The supernatural

[heydarian saeed]

Such as? Please give references.

Thank you for your attention to Quranic content. New topics that are still unknown. Teleportation and the presence of wormholes. I have said before about teleportation that Hawking Master Roger Penrose has proved it. Currently, one of the most important topics is being studied by scientists. 4 verses of the Qur'an raise this issue. Two verses for animal teleport - one verse for inanimate teleport - one verse for human teleport. Address of verses: 17/1 - 2 / 259-2 / 260 - 27/40 and there are several verses for wormholes. But the most important verses are related to the process of revelation to the Prophet. Let me tell you about time. Which introduced the teleport of 2 animals in the time of Abraham, which occurred almost 26 centuries ago. And the teleport was a non-living object (Queen Belqis's throne) in the time of Solomon. And the human teleport was related to the Prophet of Islam, Muhammad, in the seventh century. He said all these important scientific things to people who had no science. And have been ignorant. Why? Because we understand and discover in the 20th century. And follow in modern scientific circles.
In Surah 53, verse 1, God swears by the time of the destruction or fall of the star. The message of this oath refers to the wormhole.
You know for a fact that when a star is destroyed, it falls from the wormhole channel into the black hole. This has recently been proven by astronomers. Immediately after this verse God explains in the next 6 verses. That: The Holy Spirit has a power that can move between the material world and the unseen. And he conveys the revelation to the Prophet through this (wormhole channel).
God has an important purpose for His oaths in the Qur'an. When he wants to point to a very important subject and unveil a scientific unknown subject. He takes an oath first. Quranic oaths often have the same purpose. Just like swearing at the birth of a star that wants to say white hole. More interestingly, he says immediately after this oath: If you had knowledge, this oath would be very great. In fact, you want to discover this science. Now look at what he said 1400 years ago to people who had no science!
Why did he tell such an important scientific matter to the ignorant people in the seventh century? Because we are advanced humans in the 20th century. And we have modern science to discover and understand this important scientific matter. We have many examples of these verses in the Qur'an.
God gives great importance to science. And he loves scientists very much. Paradise is for scientists and benefactors. Be sure.

 

[heydarian saeed]

So, you're just down to making it up as you go along.

Again, a true god would not *need* your interpretation to make things clear, it could do so itself. Any god that needs a prophet and books to convince others is not a god.
And you keep glossing over the fact that if evolution were directed by a god, that god is a total incompetent at best and malicious at worst. Any cursory glance at the genetic makeup of life shows things that could be designed better.

Hi
Recognize whether there is a need for prophets and the Bible. Not with us. This is the recognition of God, the Wise, the mighty. There are issues that only God recognizes. If we could recognize that we were God !!! And this is ridiculous. But you said that the genetic structure shows that it is even better. We do not deny this. In fact, it says that the life cycle is purposeful. That evolution has a purpose. That is, the path of evolution is still open. And is not closed. We believe in this. In fact, all of these hypotheses are about the purpose of the universe.

 

[heydarian saeed]

How do ants speak Hebrew? Third or fourth time asking.

This is not an ordinary science. It is a special kind of knowledge that God has given only to the prophets. All the prophets had this knowledge from God. The language of the ants that Solomon had was the same kind of divine knowledge. It is not experimental science. Experimental science only says: the frequency of ant sounds is above 20,000 Hz. It is the loudest and biggest sound in the world. Which has an ant.! (Of course, it is not loud, but its frequency is extremely high) so man can not hear it at all. Unless it is with a special device. On the other hand, I do not know his language. Do you know that the language of the ant was Hebrew !! Perhaps because the language of Solomon's time was Hebrew, you have such an understanding. I do not know.
This is just my understanding and knowledge to answer your question. I do not know more than this. If you know more, I'm glad to learn from you. Thanks

 

[heydarian saeed]

That is total and utter bunk. The bible says the creation took six days and that one of God days is a thousand years, so the bible says creation took six thousand years and the Quran exactly repeats this myth. because the Quran is largely plagiarism from the bible.

