• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Cont: The Sinking of MS Estonia: Case Re-opened Part IV

Status
Not open for further replies.
Captain_Swoop said:
More than 90 is not 180

If I was on a ship in a storm that had taken on a list of 30 to 40 degrees and was taking on water I think I would feel a bit of panic coming on.
Click to expand...

Sorry, are you claiming a boat can float at a list of 90°?, 100°? 120°? or even 180°? (starboard side, assuming 0° represents port and 45° perfect equilibrium, or vice versa)?

So you believe a ship can float on its superstructure and that this only stops when water weighs it down?
 
Vixen said:
Sorry, are you claiming a boat can float at a list of 90°?, 100°? 120°? or even 180°? (starboard side, assuming 0° represents port and 45° perfect equilibrium, or vice versa)?

So you believe a ship can float on its superstructure and that this only stops when water weighs it down?
Click to expand...

It's superstructure has nothing to do with it. A ship floats because it has enough buoyancy.
A ship will float at whatever angle it finds equilibrium, this depends on a number of circumstances unique to each ship and event.
That's why some ships go down on an even keel, some go down by the bow or stern, some with a list and some capsize.
 
LondonJohn said:
Indeed.

And further: the very fact that the report concludes that what most likely happened was that the HOFE settled in that 90-degree (give or take a few degrees) heel before sinking down to the sandbar....

......actually lends a lot more weight to the notion that the ship - had the sandbar not intervened - would simply have continued to sink in that same orientation onto a deeper sea bed.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the incredibly amusing schoolboy howler!

Oh dear.

Bwahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Whoops, busting a gut.
 
Vixen said:
Sorry, are you claiming a boat can float at a list of 90°?, 100°? 120°? or even 180°? (starboard side, assuming 0° represents port and 45° perfect equilibrium, or vice versa)?



So you believe a ship can float on its superstructure and that this only stops when water weighs it down?
Click to expand...
What does this stuff in parentheses mean?
 
Vixen said:
Sorry, are you claiming a boat can float at a list of 90°?, 100°? 120°? or even 180°?
Click to expand...

Your legal friend Sheen who you say is on your side literally wrote that the Herald of Free Enterprise probably floated for about a minute at a list a little greater than 90°.

Your incredulous tone indicates that you believe this feat to be impossible. Why?
 
Vixen said:
He said it had turned over by more than 90° to port.



You claim, 'It would not have turtled.' Seriously?
Click to expand...
Two points:
1) There's no fundamental reason it would have turned turtle.
2) You're still deflecting to avoid admitting that you falsely claimed Sheen said it would have turned turtle.
 
Vixen said:
So you believe a ship can float on its superstructure...
Click to expand...

Ships float. They don't float "on" specific parts in the sense that those are the only parts that somehow create buoyancy. A ship can float in any orientation that is (a) stable, and (b) does not allow the ingress of water. The names of the parts that are underwater at any given time is irrelevant.
 
Vixen said:
I do hope this helps your understanding.
Click to expand...

The problem is your understanding. I addressed this video. But, as usual, you didn't even acknowledge that. You're simply hurling material out that you little understand, in hopes that no one calls your bluff. The video you posted, as do most naval architecture presentations of stability, ends right at the part where things get interesting -- what other points of equilibrium are there on the GZ curve after it's extended past the critical heel angle?
 
Last edited:
Vixen said:
Sorry, are you claiming a boat can float at a list of 90°?, 100°? 120°? or even 180°? (starboard side, assuming 0° represents port and 45° perfect equilibrium, or vice versa)?
Click to expand...

This is astonishing. 0° must represent upright, vertical, in a position floating nicely balanced in still water. Everybody else in this thread (and elsewhere) would take 90° to mean lying on its side, so that any mast, funnel or whatever standing perpendicular to the deck is now parallel with the water's surface.

Beyond that - even if you arbitrarily chose 0° to mean lying on its side, then 45° would be only half way up/down to the vertical. A right angle has 90°, in case you missed that at school.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom