The Roe Countdown

[shemp]

I suggest that this thread be closed and a new thread opened. There is no more countdown. Roe v. Wade has been overturned. The forces of evil have had their way, and there is certainly worse to come.

 

[JoeMorgue]

I suggest that this thread be closed and a new thread opened. There is no more countdown. Roe v. Wade has been overturned. The forces of evil have had their way, and there is certainly worse to come.

At this point just start a "Conservative Trolls dance on America's Grave" thread and get it over with.

 

[plague311]

Nov will be telling. If the GOP doesn't lose seat after seat in Nov we are in real trouble. If they do then Congress has a chance to pass a federal law protecting human rights.

They'd need to keep all of their Senate seats and pick up 10 more for it to pass through the entire legislature. I don't see that happening. I still don't see the Dems keeping the House. If something would cause a shift in that, this would be it though. I can't imagine a lot of independent standing women are going to be pleased by this outcome.

A lot of the Republicans want this on paper, as well as the overturn of Obergefell, but not that they've been the law of the land I don't think people will react very well to those rights being taken away. So I hope you're right, I hope this causes a large increase in Dem victories, but at this moment I have little faith in my fellow Americans. Less than ever before.

 

[JoeMorgue]

The Dems can control the House, Senate, Presidency, all the Major Houses of Westeros, the East and West Coast Rappers, all 5 New York Crime Families and it won't matter if there's a 6-3 Conservative Court.

They pass a Federal Law protecting abortion? SCOTUS will rule it Unconstitional.

 

[plague311]

How can you tell the difference?

It's pretty subtle, you have to really be paying attention. Here's a scale to help (I can't take credit). I've added a few levels not in the graph, but I'm granular like that.

 

[JoeMorgue]

I don't even have it in me to go back through this thread and call out all the trolls who were saying it was "dramatic" to think that Roe V Wade was going to be overturned.

 

[Dumb All Over]

I just voted 'Before 31 December 2022'. What do I win?

 

[Bob001]

Nov will be telling. If the GOP doesn't lose seat after seat in Nov we are in real trouble. If they do then Congress has a chance to pass a federal law protecting human rights.

Some commentators are noting that this SC could easily find grounds to overturn such a law.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Some commentators are noting that this SC could easily find grounds to overturn such a law.

Which is why we need to have this stuff explicitly and clearly spelled out in the Constitution. So we're not stuck with the whims of interpretation for centuries.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Some commentators are noting that this SC could easily find grounds to overturn such a law.

Yeah or just do it and not even pretend they have a reason, either way.

Assuming they don't jump straight to "Just install a Theocratic Dictator" and cut out all the extra steps they'll come after Birth Control next.

 

[plague311]

The Dems can control the House, Senate, Presidency, all the Major Houses of Westeros, the East and West Coast Rappers, all 5 New York Crime Families and it won't matter if there's a 6-3 Conservative Court.

They pass a Federal Law protecting abortion? SCOTUS will rule it Unconstitional.

Don't quote me on this, but I don't think they can. I don't know that SCOTUS has the power to overturn laws passed by the entirety of the legislature since they decide what is law.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Don't quote me on this, but I don't think they can. I don't know that SCOTUS has the power to overturn laws passed by the entirety of the legislature since they decide what is law.

I didn't say one word about what SCOTUS has the power to do, just what they will do.

Again we still have not gotten an answer to "Republicans have learned they can do whatever they want until someone stops them."

Congress passes a federal abortion protection law. SCOTUS declares it unconstitutional. The Democrats screech "But you can't do that!" What's the next step?

 

[crescent]

Two points:

1: I always thought that the right to privacy was a very thin twig from which to support reproductive rights. Legally, that is. It seemed like a stretch - reproductive rights should to be a legal right unto its own - on par with other rights clearly spelled out in the Constitution. But the Dems never seemed to push that very hard.

2: The Dems were also naïve to pin their SC questions on the issue of "settled law". The law is settled until it becomes unsettled, it seemed clear that potential justices were using the term to cop out from clearly stating whether or not they would vote against reproductive rights. In that sense, they didn't really perjure themselves, because nobody could ever pin them down hard on whether or not they would vote to overturn Roe v Wade.

"It is settled law" was just an excuse to avoid really answering the question, and the Dems let that slide. If a law is truly unconstitutional, then the SC can overturn it, "settled law" or not. The Dems knew that but pretended not to.

 

[plague311]

I didn't say one word about what SCOTUS has the power to do, just what they will do.

Again we still have not gotten an answer to "Republicans have learned they can do whatever they want until someone stops them."

Yes, I understand. It's all gloom and doom right now, but I'm saying I don't think there is a process to take a law passed through the entire legislature and have it debated in court. I don't think it's possible.

 

[Bob001]

Don't quote me on this, but I don't think they can. I don't know that SCOTUS has the power to overturn laws passed by the entirety of the legislature since they decide what is law.

But the court decides what is Constitutional. That is the basis on which they can throw out any particular law.

 

[plague311]

"It is settled law" was just an excuse to avoid really answering the question, and the Dems let that slide. If a law is truly unconstitutional, then the SC can overturn it, "settled law" or not. The Dems knew that but pretended not to.

I don't understand this, and admittedly I'm a bit of a dope on some legal things, but if protecting abortion rights passed through the House, Senate and White House, on what grounds could SCOTUS overturn it? It would be codified. Has this happened before and I don't know about it? Where they've actually taken a law that's passed through all houses and they've overturned it on Constitutional grounds? I'll plead ignorance.

But the court decides what is Constitutional. That is the basis on which they can throw out any particular law.

Yes, I see you guys saying this, I'm asking for some form of example. Nothing is coming to mind where all 3 branches of legislature passed something and then SCOTUS said "no, you can't do that".

 

[Brainster]

Don't quote me on this, but I don't think they can. I don't know that SCOTUS has the power to overturn laws passed by the entirety of the legislature since they decide what is law.

Marbury v. Madison.

 

[plague311]

Marbury v. Madison.

Is that comparable to this case? Reading through it, it sounds like it's more about a specific appointment than the law being overturned. Perhaps break it down better for me? Like I said, I don't understand all this stuff like you may. Pretend I'm a dumb ass, it shouldn't be hard.

 

[sarge]

Yes, I understand. It's all gloom and doom right now, but I'm saying I don't think there is a process to take a law passed through the entire legislature and have it debated in court. I don't think it's possible.

You don’t think it possible for the US Supreme Court to rule a law passed by both houses and signed by the President to be unconstitutional?

It is, unequivocally. It has been since Mayberry v Madison.

 

[JoeMorgue]

I don't understand this, and admittedly I'm a bit of a dope on some legal things, but if protecting abortion rights passed through the House, Senate and White House, on what grounds could SCOTUS overturn it?

"We say so."