhh.. I see, so those storms that wiped out New Orleans were ordered up by god because everyone in there was evil, including the children.

Yes, I see it now.

No doubt all the people killed by the tsunami, including the children, were also godless heathens that needed wiping out.

Where do I sign up for your brand of religion?

 

[Iacchus]

Nice evasive tactic but it won't fly. How about you answer a DIRECT question with a YES or NO answer. No preaching, no evasions, no excuses or other nonsense, just YES or NO.

Does your god condone and order the raping of women and the killing of children?

Remember, YES or NO is all that is required.

Well, at the very least, we have the Big Bang to blame for such things.

 

[kurious_kathy]

Does your god condone and order the raping of women and the killing of children?

I think it's important to know what these people were doing that was evil in the sight of God. Were these the people that sacrificed their children in the fire in the worship of false Gods? Hmmm sick form of abortion in my opinion.
I still have much more to learn about the old testement...but I am getting there. Noah and his family were the only ones saved way back then. What the heck were those guys into that the whole world had to be flooded? Hmmm

 

[Ducky]

I think it's important to know what these people were doing that was evil in the sight of God. Were these the people that sacrificed their children in the fire in the worship of false Gods? Hmmm sick form of abortion in my opinion.
I still have much more to learn about the old testement...but I am getting there. Noah and his family were the only ones saved way back then. What the heck were those guys into that the whole world had to be flooded? Hmmm

So in otherwords you concede that your god condones and in fact orders rape and murder?


Your logical fallacy this time was:

Argument from incredulity and appeal to authority.


ETA: and a non-sequiter with some post hoc reasoning for the abortion comment.

 

[AnotherSillyAlias]

I think it's important to know what these people were doing that was evil in the sight of God. Were these the people that sacrificed their children in the fire in the worship of false Gods? Hmmm sick form of abortion in my opinion.

You couldn't do it could you? You just can't answer a simple, direct question with a simple direct answer. So what you're saying here is that any woman that gets raped must have been doing something evil.

Do you see anything wrong with this?

I still have much more to learn about the old testement...but I am getting there. Noah and his family were the only ones saved way back then. What the heck were those guys into that the whole world had to be flooded? Hmmm

It's nice to see that you're actually asking a question, even if it's the wrong one. Critical thinking is a wonderful thing.

There was no flood that covered the world.

 

[Bri]

I don't intend to defend kurious_kathy in the least, but you have misinterpreted the following passage:

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

My version translates "slave" as "bondswoman" in a section that talks about both bondsmen and bondswomen. It is clear that bondsmen and bondswomen are not sex slaves, but servants. Becoming a servant was a common way for people in financial difficulty to get themselves out of debt, and it was actually considered charity to hire such a servant. In this case, a father is allowed to ensure future financial security for his daughter (in a time when such things were far from certain) by "selling" his daughter as a bondswoman before she reaches puberty under a contract with the "buyer" that he or his son will marry her after she reaches puberty. If he violates the contract, the buyer must assist in arranging her freedom.

I don't know about the other passages.

-Bri

 

[Roadtoad]

Nice kitty you got there.

 

[kurious_kathy]

Ahhh.. I see, so those storms that wiped out New Orleans were ordered up by god because everyone in there was evil, including the children.

Yes, I see it now.

No doubt all the people killed by the tsunami, including the children, were also godless heathens that needed wiping out.

Where do I sign up for your brand of religion?

Don't put words in my mouth! I said I have to ask because of some of the obvious...New Orleans is outrageous...So is Cancun all people do is drink and party mostly in those towns. Thats how they make there money too. I just said I have questioned if God was shaking them up a bit to get some of their attentions. Out of dispair it seems more people do turn to God for help. It's at those times we realize how dependant we are when we lose everything in a tragedy, don't you see that?

People find faith when some of the worst things happen. I myself try to support organizations for rebuilding ...and give shelter to people in time of crisis. I see many get involved more when it's needed. This seems to be more when people realize God's love is there and people do care. The human spirit.

What about Sept 11 th. Many turned to God and went back to church...but then after a few months they went right back to what they were doing and seemed to forget they needed him. I think faith should be something we live for a lifetime. Not just in times of trouble...but many don't seem to see it?

 

[Ducky]

I don't intend to defend kurious_kathy in the least, but you have misinterpreted the following passage:



My version translates "slave" as "bondswoman" in a section that talks about both bondsmen and bondswomen. It is clear that bondsmen and bondswomen are not sex slaves, but servants. Becoming a servant was a common way for people in financial difficulty to get themselves out of debt, and it was actually considered charity to hire such a servant. In this case, a father is allowed to ensure future financial security for his daughter (in a time when such things were far from certain) by "selling" his daughter as a bondswoman before she reaches puberty under a contract with the "buyer" that he or his son will marry her after she reaches puberty. If he violates the contract, the buyer must assist in arranging her freedom.