This citation is simple and worthless. Please speak with valid documents. And bring the address of your valid document. Please be reasonable. Your understanding of this issue is by no means a valid document. Please speak with a valid document. I have told you this many times. You repeat again. Sorry for you.

 

[IanS]

Hello
Darwin's efforts are commendable. And we do not deny it. But he has proposed only a part of the process of evolution related to living beings and human beings. And has been studied since about 460 million years ago. While for the creation of life on Earth, this process requires nuclear and chemical evolution.

And this process has started from the beginning of the expansion of the universe. The 6 days of God's creation mean six evolutionary periods that lasted approximately 14 billion years. This has been proven by science. Science proves all scientific content in the Qur'an. And many unknowns have not yet reached science. But it is mentioned in the Qur'an. To be motivated to find it by humans. We fully understand what you mean. We are aware of all your discussions. Reality and truth are not hidden from us. Be sure.

No, That is not what is meant by "Evolution".

Sub-atomic nuclear fields do not "evolve" as a "survival of their fittest". And neither do chemical reactions. That is not what is properly meant by "Evolution". The Big Bang is not "Evolution". The collapse of stars is not "Evolution". The expansion of steam from boiling water is not "Evolution" ... the explosion of an atomic bomb is not "evolution"!

Evolution is what Darwin described for the way that living species adapt to their surroundings in a way that produces new & more useful traits such as an increase in height, a longer beak, a different skin colour etc. That is what is really meant by "Evolution".

And none of that is mentioned in the Quran. That's yet another outright lie from you. Neither "evolution" of living species, or any 14 billion year-old Big Bang production of the universe is mentioned anywhere in the Quran ... that claim is an outright whopping lie ...

... you need to produce genuine independent science research papers which support your claim that from the 7th century the Quran had described Darwins evolution of species & the Big Bang ... where are the papers? ...

... just produce the papers, where are they?

... there should be tens of thousands of such papers, so just produce proper references to/from (say) half a dozen of them here ... where are they?

... they are your only way of showing any truth to your claims ... produce the papers.

You are making scientific claims here. That means you most certainly do need to produce all the genuine independent real scientific papers that are claiming to show that God told Mohamed about evolution and universe formation in 600AD ...

... that IS THE BOTTOM LINE & the END OF THE ROAD HERE ... do you have these real papers with the real science, or not?

 

[IanS]

I have said before about teleportation that Hawking Master Roger Penrose has proved it. Currently, one of the most important topics is being studied by scientists. 4 verses of the Qur'an raise this issue. Two verses for animal teleport - one verse for inanimate teleport - one verse for human teleport. Address of verses: 17/1 - 2 / 259-2 / 260 - 27/40 and there are several verses for wormholes.

Where are these papers from Hawking or Penrose?

Please produce actual published papers from them where they claim to show that God has produced teleportation of animals and humans ...

... where are those papers?

If you cannot produce them then that is an end to your incessant lying for Islam.

PRODUCE THE PAPERS.

 

[MarkCorrigan]

Heydarian, what could convince you that you are wrong?

Well?

 

[Scorpion]

This citation is simple and worthless. Please speak with valid documents. And bring the address of your valid document. Please be reasonable. Your understanding of this issue is by no means a valid document. Please speak with a valid document. I have told you this many times. You repeat again. Sorry for you.

Did you even read post 2644 in which I list the verses in the Quran that plainly state the heaven and earth were created in six days. ?

 

[Scorpion]

This is not an ordinary science. It is a special kind of knowledge that God has given only to the prophets. All the prophets had this knowledge from God. The language of the ants that Solomon had was the same kind of divine knowledge. It is not experimental science. Experimental science only says: the frequency of ant sounds is above 20,000 Hz. It is the loudest and biggest sound in the world. Which has an ant.! (Of course, it is not loud, but its frequency is extremely high) so man can not hear it at all. Unless it is with a special device. On the other hand, I do not know his language. Do you know that the language of the ant was Hebrew !! Perhaps because the language of Solomon's time was Hebrew, you have such an understanding. I do not know.
This is just my understanding and knowledge to answer your question. I do not know more than this. If you know more, I'm glad to learn from you. Thanks

Unbelievable ! I am beginning to want to break the rules of the forum and insult your intelligence, but I think that may not be possible.


