The Jan. 6 Investigation

[Stacyhs]

I know. I started writing a new "I'm leaving" post but ****, I don't know if talking here helps with the stress or makes it worse! The news is bad, maybe that's the problem and I figure talking here with like minded people should help. Kind of a bad week for me though.

I know how you feel. If the Trumpers take over, I'd love to move but we're pretty much stuck here due to health care. Medicare and supplemental insurance does not cover you out of the US except for emergency/urgent care. My husband is a cancer patient and will be for the rest of his life so living outside of the US is not really an option for us.

 

[tyr_13]

I know. I started writing a new "I'm leaving" post but ****, I don't know if talking here helps with the stress or makes it worse! The news is bad, maybe that's the problem and I figure talking here with like minded people should help. Kind of a bad week for me though.

If it helps even though I was never right wing, your posts and frustrations are incredibly relatable. The trust I did have in thinking some of the differences in politics from the right were good faith disagreements has been shattered, leaving a new lower level of trust for me. Not just once over the last six or so years, but over and over again.

The betrayal of our nation, of our communities, so many in such unquestionable ways, still hurts, even if one saw it coming. You're not the crazy one. You're not the one failing basic civic duty. Yet you still feel like you are, because breaking things is so much easier than building them and the right wing has decided the breaking things is what gives them their identity.

It's tragic and it isn't your fault.

 

[Stacyhs]

If it helps even though I was never right wing, your posts and frustrations are incredibly relatable. The trust I did have in thinking some of the differences in politics from the right were good faith disagreements has been shattered, leaving a new lower level of trust for me. Not just once over the last six or so years, but over and over again. The betrayal of our nation, of our communities, so many in such unquestionable ways, still hurts, even if one saw it coming. You're not the crazy one. You're not the one failing basic civic duty. Yet you still feel like you are, because breaking things is so much easier than building them and the right wing has decided the breaking things is what gives them their identity.

It's tragic and it isn't your fault.

So true. Even though I disagreed with Republican philosophy in many ways, I did not think of Republicans in general as stupid, dishonest, or anti-democratic (small 'd'). After the last few years, I don't see how one can see them in any other way. Anyone who supports Trump or his bullcrap "rigged election" nonsense is an idiot , imo.

 

[Bob001]

I know how you feel. If the Trumpers take over, I'd love to move but we're pretty much stuck here due to health care. Medicare and supplemental insurance does not cover you out of the US except for emergency/urgent care. My husband is a cancer patient and will be for the rest of his life so living outside of the US is not really an option for us.

It's actually not all that easy for Americans to move to another country, at least one where they'd like to be. Many countries admit immigrants on the basis of a point system: so many for education, work experience, specialized skills, family connections, money, etc. I know people do it, but it takes a lot of planning and some luck.

 

[Aridas]

Seeing that a lot these days. Can't control the President, can't control SC, can't control insane congress people. How did this country survive this long?

There are... other, softer forms of control. Ones that work just fine on normal people and politicians, especially ones that actually do have a modicum of patriotism. They even work fine on abnormal people and politicians, for that matter, under normal circumstances.

Unfortunately, what we're dealing with now is pretty much the result of long term poisoning of the US by groups that are neither patriotic nor have any real interest in allowing good governance, just governance that serves them.

 

[Stacyhs]

It's actually not all that easy for Americans to move to another country, at least one where they'd like to be. Many countries admit immigrants on the basis of a point system: so many for education, work experience, specialized skills, family connections, money, etc. I know people do it, but it takes a lot of planning and some luck.

True, but there are Central American countries (Costa Rica, Belize) and Mexico that allow Americans to move there. Europe is definitely more difficult. Canada is difficult.

 

[Stacyhs]

No way do I believe the Ginni and Thomas do not discuss their work with each other.

The notion that Clarence Thomas is not aware of his wife’s work and does not generally share her culturally and politically revanchist beliefs — that his work can somehow be fully disentangled from the reality of his life — is extremely difficult to take seriously given the couple’s history and the record uncovered by journalists, regardless of what the two may claim or what Justice Thomas’s defenders may argue. (In fact, in a 2011 speech, Thomas himself said, “We are equally yoked, and we love being with each other because we love the same things. We believe in the same things.”)

