The supernatural

[heydarian saeed]

I personally find the Necronomicon more complete. And it distorts reality, so it's clearly better than the Qur'an.

Hi
Necronomicon is an interesting conference and festival. And various works of art are presented in it. Your speech in this message gave us a new perspective. And you have to look at it and think about it. I would like to participate in this festival. Of course, I do not know how to participate in this festival. Unless you help. Thanks a lot

The Quran is a religious book. Of course, it was revealed to Muhammad by God in the seventh century. To tell for humans. The needs of human beings are mainly discussed in this book.
In the Qur'an, God has spoken of everything that man needs for progress. One of the contents of stories and art. Which is in the Quran. Of course, the contents and stories of the Qur'an refer only to key and important points. And it does not say completely. Most of the Qur'anic contents are discussed in the same way. It is just pointing and summarizing. The Qur'an is not a scientific or artistic encyclopedia. Rather, it motivates human beings.
God's purpose of speaking is to motivate man to seek and discover the whole thing himself. As you know, this is a good attitude in human management. The main purpose of the Qur'an is to bring man to understand the meaning of existence. Man is always in search of the meaning of existence in the world. At present, the vacuum of the meaning of existence is a great challenge for human beings. The Qur'an helps man to understand the meaning of existence. And fill his existential void.
We are waiting for your beautiful content. Good luck

 

[MarkCorrigan]

The Quran is a religious book. Of course, it was revealed to Muhammad by God in the seventh century.

Assertion without evidence.

To tell for humans. The needs of human beings are mainly discussed in this book.

Untrue assertion, the Quran is mostly a self insert fanfiction retelling of the equally awful Bible.

In the Qur'an, God has spoken of everything that man needs for progress.

Assertion contrary to evidence. The Quran teaches many things that are simply not true.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Rubbish, the Quran is a half remembered copy of the bible stories. See the story of Joseph in surah 12 as an example.



Having compared the bible story of Joseph in the bibles Genesis with the Quran, I can just about follow the story as described in surah 12. But as far as I can see, anyone who did not know the Genesis story could not possibly make sense of the tale of Joseph, as told in the Quran.

In the bible books of Genesis from chapter thirty seven to chapter fifty. the entire fourteen chapters are about Joseph. There are four hundred and fifty verses about the story in the bible, but in the quran surah 12 there are only one hundred and eleven verses.

The quranic version of the bible story of Joseph is a mumbling, incoherent, ill considered, and inaccurate muddle, and it does not even tell you who Joseph is. It just launches into Josephs dream at verse 4, after three verses that attempt to explain the story is being revealed in Arabic, presumably to make it available to Arabs.

The entire surah is peppered with completely unnecessary references to Allah which clutter the narrative, if you can call it a narrative. Because the bible story is clear and lucid, and rich in detail, and it has a comprehensible flow to it.


Sura 12.4 launches into a description of Josephs dream, with no explanation of who he is or how many brothers he has. What is more the dream described is the second of two dreams that are told in Genesis. But the entire point of the dream is that the eleven stars bowing down to Joseph are his eleven brothers. Genesis explains Josephs family tree so you can realize this, but the Quran says nothing about the matter. The Genesis story also says that Jacob made a coat of many colours for Joseph, and that is why his brothers were jealous of him, but the quran gives no reason or motives for Josephs brothers to hate him. Nor does it explain that Joseph has one other brother named Benjamin who had the same mother as himself, but the other ten brothers are step brothers. Nor does surah 12 explain this issue at any time, including when Joseph sends for him from Egypt.

So when Josephs brothers state at surah 12.8 When they said:" Verily Joseph and his brother are dearer to our father than we are, many though we be. Lo! our father is in plain aberration":
This makes absolutely no sense whatever to anyone that has not read the full account in Genesis.

Later in the story Joseph is put in power in Egypt, but sura 12 says nothing about him filling the granaries for seven years, it simply changes the subject to when his brothers amble into Egypt to trade, (sura 12.58) and it does not explain they are there because it is now during the seven years of famine. Then Joseph ask his brothers to send for a brother of who is a son of their father, this again makes no sense without an explanation of the family background.