ANTS DON'T BLOODY WELL TALK ! But you are telling us that King Solomon heard one talk. Here are the Qurans verses on the subject.

27.18 At length, when they came to a (lowly) valley of ants, one of the ants said:
"O ye ants, get into your habitations, lest Solomon and his hosts crush you (under foot) without knowing it."

27.19 So he smiled, amused at her speech; and he said: "O my Lord! so order me that I may be grateful for Thy favour's, which thou hast bestowed on me and on my parents, and that I may work the righteousness that will please Thee: And admit me, by Thy Grace, to the ranks of Thy righteous Servants."

Lets consider what the ant is supposed to have said. It mentions Solomon by name. How would some dumb assed ant know the name of an oncoming army's leader?

 

[Scorpion]

4 verses of the Qur'an raise this issue. Two verses for animal teleport - one verse for inanimate teleport - one verse for human teleport. Address of verses: 17/1 - 2 / 259-2 / 260 - 27/40

I am not sure of your quote numbers, please consider posting the entire verses you are referring to. But if you are citing surah 17.1 that refers to Muhammad's night journey, this was reputedly accomplished by his riding a flying animal like a donkey. Not by teleportation.

 

[IanS]

Did you even read post 2644 in which I list the verses in the Quran that plainly state the heaven and earth were created in six days. ?

Heydarian, when you go back to check Scorpions post number 2644, as you now must do, because what he quotes strongly disagrees with your claims, also answer the following please -

- when did any so-called "Islamic Scholars", first start claiming that the Quran says the universe is about 14 billion years old? Was that before science told everyone that was roughly the correct date, or did Islam only start to claim that date AFTER science had already told everyone?


For example - can you produce any Islamic article written, say around 1900, where it clearly says that the age of the universe is about 14 billion years (ie. a date that they claimed to discover in the Quran)?

Or maybe you have an accurately dated Islamic article from, say, 1950, stating 14 billion years? ... do you have that?


The same question may be easier & clearer to understand if I ask about evolution, so here is the question in that case -

Q - please produce any Islamic article written before 1859, where Islam reports that Man formed by slow adaptive change (ie "evolution") from earlier different creatures on Earth over a period of many millions of years. Can you produce any such article from before that date of about 1859 (though here we should note that IIRC - evolution of a sort, had been suggested, but without precise details, since about 1800)?

 

[Chanakya]

Do not bother yourself too much. Use your efforts in the way of science. These are what the scorpion said. None of them have the correct documentation. By the way, most of the narrations in Islam are storytelling. And it is nothing but superstition. Hear from me that I am a Muslim: Heaven and Hell are of this material world. There is nothing supernatural about it. The descriptions of heaven and hell through narrations are just superstitious storytelling. See what God has said in the Qur'an. Let me give you an example. God says heavenly women. But in the interpretation and meaning of the translators, they say: very beautiful women with big black eyes who are unique. This is nothing more than a lie. The women of heaven are just like the women of the world. Let me say in your language that sex is one in the world and in heaven. There is no difference between them.
These superstitious storytelling were meant to encourage ignorant people to religion. Instead of telling the correct meaning and interpretation of the Qur'an and the correct method of the Prophet, they fabricated these superstitions and told them to the people. Unfortunately, the Muslim people are still caught up in these worthless stories. There is marriage in heaven like in the world. There is a servant. There is fruit, water and wine. Like this world. See verse 2/25 says: When the people of Paradise see the blessings of Paradise, they say: I have seen these before in the world. Yes that's right. These blessings are the things of the world. They are the same fruits and the most beautiful women in the world. Not more than this. I know you are not superstitious. Unfortunately, Muslims are very superstitious. All religions are superstitious in all religions of the world. Very few religious people are realistic.
I am not a superstitious person at all. And I see these words of the scorpion that he says about the Qur'an and hadiths as superstitions. And I do not believe in that. I agree with you on this issue. Be sure. Only science and realism is my approach.

