• Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more

The Russian Invasion of Ukraine Part 4

Status
Not open for further replies.
I have already had several such experiences. One of those was the reported encirclement of Avdiivka, with especially vivid memories of some idiot (it is perfectly safe to call him that now) on youtube. He was berating whoever it may concern about the lying western media, and that if people only really informed themselves, they would know too, that Avdiivka had been encircled and would be taken soon. He also linked to some Chinese media.

Well, what can I say. According to my sources, FWIW, the claim was false then. I waited a few days and even weeks, to see if the claim would maybe later turn out to be true. It never did. That was May.

And the consequences to me, the wising up, of such experiences was/is to disregard anything that can ultimately be traced to Moscow.


There are idiots on all sides, but for the record, Adveeka is kind of a suburb of Donetsk city, and is where the Nazis are shelling the city from every day. It is the most hardened "fortress" the Kiev regime managed to build in eight years.
 
Last edited:
The Russians are showing their weaknesses. The Ukrainians are literally blowing their tanks, jets and ships to bits and pieces. The Europeans and America are supplying them with weapons which are better than what the Russians have. Brazile gave them their state of the art tank that is as good or better than Americas Abrams tank. How greatly hath thou fallen oh Russia. Yes I can sense the groans around me. Sorry about that.
 
If you can judge that. It was certainly not a "grain silo" exploding like the "Great Britain" propaganda machine that is working you pretends.

When did they claim Grain Silos were hit? Please show the link that someone posted that says Grain Silos were struck.
 
Makes me wonder

It is the port being targeted when they agreed not to target the port.

how many Russian "theys" there might be. Some elements of the more extreme kind may have control of missile batteries, at times anyway. This disturbed Khrushchev's sleep. And mine.

There's also the deeper, darker appeal of nihilism to unfinished minds. No ideal exists for a nihilist, not honesty or mercy or, particularly, self respect. Destruction is not an ideal, it's only action, and actions vanish as they are carried out. Strange to say, a nihilist lives entirely for the future, for the coming instant that is immediately gone and of no account.

Try to imagine anything scarier than that.
 
The Russians are showing their weaknesses. The Ukrainians are literally blowing their tanks, jets and ships to bits and pieces. The Europeans and America are supplying them with weapons which are better than what the Russians have. Brazile gave them their state of the art tank that is as good or better than Americas Abrams tank. How greatly hath thou fallen oh Russia. Yes I can sense the groans around me. Sorry about that.

You made this claim a few days ago.

Which tank do you mean?

Brazil has Leopard 1s and M60s.
 
how many Russian "theys" there might be. Some elements of the more extreme kind may have control of missile batteries, at times anyway. This disturbed Khrushchev's sleep. And mine.

There's also the deeper, darker appeal of nihilism to unfinished minds. No ideal exists for a nihilist, not honesty or mercy or, particularly, self respect. Destruction is not an ideal, it's only action, and actions vanish as they are carried out. Strange to say, a nihilist lives entirely for the future, for the coming instant that is immediately gone and of no account.

Try to imagine anything scarier than that.

If the Russians aren't in control of their forces they shouldn't make agreements that involve those forces.
 
Only one person in this thread keeps going on and on about grain silos being blowed up, as if saying it over and over will somehow alter the facts at hand.

Yeah, I noticed that what I posted had been brought up previously (I missed that a page of replies had been added) and CE’s response was just absolutely pathetic: “it’s implied because the BBC said the port exports grain!” Seriously?
 
If the Russians aren't in control of their forces they shouldn't make agreements that involve those forces.

"Should" and "shouldn't" mean nothing to fascists. The only antithesis they can grasp is "can" vs "can't."

Or "can't yet, but we'll try anyway, who cares about 10 or 20 dead proles. Thousand, I mean."

Christ but I wish I was just making this up.
 
Q: How can you tell when a Russian is lying?
A: They're breathing.

I have already had several such experiences. One of those was the reported encirclement of Avdiivka, with especially vivid memories of some idiot (it is perfectly safe to call him that now) on youtube. He was berating whoever it may concern about the lying western media, and that if people only really informed themselves, they would know too, that Avdiivka had been encircled and would be taken soon. He also linked to some Chinese media.

Well, what can I say. According to my sources, FWIW, the claim was false then. I waited a few days and even weeks, to see if the claim would maybe later turn out to be true. It never did. That was May.

And the consequences to me, the wising up, of such experiences was/is to disregard anything that can ultimately be traced to Moscow.