How much more obvious can it be that the Quran is plagiarism, and it was taken from the Bible and other earlier sources. It is clear to me that Muhammad had Genesis read to him and surah 12 is his half remembered rehash of the story of Joseph.

Your words are not an interpretation or meaning of the Qur'an. You only introduce yourself. Is this your logo? I am sorry.
Sometimes I have to remind you of a point. Although it may not affect you. I say it again. .. Dealing with the details of the story is a great way to distort it. This is why the Qur'an is always general. And does not go into details. He left the details to humans. To discover. Of course, the Bible is not like that. Therefore, the way to distort it is open. Please understand.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Agreed, absolutely. Scorpion's worldview is in many ways entirely as indefensible as heydarian's.

-----

However, what Scorpion's doing, in these recent posts, isn't --- as far as I can make out --- claiming his own superstitions are right and therefore, and in as much heydarian's superstitions differ from his own, therefore those are wrong. (That is, while he may indeed think and believe that; but that isn't what he's arguing.)

What he's trying to show --- and doing that successfully, by and large --- is how, historically speaking, logically speaking, the crap that is in the Quran is basically derived from the crap that is in the Bible, and how the former is a garbled version of the latter, but without a doubt derived from the latter. What I think he's trying to show is that the Quran isn't an original fairy tale, but in fact directly derived from the Bible. (Much as many things in the Bible are derived from other, older fairy tales --- but of course, that's a separate discussion, and Scorpion doesn't touch on that.)

I think he's actually doing a good job, with that patiently and painstakingly curated stream of scriptural quotes, in showing exactly that: that the Quran is not an orignal document; that it is derived directly from the Bible; and that it is a garbled version of the Bible; and that therefore it is clearly the work of less than fully knowledgeable and literate folks who were basically plagiarizing and building on and contorting to suit their own ends, what they'd heard and read in the Bible and other Christian sources.

Hi
You are more likely to look at content more realistically. And talk. But unfortunately, you talk more about speculation. In our approach, speculation has no place. Please be reasonable.

 

[IanS]

The Quran is a religious book. Of course, it was revealed to Muhammad by God in the seventh century. To tell for humans. The needs of human beings are mainly discussed in this book.
In the Qur'an, God has spoken of everything that man needs for progress. One of the contents of stories and art. Which is in the Quran. Of course, the contents and stories of the Qur'an refer only to key and important points. And it does not say completely. Most of the Qur'anic contents are discussed in the same way. It is just pointing and summarizing. The Qur'an is not a scientific or artistic encyclopedia. Rather, it motivates human beings.
God's purpose of speaking is to motivate man to seek and discover the whole thing himself. As you know, this is a good attitude in human management. The main purpose of the Qur'an is to bring man to understand the meaning of existence. Man is always in search of the meaning of existence in the world. At present, the vacuum of the meaning of existence is a great challenge for human beings. The Qur'an helps man to understand the meaning of existence. And fill his existential void.
We are waiting for your beautiful content. Good luck

More religious claims, but still zero evidence from you.

And ... science research is NOT published in "encyclopedias".

And ... science has long ago shown that there is no "meaning" in "existence" ... the idea of finding "meaning" is a religious idea that comes entirely from the pre-conceived belief in supernatural creation ... the universe has no "meaning" ... the existence of homo Sapiens has no meaning ... the existence of Earth and our solar system has no meaning ...

Those things all have an "explanation", which has been discovered by modern science (not discovered by any religion or any philosophy). Ie science can, and it has, explained how & why all those things exist ... you might not like some of the scientific explanations, because all of them contradict your religious faith-beliefs ...

... some of those explanations from science might also be foolishly dismissed by you and other theists because those particular aspects of the universe only have tentative explanations which need a lot more research before we can have high confidence that the explanation is correct ... but that is of course a disingenuous and ignorant claim from theists, because they really ought to know that scientific Theories are not discovered and explained "in a day" ... most scientific discoveries have taken decades of research if not several centuries of gradual progress ...