Amazing. Yet again you gloss over the post I'd addressed to you just above the one you picked on to respond to. The former, that you ignored, was where I point out, yet again, something you'd been ignoring, and something that's substantial and actually relevant to your claim, and what's more put in bold font so you can't possibly have missed it; and yet you home in on an inconsequential post of mine, that's more of a joke than anything else, and put up a show of answering it in depth.

Actually scratch that. For from being "amazing", it's kind of foolish to continue to be even slightly surprised by this, at this point in the thread. I mean, this is simply disingenuous. No other way of putting this.

 

[Scorpion]

Hello
Darwin's efforts are commendable. And we do not deny it. But he has proposed only a part of the process of evolution related to living beings and human beings. And has been studied since about 460 million years ago. While for the creation of life on Earth, this process requires nuclear and chemical evolution. And this process has started from the beginning of the expansion of the universe. The 6 days of God's creation mean six evolutionary periods that lasted approximately 14 billion years. This has been proven by science. Science proves all scientific content in the Qur'an. And many unknowns have not yet reached science. But it is mentioned in the Qur'an. To be motivated to find it by humans. We fully understand what you mean. We are aware of all your discussions. Reality and truth are not hidden from us. Be sure.

As I have tried to explain to you, the bible and the Quran both say one of Gods days is a thousand years. So the six days of creation mean six thousand years. Not 14 billion years. You have no excuse for claiming this.
You cannot use the usual Muslim propaganda that the Arabic word for day means an undetermined time period. Because the bible says the same thing, and it was not written in Arabic. It should be obvious to a brain dead mule that the Quran is copying the bible when it says the heaven and earth were created in six days.

 

[Scorpion]

Thank you for your compassion for me. I do not see the need for compassion for me. But you are completely wrong about the Qur'an and God. As I said before, your knowledge of the Qur'an and its content and the meaning of its sentences is very small and weak. You are not in a position to critique the Qur'an. Your effort is in vain. Thank you again

I took your point to heart as it has been some time since I read the Quran all through, so I started reading it again to be sure of my view of it. I soon found verses that prove to me it is utter trash. Here are a couple.

3.56 "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."

4.89 They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of God (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks;-

4.93 If a man kills a believer intentionally, his recompense is Hell, to abide
therein (For ever): And the wrath and the curse of God are upon him, and a dreadful penalty is prepared for him.

Violent verses and one that says you cannot kill believers, but it says nothing about killing unbelievers. The whole rotten Quran says God curses unbelievers. Trash, utter trash.

 

[Lukraak_Sisser]

Hi
Recognize whether there is a need for prophets and the Bible. Not with us. This is the recognition of God, the Wise, the mighty. There are issues that only God recognizes. If we could recognize that we were God !!! And this is ridiculous. But you said that the genetic structure shows that it is even better. We do not deny this. In fact, it says that the life cycle is purposeful. That evolution has a purpose. That is, the path of evolution is still open. And is not closed. We believe in this. In fact, all of these hypotheses are about the purpose of the universe.

So, the god's ways are mysterious and we can't understand it excuse. Of course, if THAT is the case, there is also no reason to follow any prophet or book that claims to explain god, since we cannot understand it anyway so these must by definition be wrong.

And no, genetics shows evolution has NO path, NO purpose, NO direction. It's a natural process with zero intelligent guidance. After all, intelligent guidance would not have produced the mess that is life.

 

[Scorpion]

Here is what the Quran says about unbelievers:


Chapter 4 The Women - An-Nisa: Verse 151
They are in truth (equally) unbelievers; and we have prepared for unbelievers a humiliating punishment.