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/202...he-conservative-rot-at-the-supreme-court.html

Ginni also supported and endorsed Ted Cruz for president in 2016. I didn't think it was possible for me to dislike her any more than I already did, but that revelation proved me wrong.

 

[Armitage72]

I'm currently reading a novel, written in 2008, in which terrorists abduct a child a week before Election Day and publicly announce "Vote the current President out of office or we will kill this child."
At one point, the President's Chief of Staff suggests that the terrorists attempting to subvert the election be classified as an act of war and the President then invoke the War Powers Act to set aside the result of the election if he loses.
I'm assuming that couldn't actually be done in the real world.

 

[BobTheCoward]

I'm currently reading a novel, written in 2008, in which terrorists abduct a child a week before Election Day and publicly announce "Vote the current President out of office or we will kill this child."
At one point, the President's Chief of Staff suggests that the terrorists attempting to subvert the election be classified as an act of war and the President then invoke the War Powers Act to set aside the result of the election if he loses.
I'm assuming that couldn't actually be done in the real world.

Not much of a threat. Normally people think the other guy winning will result in way more deaths than that.

 

[Stacyhs]

I'm currently reading a novel, written in 2008, in which terrorists abduct a child a week before Election Day and publicly announce "Vote the current President out of office or we will kill this child."
At one point, the President's Chief of Staff suggests that the terrorists attempting to subvert the election be classified as an act of war and the President then invoke the War Powers Act to set aside the result of the election if he loses.
I'm assuming that couldn't actually be done in the real world.

I can hear Sidney and Rudy whispering in Trump's ear now....."We've got an idea!"

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

I'm currently reading a novel, written in 2008, in which terrorists abduct a child a week before Election Day and publicly announce "Vote the current President out of office or we will kill this child."
At one point, the President's Chief of Staff suggests that the terrorists attempting to subvert the election be classified as an act of war and the President then invoke the War Powers Act to set aside the result of the election if he loses.
I'm assuming that couldn't actually be done in the real world.

Please let it be Eric.

 

[Stacyhs]

Please let it be Eric.

 

[DevilsAdvocate]

I'm currently reading a novel, written in 2008, in which terrorists abduct a child a week before Election Day and publicly announce "Vote the current President out of office or we will kill this child."
At one point, the President's Chief of Staff suggests that the terrorists attempting to subvert the election be classified as an act of war and the President then invoke the War Powers Act to set aside the result of the election if he loses.
I'm assuming that couldn't actually be done in the real world.

That could sort of work. That could be challenged in court. The court would probably rule that the War Powers Act does not apply but that the election is invalid. Many States would probably declare the election invalid and refuse to certify the election results or appoint any electors. The elections could also be challenged in State court, which would likely find the election invalid. Any appointed electors could be challenged in Congress during the counting of votes.

One way or another this would likely result in neither candidate getting the required electoral votes. It would then fall to the House of Representatives to determine the President and to the Senate to determine the Vice President. The honorable way to handle this would be for the Representatives to agree to not cast any votes until a free and fair election has been held and that they would then cast votes according to their State's election results. Senators would agree to vote for the Vice President that was running with the President chosen by the House.

The terms of the President and Vice President would expire on January 20. The Speaker of the House would become temporary acting President. Once the terrorist situation has been resolved and an election has been held, Congress selects the President and Vice President according to the election results.

 

[mgidm86]

If it helps even though I was never right wing, your posts and frustrations are incredibly relatable. The trust I did have in thinking some of the differences in politics from the right were good faith disagreements has been shattered, leaving a new lower level of trust for me. Not just once over the last six or so years, but over and over again.

The betrayal of our nation, of our communities, so many in such unquestionable ways, still hurts, even if one saw it coming. You're not the crazy one. You're not the one failing basic civic duty. Yet you still feel like you are, because breaking things is so much easier than building them and the right wing has decided the breaking things is what gives them their identity.

It's tragic and it isn't your fault.