... and that is especially true for things that took place billions of years ago, such as the Big Bang or Abiogenesis ... it's not easy to make scientifically accurate studies of things that happened 3 billion or 13 billion years ago! But even so, we have now learned a vast amount about such things like the Big Bang and Abiogenesis, and we do have reasonably detailed explanations for both of those things ... but what you and other theists fail to understand, is that such detailed explanations are not good enough in real science ... in science the level of explanations we have for those things, is so far only tentative and described in several possible different models ...

... even so, those models for things like the Big bang and abiogenesis are vastly more detailed and vastly more accurate than any claimed explanation from religion or philosophy (or any other approach). So it's a huge mistake, and actually an uneducated mistake, simply to say that science still has no explanation for such things.

 

[heydarian saeed]

Assertion without evidence.

Untrue assertion, the Quran is mostly a self insert fanfiction retelling of the equally awful Bible.


Assertion contrary to evidence. The Quran teaches many things that are simply not true.

Hi
The Qur'an is an authoritative religious historical book. To the research of the University of Mirbungham in the United Kingdom, which I mentioned in previous messages. See. Do you not accept the prestigious university of your country? I am sorry.

 

[Pixel42]

Please understand.

Please be reasonable.

The only one refusing to understand or be reasonable here is you, heydarian.

 

[Pixel42]

Hi
The Qur'an is an authoritative religious historical book. To the research of the University of Mirbungham in the United Kingdom, which I mentioned in previous messages. See. Do you not accept the prestigious university of your country? I am sorry.

There is no University of Mirbungham in the UK. Or anywhere else. In fact, there's no such place as Mirbungham.

 

[MRC_Hans]

Hi
The Qur'an is an authoritative religious historical book. To the research of the University of Mirbungham in the United Kingdom, which I mentioned in previous messages. See. Do you not accept the prestigious university of your country? I am sorry.

As already mentioned no such place exists.

Heydarian saeed, this is a skeptical forum. People are likely to check such things. For your own sake avoid that sort of fails. It makes you look silly. If you want to refer to a piece of research, find the link to the actual report (it's not difficult) and post it. Then we can talk about it.

Hans

 

[JoeMorgue]

Hi
The Qur'an is an authoritative religious historical book. To the research of the University of Mirbungham in the United Kingdom, which I mentioned in previous messages. See. Do you not accept the prestigious university of your country? I am sorry.

Miskatonic University in Arkham Massachusetts said the exact same thing about the Necronomicon.

I gotta say as far as dishonesty goes "Appeal to an Authority" that doesn't exist is certainly up there.

 

[MarkCorrigan]

Hi
The Qur'an is an authoritative religious historical book. To the research of the University of Mirbungham in the United Kingdom, which I mentioned in previous messages. See. Do you not accept the prestigious university of your country? I am sorry.

That isn't a real place. Do you mean the University of Birmingham?

Please link us to where the University, whichever one you mean, has stated that the Quran is authoritative on anything except itself.

The Quran is really just awfully written gibberish. I can see why you like it so much.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

Hi
Necronomicon is an interesting conference and festival. And various works of art are presented in it. Your speech in this message gave us a new perspective. And you have to look at it and think about it. I would like to participate in this festival. Of course, I do not know how to participate in this festival. Unless you help. Thanks a lot

The Necronomicon is a festival!

 

[junkshop]

The Necronomicon is a festival!

It seems he googled NecronomiCon, rather than Necronomicon.

 

[Chanakya]

...The Quran is really just awfully written gibberish. I can see why you like it so much.

LOL!