Chapter 18 The cave - Al-Kahf: Verse 102
Do the Unbelievers think that they can take My servants as protectors besides Me? Verily We have prepared Hell for the Unbelievers for (their) entertainment.

Chapter 18 The cave- Al-Kahf: Verse
And We shall present Hell that day for Unbelievers to see, all spread out,-

Chapter 33 The Coalition - Al-Ahzab: Verse 64
Verily Allah has cursed the Unbelievers and prepared for them a Blazing Fire,-

Chapter 38 Sad - Sad: Verse 27
Not without purpose did We create heaven and earth and all between! that were the thought of Unbelievers! but woe to the Unbelievers because of the Fire (of Hell)!

Chapter 40 The Forgiver - Ghafir: Verse 6
Thus was the Decree of thy Lord proved true against the Unbelievers; that truly they are Companions of the Fire!

Chapter 51 The winnowing winds - Adh-Dhariyat: Verse 60
Woe, then, to the Unbelievers, on account of that Day of theirs which they have been promised!


Chapter 9 Repentance - At-Taubah: Verse 73
O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be firm against them. Their abode is Hell,- an evil refuge indeed.

Chapter 13 The Thunder- Ar-Rad: Verse 32
Mocked were (many) messengers before thee: but I granted respite to the unbelievers, and finally I punished them: Then how (terrible) was my requital!


Chapter 14 Abraham - Ibrahim: Verse 2
Of Allah, to Whom do belong all things in the heavens and on earth! But alas for the Unbelievers for a terrible penalty (their Unfaith will bring them)!-


Chapter 21 The Prophets - Al-Anbiya: Verse 98
Verily ye, (unbelievers), and the (false) gods that ye worship besides Allah, are (but) fuel for Hell! to it will ye (surely) come!


Chapter 24 The Light - An-Noor: Verse 57
Never think thou that the Unbelievers are going to frustrate (Allah's Plan) on earth: their abode is the Fire,- and it is indeed an evil refuge!

Chapter 32 The Prostration - As-Sajda: Verse 29
Say: "On the Day of Decision, no profit will it be to Unbelievers if they (then) believe! nor will they be granted a respite."

Chapter 33 The Coalition - Al-Ahzab: Verse 8
That (Allah) may question the (custodians) of Truth concerning the Truth they (were charged with): And He has prepared for the Unbelievers a grievous Penalty.

Chapter 41 Explained in detail - Fussilat: Verse 27
But We will certainly give the Unbelievers a taste of a severe Penalty, and We will requite them for the worst of their deeds.


Chapter 42 Council, Consultation - Ash-Shura: Verse 26
And He listens to those who believe and do deeds of righteousness, and gives them increase of His Bounty: but for the Unbelievers their is a terrible Penalty.

Chapter 66 Banning - At-Tahrim: Verse 9
O Prophet! Strive hard against the Unbelievers and the Hypocrites, and be firm against them. Their abode is Hell,- an evil refuge (indeed).

Chapter 8 Spoils of war, booty- Al-Anfal: Verse 36
The Unbelievers spend their wealth to hinder (man) from the path of Allah, and so will they continue to spend; but in the end they will have (only) regrets and sighs; at length they will be overcome: and the Unbelievers will be gathered together to Hell;-


Chapter 22 The Pilgrimage - Al-Hajj: Verse 72
When Our Clear Signs are rehearsed to them, thou wilt notice a denial on the faces of the Unbelievers! they nearly attack with violence those who rehearse Our Signs to them. Say, "Shall I tell you of something (far) worse than these Signs? It is the Fire (of Hell)! Allah has promised it to the Unbelievers! and evil is that destination!"

Chapter 3 The family of Imran -Aal-e-Imran: Verse 151
Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority: their abode will be the Fire: And evil is the home of the wrong-doers!


Chapter 3 The family of Imran - Aal-e-Imran: Verse 178
Let not the Unbelievers think that our respite to them is good for themselves: We grant them respite that they may grow in their iniquity: But they will have a shameful punishment.