I don't know about the other passages.

-Bri

We're not reading anything into the "if she does not please him?"

 

[AnotherSillyAlias]

Nice kitty you got there.

Yeah but nobody is pointing a gun at it!

 

[Roadtoad]

Don't put words in my mouth! I said I have to ask because of some of the obvious...New Orleans is outrageous...So is Cancun all people do is drink and party mostly in those towns. Thats how they make there money too. I just said I have questioned if God was shaking them up a bit to get some of their attentions. Out of dispair it seems more people do turn to God for help. It's at those times we realize how dependant we are when we lose everything in a tragedy, don't you see that?

People find faith when some of the worst things happen. I myself try to support organizations for rebuilding ...and give shelter to people in time of crisis. I see many get involved more when it's needed. This seems to be more when people realize God's love is there and people do care. The human spirit.

What about Sept 11 th. Many turned to God and went back to church...but then after a few months they went right back to what they were doing and seemed to forget they needed him. I think faith should be something we live for a lifetime. Not just in times of trouble...but many don't seem to see it?

In order to maintain faith, doesn't it stand to reason that you will be supported in your decision to believe, rather than treated as an outsider? Would it not stand to reason that you would be welcomed by your fellow believers, rather than treated as a pariah?

Sorry. Far too often, I saw people who came to Church, looking for God, and discovering that their "bretheren" rejected them because they didn't attend the same churches growing up, or they didn't dress right, or, (God Forbid!), they were divorced.

Of COURSE they went back after a few months! Why would they remain and be abused! That's stupid!

 

[Ducky]

Don't put words in my mouth! I said I have to ask because of some of the obvious...New Orleans is outrageous...So is Cancun all people do is drink and party mostly in those towns. Thats how they make there money too. I just said I have questioned if God was shaking them up a bit to get some of their attentions. Out of dispair it seems more people do turn to God for help. It's at those times we realize how dependant we are when we lose everything in a tragedy, don't you see that?

People find faith when some of the worst things happen. I myself try to support organizations for rebuilding ...and give shelter to people in time of crisis. I see many get involved more when it's needed. This seems to be more when people realize God's love is there and people do care. The human spirit.

What about Sept 11 th. Many turned to God and went back to church...but then after a few months they went right back to what they were doing and seemed to forget they needed him. I think faith should be something we live for a lifetime. Not just in times of trouble...but many don't seem to see it?

Those words are your own. You said:

They were disobedient in many ways...and if you ask me he doesn't order it, It's more like he let's sin run it's course. He says he will turn peolpe over to their sins if they don't repent! It's a repedative consequence.
And as for David...he blew it with Bathsheba, but he did repent and ask God's forgiveness for it once he had been convicted. Was there a consequence for his sin? Absolutely.

ASA's response was the most logical deduction of your statement.

Your logical fallacy this time was:

Argument from incredulity and a whole lot of non-sequiter.

 

[Iacchus]

All is but a necessary outcropping of this amoral event called the Big Bang. So, who cares whether Goddidit or not?

 

[kurious_kathy]

You couldn't do it could you? You just can't answer a simple, direct question with a simple direct answer. So what you're saying here is that any woman that gets raped must have been doing something evil.

Do you see anything wrong with this?



It's nice to see that you're actually asking a question, even if it's the wrong one. Critical thinking is a wonderful thing.

There was no flood that covered the world.

I disagree with you about the flood..but this is a totally different topic.

I would never say any woman deserves to be raped, this is a terrible thing for anyone to go through! I would not wish it on my worse enemy, but it does happen. We can't blame God if something like that happens to someone, right?

 

[Ducky]

I disagree with you about the flood..but this is a totally different topic.

I would never say any woman deserves to be raped, this is a terrible thing for anyone to go through! I would not wish it on my worse enemy, but it does happen. We can't blame God if something like that happens to someone, right?

Yet we can blame him for natural disasters? That's what you did.

So you did not answer my question: DOES YOUR GOD CONDONE AND ORDER RAPE AND MURDER?!

Your logical fallacies this time were:

Post hoc reasoning, argument from incredulity and appeal to authority.

You also did infer the raped woman did something to deserve it, this is known as blaming the victim. It's exactly what you did to sligblade. Apparently you think if someone has something horrible happen to them, they deserved it and God ordered it.

 

[Cosmo]

Nice kitty you got there.

This is not my kitten (it's Google Image Search's kitten), but it is one that did the job for me when I felt tired of banging my head against kathy's wall.