 

[Scorpion]

Hi
Necronomicon is an interesting conference and festival. And various works of art are presented in it. Your speech in this message gave us a new perspective. And you have to look at it and think about it. I would like to participate in this festival. Of course, I do not know how to participate in this festival. Unless you help. Thanks a lot

The Quran is a religious book. Of course, it was revealed to Muhammad by God in the seventh century. To tell for humans. The needs of human beings are mainly discussed in this book.
In the Qur'an, God has spoken of everything that man needs for progress. One of the contents of stories and art. Which is in the Quran. Of course, the contents and stories of the Qur'an refer only to key and important points. And it does not say completely. Most of the Qur'anic contents are discussed in the same way. It is just pointing and summarizing. The Qur'an is not a scientific or artistic encyclopedia. Rather, it motivates human beings. God's purpose of speaking is to motivate man to seek and discover the whole thing himself. As you know, this is a good attitude in human management. The main purpose of the Qur'an is to bring man to understand the meaning of existence. Man is always in search of the meaning of existence in the world. At present, the vacuum of the meaning of existence is a great challenge for human beings. The Qur'an helps man to understand the meaning of existence. And fill his existential void.
We are waiting for your beautiful content. Good luck

In other words the Quran does not explain anything clearly, and we have to work things out for ourselves.

Your conclusion on reading this mumbling drivel is that it is a message from God.
My conclusion is that it is all lies made up by Muhammad to enslave peoples minds.

 

[abaddon]

Hi
Necronomicon is an interesting conference and festival. And various works of art are presented in it. Your speech in this message gave us a new perspective. And you have to look at it and think about it. I would like to participate in this festival. Of course, I do not know how to participate in this festival. Unless you help. Thanks a lot

Nope. The necronomicon is a holy book just like your holy book.

The Quran is a religious book.

just the same as the Necronominicon.

Of course, it was revealed to Muhammad by God in the seventh century. To tell for humans. The needs of human beings are mainly discussed in this book.

Any evidence for this wild claim? No?

In the Qur'an, God has spoken of everything that man needs for progress. One of the contents of stories and art. Which is in the Quran. Of course, the contents and stories of the Qur'an refer only to key and important points. And it does not say completely. Most of the Qur'anic contents are discussed in the same way. It is just pointing and summarizing. The Qur'an is not a scientific or artistic encyclopedia. Rather, it motivates human beings.

Cool. where does the koran describe the Higg's boson. Chapter and verse please.

God's purpose of speaking is to motivate man to seek and discover the whole thing himself. As you know, this is a good attitude in human management. The main purpose of the Qur'an is to bring man to understand the meaning of existence. Man is always in search of the meaning of existence in the world. At present, the vacuum of the meaning of existence is a great challenge for human beings. The Qur'an helps man to understand the meaning of existence. And fill his existential void.

But I need no god for any of that. Why would anyone need a god for that?

We are waiting for your beautiful content. Good luck

"We"? Are more than one person operating your user account?

 

[Cosmic Yak]

It seems he googled NecronomiCon, rather than Necronomicon.

I can just see heydarian there, eagerly and endlessly explaining that the Qur'an has verses in which it, too, states that in his house at dead R'yleh dead Cthulhu waits dreaming, thus proving that the Qur'an is as miraculous as the Necronomicon.
As it turns out, some of the descriptive passages in which Lovecraft depicts the Elder Gods are not dissimilar to heydarian's endless paragraphs- except that they are fiction, of course, and also much better written.

It was an All-in-One and One-in-All of limitless being and self—not merely a thing of one Space-Time continuum, but allied to the ultimate animating essence of existence's whole unbounded sweep—the last, utter sweep which has no confines and which outreaches fancy and mathematics alike. It was perhaps that which certain secret cults of earth have whispered of as YOG-SOTHOTH, and which has been a deity under other names; that which the crustaceans of Yuggoth worship as the Beyond-One, and which the vaporous brains of the spiral nebulae know by an untranslatable Sign

(From Through the Gates of the Silver Key).

 

[heydarian saeed]

I closed my eyes so that I could no longer see her drunken eyes. Suddenly my heart cried out: Crazy, I see her.
.
.
.
Let our minds get some fresh air ...

 

[heydarian saeed]

There is no University of Mirbungham in the UK. Or anywhere else. In fact, there's no such place as Mirbungham.

Hello
This was exactly a typo. Modified: The University of Birmingham, England - Message 2932

 

[heydarian saeed]

The only one refusing to understand or be reasonable here is you, heydarian.

No. Dear Pixel; My logic is different from yours. Please understand this difference. The distance between us and you is the difference of logic with each other. We understand your logic. Please understand our logic too.
Thank you