Chapter 5 The Table Spread - Al-Maeda: Verse 80
Thou seest many of them turning in friendship to the Unbelievers. Evil indeed are (the works) which their souls have sent forward before them (with the result), that Allah's wrath is on them, and in torment will they abide.

Chapter 8 Spoils of war, booty - Al-Anfal: Verse 50
If thou couldst see, when the angels take the souls of the Unbelievers (at death), (How) they smite their faces and their backs, (saying): "Taste the penalty of the blazing Fire-

Chapter 9 Repentance - At-Taubah: Verse 26
But Allah did pour His calm on the Messenger and on the Believers, and sent down forces which ye saw not: He punished the Unbelievers; thus doth He reward those without Faith.


Chapter 9 Repentance - At-Taubah: Verse 49
Among them is (many) a man who says: "Grant me exemption and draw me not into trial." Have they not fallen into trial already? and indeed Hell surrounds the Unbelievers (on all sides).


Chapter 9 Repentance - At-Taubah: Verse 90
And there were, among the desert Arabs (also), men who made excuses and came to claim exemption; and those who were false to Allah and His Messenger (merely) sat inactive. Soon will a grievous penalty seize the Unbelievers among them.

Chapter 21 The Prophets - Al-Anbiya: Verse 39
If only the Unbelievers knew (the time) when they will not be able to ward off the fire from their faces, nor yet from their backs, and (when) no help can reach them!


Chapter 21 The Prophets- Al-Anbiya: Verse 97
Then will the true promise draw nigh (of fulfilment): then behold! the eyes of the Unbelievers will fixedly stare in horror: "Ah! Woe to us! we were indeed heedless of this; nay, we truly did wrong!"

 

[LarryS]

Heydarian and Scorpion,
There might be a value in putting scripture, and the testimony of others aside, and speak only to what your own thoughts, sensations, perceptions (and perhaps genuine intuitions), have to say about what is the natural/supernateral. This battle od opposing scriptures is tiring to say the least.

 

[ynot]

Retrofitting and reverse engineering does not prove an actual god.

 

[Thor 2]

Hi
Recognize whether there is a need for prophets and the Bible. Not with us. This is the recognition of God, the Wise, the mighty. There are issues that only God recognizes. If we could recognize that we were God !!! And this is ridiculous. But you said that the genetic structure shows that it is even better. We do not deny this. In fact, it says that the life cycle is purposeful. That evolution has a purpose. That is, the path of evolution is still open. And is not closed. We believe in this. In fact, all of these hypotheses are about the purpose of the universe.

Who is we!

From my experience, believers of all types, like to talk as if they are part of a group, with perfectly identical beliefs in any detail. This is hardly the case however.

Looking at your multitude of posts, valiantly defending you own set of beliefs, against the barrage of very sound criticism from so many others, reinforces my conviction. The conviction that no amount of sound argument, can make a dent in the faith of a rusted on believer.

 

[Little 10 Toes]

This is not an ordinary science. It is a special kind of knowledge that God has given only to the prophets.

Evidence of such a claim please.

All the prophets had this knowledge from God.

Evidence of such a claim please.

The language of the ants that Solomon had was the same kind of divine knowledge.

Evidence of such a claim please.

It is not experimental science.

Exactly. So far you have only said things that cannot be proven.

Experimental science only says: the frequency of ant sounds is above 20,000 Hz.

"Only"? No.

It is the loudest and biggest sound in the world.

Evidence of such a claim please.

Which has an ant.! (Of course, it is not loud, but its frequency is extremely high) so man can not hear it at all.

If is is not loud, why did you claim it?

Unless it is with a special device.

The Quran does not state he had a special device.

On the other hand, I do not know his language. Do you know that the language of the ant was Hebrew !! Perhaps because the language of Solomon's time was Hebrew, you have such an understanding. I do not know.
This is just my understanding and knowledge to answer your question. I do not know more than this. If you know more, I'm glad to learn from you. Thanks

I assume it was Hebrew since Solomon was Jewish. I can make my question more general then. How did the ant speak "human"?