Russia didn't attack Odesa, but also Russia hit military targets in Odesa with a Odesa in a precision strike.



https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1551114320934830080?s=20&t=46rCliD2YVx59Q4tv-L9MA


Russian claims and denials are not to be taken seriously

And from the YouTube video I had linked to earlier by a retired Finnish intelligence colonel on Russian Strategic Culture



37:36 Russian Truth: The Significance of Language and Concepts, Especially for Lie and Truth

41:05 Examples of the frontiers of lie and truth in a Russian narrative

Worth a watch
 
Nice observation by "EACLucifer" on scrutable.science

https://scrutable.science/viewtopic.php?p=128528#p128591
So it appears there's another downside to repurposing S300 air defence missiles as crude ground attack ones, aside from the cost, inaccuracy and moral abyss of using them on civilians, and that's that it makes them nice and visible to counterbattery radar.

Reportedly one such system has been destroyed in Kherson oblast after firing on Mykolaiv, and there are images. While they look like an S300, I'm not very good at such ID and thus won't vouch for them yet.

One possible reason why some S300 systems have been recently hit.
 
As Masha Gessen has several times put it, Putin (and, by extensions, Putler's mouthpieces and ass lickers) lie not to make their listeners believe a falsehood, but to assert and demonstrate power: That he (they) can say whatever he wants, and nothing you can do against it. She advises, generally, against fact-checking everything, or more precisely to keep on fact-checking: Once you have found out that Putler (and autocrats like him; Trump also an example) lies as a habit and as a way of meta-communication, not tactically, it becomes necessary to point out not the lies as such, but the habit. It doesn't matter then whether a new statement is a lie.

(Here is something that the Ruscists actually are doing badly - they have forgotten a main rule for good propaganda: That enough of it be true enough to pass long enough as information worth considering. By lying too obviously, too often, it no longer works tactically. Nobody is fooled by it anymore, at least nobody with access to truer narratives)
 
As Masha Gessen has several times put it, Putin (and, by extensions, Putler's mouthpieces and ass lickers) lie not to make their listeners believe a falsehood, but to assert and demonstrate power: That he (they) can say whatever he wants, and nothing you can do against it. She advises, generally, against fact-checking everything, or more precisely to keep on fact-checking: Once you have found out that Putler (and autocrats like him; Trump also an example) lies as a habit and as a way of meta-communication, not tactically, it becomes necessary to point out not the lies as such, but the habit. It doesn't matter then whether a new statement is a lie.

(Here is something that the Ruscists actually are doing badly - they have forgotten a main rule for good propaganda: That enough of it be true enough to pass long enough as information worth considering. By lying too obviously, too often, it no longer works tactically. Nobody is fooled by it anymore, at least nobody with access to truer narratives)
Exactly
 
As Masha Gessen has several times put it, Putin (and, by extensions, Putler's mouthpieces and ass lickers) lie not to make their listeners believe a falsehood, but to assert and demonstrate power: That he (they) can say whatever he wants, and nothing you can do against it. She advises, generally, against fact-checking everything, or more precisely to keep on fact-checking: Once you have found out that Putler (and autocrats like him; Trump also an example) lies as a habit and as a way of meta-communication, not tactically, it becomes necessary to point out not the lies as such, but the habit. It doesn't matter then whether a new statement is a lie.

(Here is something that the Ruscists actually are doing badly - they have forgotten a main rule for good propaganda: That enough of it be true enough to pass long enough as information worth considering. By lying too obviously, too often, it no longer works tactically. Nobody is fooled by it anymore, at least nobody with access to truer narratives)

In WW2 the British realised the best way to use the German spies they captured in the UK and 'turned' (It was all of them) was to feed mainly real intelligence, albeit low level, through to the Germans wit the fake stuff mixed in.
 
Last edited:
In WW2 the British realised the best way to use the German spies they captured in the UK and 'turned' (It was all of them) was to feed mainly real intelligence, albeit low level, through to the Germans wit the fake stuff mixed in.

Operation Double Cross ?
 
The Russians are showing their weaknesses. The Ukrainians are literally blowing their tanks, jets and ships to bits and pieces. The Europeans and America are supplying them with weapons which are better than what the Russians have. Brazile gave them their state of the art tank that is as good or better than Americas Abrams tank. How greatly hath thou fallen oh Russia. Yes I can sense the groans around me. Sorry about that.

There are no tanks superior to the Abrams. There are (finally) peers to the Abrams, two of which are superior to the Abrams in a handful of specific areas.

Brazil doesn’t even produce a real tank…..certainly none that are peer to the Abrams/Leopard II/Black Panther/Challenger II.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom