The Jan. 6 Investigation

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Warp12 said:
Yes, of course, 40% of the country is "stupid". Whereas the "smart" people just tank elections in historic fashion...like 2016. We can thank the "smart" Dems for that occurrence. They snatched defeat from the jaws of victory...amazingly.

When they complain about the rise of Trump, I just laugh. They allowed it to happen, and are trying to let it happen again.
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It has nothing to do with stupidity. But it does have to do with epistemology. 70 percent of the population believes in crazy superstitions, but it isn't stupidity that makes them believe in those either.
 
It's indoctrination, not stupidity, that makes voters stick with Republicans against the evidence of their senses and their own best interests.
 
I still say they're stupid. Watch this and tell me otherwise. Interviews with Trump rally attendees in Texas:

 
bruto said:
All they have to do is sell out and become Republicans and they'd show those damned Republicans who's boss.
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If Biden had won the election none of this would have happened.
 
Stacyhs said:
I still say they're stupid. Watch this and tell me otherwise. Interviews with Trump rally attendees in Texas:

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I'm not saying some of these people aren't stupid. They are. But I know some liberals that are stupid too.
 
acbytesla said:
I'm not saying some of these people aren't stupid. They are. But I know some liberals that are stupid too.
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No doubt. But do we see them gathering in huge numbers to blindly support a mentally ill POS who is doing his damnedest to destroy our election integrity?
 
The Great Zaganza said:
It's indoctrination, not stupidity, that makes voters stick with Republicans against the evidence of their senses and their own best interests.
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At the risk of invoking Godwin, this kind of indoctrination is very much like what happened in the 1930s Weimar Republic.

Much of the German population of the Weimar Republic were predisposed to dislike and distrust Jews and communists. The Nazis used that predisposition, and enlarged and exaggerated it into all out hatred. They used small groups of like-minded loyalists to get that message across in a propaganda campaign, including using Goebbels' "Big Lie" to stir up the passions of the non-communist, non-Jewish German people. Most of them thought that everything would be better, and that the Nazis would Make Germany Great Again once those pesky Jews, Gypsies and Commies were removed, so they sleepwalked their way into a oppressive right-wing dictatorship, by actually voting them into power, not realizing that once the Jews and Commies were dealt with, they too would also lose a huge number of their own freedoms. Rather than throwing off the shackles of government control (which was what they expected) they, in effect, invited the government in to control every aspect of their lives.

In modern day America, much of the American populace are predisposed to dislike and distrust Blacks, Asians and Hispanics (especially Mexicans) and people with socialist ideas (whom they incorrectly and ignorantly tag as "communists"). Trumpists have used that predisposition, and turned it into hatred. They have used small groups loyalists such at Oath Keepers, Proud Boys, Three Percenters and other neo-Nazi and neo-fascist groups to get that message across in a propaganda campaign, using Trump's "Big Lie" about the 2020 election to stir up the passions of White Americans. Like those citizens of the Weimar Republic in the 1930s, they think Trump will Make America Great Again once he has gotten rid of all those pesky Blacks, Asians, Mexicans and other assorted Mud people. America is sleepwalking along the path to a right-wing dictatorship, not realizing that once that happens, there is no going back. Freedom and Democracy is a hard-won thing, but it is also fragile, and it can be lost in a heartbeat.

Now I acknowledge the parallels are not exact - there are some significant differences, but there are things which look similar enough to convince America is at least in real danger of sliding into a right-wing dictatorship, perhaps within as little as 10 years if Trump, or someone like him, ever gets into power again. These people have zero respect for the Constitution, and are 100% willing to break any number of laws to get what they want. America was lucky this time - Trump didn't have ALL the strategic posts filled with absolute loyalists, so there were enough people who would no go along with his scheme. Trumpists have all seen what they did wrong, and what didn't work this time - they will not make those same mistakes again. Next time, they will dismantle all the guard rails and blocks that prevented them from succeeding, and they will have loyalists in all the key positions in the Administration: the Cabinet, the Pentagon, the Military, the DoJ, Homeland Security, the CIA, the NSA and FBI well before the following election. If Trump, a Trump loyalist or someone like them wins the 2024 election, then if there is a 2028 Presidential election (which not guaranteed) and they somehow lose, they will overturn it and keep their President in power.
 
A better analogy might be the Third French Republic and the way the Dreyfuss affair was politicized.
Lawfare had a very interesting podcast about it.
 
smartcooky said:
At the risk of invoking Godwin, this kind of indoctrination is very much like what happened in the 1930s Weimar Republic.

Much of the German population of the Weimar Republic were predisposed to dislike and distrust Jews and communists. The Nazis used that predisposition, and enlarged and exaggerated it into all out hatred. They used small groups of like-minded loyalists to get that message across in a propaganda campaign, including using Goebbels' "Big Lie" to stir up the passions of the non-communist, non-Jewish German people. Most of them thought that everything would be better, and that the Nazis would Make Germany Great Again once those pesky Jews, Gypsies and Commies were removed, so they sleepwalked their way into a oppressive right-wing dictatorship, by actually voting them into power, not realizing that once the Jews and Commies were dealt with, they too would also lose a huge number of their own freedoms. Rather than throwing off the shackles of government control (which was what they expected) they, in effect, invited the government in to control every aspect of their lives.

In modern day America, much of the American populace are predisposed to dislike and distrust Blacks, Asians and Hispanics (especially Mexicans) and people with socialist ideas (whom they incorrectly and ignorantly tag as "communists"). Trumpists have used that predisposition, and turned it into hatred. They have used small groups loyalists such at Oath Keepers, Proud Boys, Three Percenters and other neo-Nazi and neo-fascist groups to get that message across in a propaganda campaign, using Trump's "Big Lie" about the 2020 election to stir up the passions of White Americans. Like those citizens of the Weimar Republic in the 1930s, they think Trump will Make America Great Again once he has gotten rid of all those pesky Blacks, Asians, Mexicans and other assorted Mud people. America is sleepwalking along the path to a right-wing dictatorship, not realizing that once that happens, there is no going back. Freedom and Democracy is a hard-won thing, but it is also fragile, and it can be lost in a heartbeat.

Now I acknowledge the parallels are not exact - there are some significant differences, but there are things which look similar enough to convince America is at least in real danger of sliding into a right-wing dictatorship, perhaps within as little as 10 years if Trump, or someone like him, ever gets into power again. These people have zero respect for the Constitution, and are 100% willing to break any number of laws to get what they want. America was lucky this time - Trump didn't have ALL the strategic posts filled with absolute loyalists, so there were enough people who would no go along with his scheme. Trumpists have all seen what they did wrong, and what didn't work this time - they will not make those same mistakes again. Next time, they will dismantle all the guard rails and blocks that prevented them from succeeding, and they will have loyalists in all the key positions in the Administration: the Cabinet, the Pentagon, the Military, the DoJ, Homeland Security, the CIA, the NSA and FBI well before the following election. If Trump, a Trump loyalist or someone like them wins the 2024 election, then if there is a 2028 Presidential election (which not guaranteed) and they somehow lose, they will overturn it and keep their President in power.
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:thumbsup:

This is a wordier articulation of the way today's events harken me back to the dread I experienced when first reading the "Rise" portion of The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich back in my early 20s. Almost no one is alive today who experienced those momentous and ructious times, and so history is well primed to rhyme. It would seem that any period of comparative peace is destined to be curtailed in an endlessly repetitive cycle of strife. It's only a question of whether that interval should be one generation, or two or three.
 
smartcooky said:
At the risk of invoking Godwin, this kind of indoctrination is very much like what happened in the 1930s Weimar Republic.

Much of the German population of the Weimar Republic were predisposed to dislike and distrust Jews and communists. The Nazis used that predisposition, and enlarged and exaggerated it into all out hatred. They used small groups of like-minded loyalists to get that message across in a propaganda campaign, including using Goebbels' "Big Lie" to stir up the passions of the non-communist, non-Jewish German people. Most of them thought that everything would be better, and that the Nazis would Make Germany Great Again once those pesky Jews, Gypsies and Commies were removed, so they sleepwalked their way into a oppressive right-wing dictatorship, by actually voting them into power, not realizing that once the Jews and Commies were dealt with, they too would also lose a huge number of their own freedoms. Rather than throwing off the shackles of government control (which was what they expected) they, in effect, invited the government in to control every aspect of their lives.

In modern day America, much of the American populace are predisposed to dislike and distrust Blacks, Asians and Hispanics (especially Mexicans) and people with socialist ideas (whom they incorrectly and ignorantly tag as "communists"). Trumpists have used that predisposition, and turned it into hatred. They have used small groups loyalists such at Oath Keepers, Proud Boys, Three Percenters and other neo-Nazi and neo-fascist groups to get that message across in a propaganda campaign, using Trump's "Big Lie" about the 2020 election to stir up the passions of White Americans. Like those citizens of the Weimar Republic in the 1930s, they think Trump will Make America Great Again once he has gotten rid of all those pesky Blacks, Asians, Mexicans and other assorted Mud people. America is sleepwalking along the path to a right-wing dictatorship, not realizing that once that happens, there is no going back. Freedom and Democracy is a hard-won thing, but it is also fragile, and it can be lost in a heartbeat.

Now I acknowledge the parallels are not exact - there are some significant differences, but there are things which look similar enough to convince America is at least in real danger of sliding into a right-wing dictatorship, perhaps within as little as 10 years if Trump, or someone like him, ever gets into power again. These people have zero respect for the Constitution, and are 100% willing to break any number of laws to get what they want. America was lucky this time - Trump didn't have ALL the strategic posts filled with absolute loyalists, so there were enough people who would no go along with his scheme. Trumpists have all seen what they did wrong, and what didn't work this time - they will not make those same mistakes again. Next time, they will dismantle all the guard rails and blocks that prevented them from succeeding, and they will have loyalists in all the key positions in the Administration: the Cabinet, the Pentagon, the Military, the DoJ, Homeland Security, the CIA, the NSA and FBI well before the following election. If Trump, a Trump loyalist or someone like them wins the 2024 election, then if there is a 2028 Presidential election (which not guaranteed) and they somehow lose, they will overturn it and keep their President in power.
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:thumbsup: This is very much how I see the current situation here in the good old USA. I am a veteran and I am slack-jawed every time a veteran is interviewed who supports Trump. Vigilance, calling out the lies at every opportunity, and getting out the vote seem to be the tools we have to attempt to avoid a furtherance of the right's takeover of American politics. The Dems need to be working on voter enrollment as hard as they did for Obama and Biden starting now. Then when the time comes, get out the vote campaigns. The Dems outnumber the Repubs, reach out to like minded Independents and the Repubs will be defeated. But watch out for violence after the election if Trump keeps up his march to madness.

Just my 2 cents.
 
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