As frustrated as I get here sometimes, I have nowhere else to discuss this with like-minded and intelligent people, save for one woman at work.

I know how hard it was for me to change the way I thought about this stuff, and that's what scares me. Most people don't debate their ideas or challenge their beliefs at all.

Hangin' in there. Thanks everyone.

 

[slyjoe]

As frustrated as I get here sometimes, I have nowhere else to discuss this with like-minded and intelligent people, save for one woman at work.

I know how hard it was for me to change the way I thought about this stuff, and that's what scares me. Most people don't debate their ideas or challenge their beliefs at all.

Hangin' in there. Thanks everyone.

You should be proud of the ability to self-reflect and adjust how you approach things. You have my respect.

 

[marting]

You don't need a DC statute. The federal statute will suffice:
18 U.S. Code § 1113 - Attempt to commit murder or manslaughter

That would clearly apply to the Capitol and its grounds. Which should be sufficient. But does that extend generally to the DC area? I'm not clear on that. I know it doesn't generally extend to the broader area of the States. However, there's also statutes where the victim is a US political person regardless of location.

 

[phiwum]

As frustrated as I get here sometimes, I have nowhere else to discuss this with like-minded and intelligent people, save for one woman at work.

I know how hard it was for me to change the way I thought about this stuff, and that's what scares me. Most people don't debate their ideas or challenge their beliefs at all.

Hangin' in there. Thanks everyone.

I haven't quite been following your discussion, but as I understand it, you're a conservative at heart who's feeling a bit adrift.

I'm not a conservative, always have considered myself a bit moderate, in the sense that I lean conservative on some issues and liberal on others. But even from my perspective, the changes in the Republican party for the past several decades are distressing. They are just not behaving as decent, intelligent folk.

I saw Rob Portman in an interview yesterday. He's retiring from the Senate this year. Man, I'll miss him. Not only did I agree with most of what he said, it was just a breath of fresh air to hear a Republican fairly and intelligently criticize the President. When I disagree with him, at least I hear an argument and not bluster and spittle.

 

[Stacyhs]

It looks like the J6C wants to interview Ginni "extremist right wing activist" Thomas. As well they should.

 

[Stacyhs]

Finally. It's about time.

Jan. 6 panel votes to advance contempt proceedings for Navarro, Scavino

The contempt report against Dan Scavino, Trump’s former deputy chief of staff for communications, and Peter Navarro, a former trade adviser, will now move to the full House, which must take up for consideration the third and fourth censure of former Trump officials who have defied the committee.

Scavino was subpoenaed by the committee given his proximity to Trump on the day of the riot as well as his efforts promoting the pro-Trump rally that day and his reported participation in multiple conversations about challenging the election.

Navarro was sought after wading into multiple efforts to promote baseless claims of election fraud in the 2020 contest, including working with former White House strategist Stephen Bannon to delay Congress’s certification of the results.

Neither showed for their deposition, nor have they provided a single document to the committee.

 

[Aridas]

White House call logs show a mysterious seven-hour gap in Trump's calls on Jan. 6

After a legal battle, the House select committee investigating Jan. 6 got official White House call records from that day—only to find a more than seven-hour gap in records of Donald Trump’s phone calls. There are no calls shown for Trump from 11:17 AM to 6:54 PM as a mob of his supporters violently attacked the U.S. Capitol in an attempt to block the certification of President Joe Biden’s 2020 win.

That doesn’t mean that Trump stayed off the phone during the attack. It means he was making calls from who knows what other phones—something a president is not supposed to do, for security reasons as well as national records ones—during those crucial hours. It has already been widely reported that during the attack on the Capitol, Trump called Sen. Mike Lee (looking for Sen. Tommy Tuberville) and spoke with House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy. And in the hours immediately before and after the attack, he was frequently on the phone, according to official records.

The documents provided include the president’s daily diary and a White House call log, with neither showing Trump having made or taken calls during that time. The daily diary is supposed to be a “chronological record of the President’s movements, phone calls, trips.”

Nixon had a missing 18 minutes, eh? Trump, more than 7 and a half hours.