Cont: The Trump Presidency: Part 28

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Ladewig said:
Did they cut back the number of IRS agents?
Or was it redirecting them to look for things other than rich-people fraud?

I’m too lazy to look it up.

ETA
I guess we found one of the reasons he really,really, really wanted his tax return kept secret.
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Property taxes are levied by local jurisdictions, not the IRS. Your property doesn't show up on tax forms the IRS gets (other than deducting property taxes from your income).

ETA: That said, if someone had Trump's tax returns and he claimed he paid X in property taxes for deduction purposes, but his local records showed he paid 0.1X, he would have a problem.
 
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It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
 
I don't know how it's done in NYC, but having been for a long time involved with tax review in a Connecticut town, I wonder how the offense in question was accomplished. Once assessed, the usual next step is an appeal of the assessment. In Connecticut, it was to the Board of Tax Review, which is privy to the standards and investigations used by the Assessors. Here in Vermont, it's the Assessors themselves. If the judgment is still unsatisfactory enough, you can take it to court. You can't just declare a value. Maybe in NYC the officials are so busy they ask for a declaration and accept it, but I doubt something like this would occur unless some officials are found also to be corrupt. But some of what is being alleged is that fraud was committed, not on the city, but on investors.

As for Warp12's aside here, I don't think it's true that everyone who accuses another of tax evasion is a tax evader too, but aside from that, the particular investigation under discussion is one of property taxes, and instigated by the NY Attorney General, not a case of tit for tat tattling about income tax fraud.
 
Warp12 said:
It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
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Most people don't have much chance to cheat on their taxes. The Trump family's whole business is a massive tax evasion scam, going back to his daddy's federally subsidized housing projects.
The President and his siblings helped his parents build their wealth by hiding millions of dollars in gifts in a “sham corporation,” according to the Times. The President assisted his father in taking “improper tax deductions worth millions more.” He also helped to “formulate a strategy” for his parents to undervalue their real estate holdings on their tax returns to reduce their tax bill, according to records reviewed by the Times.
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https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/02/politics/donald-trump-tax-schemes/index.html
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-schemes-fred-trump.html
 
Warp12 said:
It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
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Bob001 said:
Most people don't have much chance to cheat on their taxes.
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Get real, Bob.

Millions of Americans are simply not paying their taxes. For about every 30 taxpayers who file their tax returns each year, there’s one business or household that doesn’t. The amount of money they collectively owe is not trivial — about 14 million taxpayers owed $131 billion in taxes and penalties to the federal government in 2017, according to the latest IRS data.
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More people are cheating on their taxes, but fewer are going to jail
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/4/16/18311366/tax-day-cheating-prosecutions-jail

And that doesn't count the vast amount of undocumented "cheating" or "fudging" that certainly occurs. So, yeah, lots of people cheat on their taxes...and I am sure plenty of those criticizing Trump fall into that group. Perhaps even some in this thread. But, such hypocrisy is typical when it comes to political matters.
 
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Warp12 said:
Get real, Bob.

More people are cheating on their taxes, but fewer are going to jail
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/4/16/18311366/tax-day-cheating-prosecutions-jail

And that doesn't count the vast amount of undocumented "cheating" or "fudging" that certainly occurs. So, yeah, lots of people cheat on their taxes...and I am sure plenty of those criticizing Trump fall into that group. Perhaps even some in this thread. But, such hypocrisy is typical when it comes to political matters.
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One out of 30 is roughly three percent. So 97 percent of taxpayers are not cheating. People whose income is reported on W2s or 1099s have a very hard time cheating. And when people do cheat and get away with it, it's largely because the Repubs have eviscerated the IRS for years.
https://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-irs-was-gutted

And what's your point? You think Trump should get away with massive tax evasion because somebody else does too? You think maybe a President has a greater obligation to comply with the law and be transparent about it than some neighborhood pizza shop?
 
Warp12 said:
It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
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Dude! At least wash that off before you post it here. We all know from whence it was pulled.
 
What a lot of words

Warp12 said:
It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
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to express the old lower-class belief that "They all crooked crooks! Muh!"
 
Warp12 said:
It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
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Don't judge others by your own standard of behaviour.
 
Norman Alexander said:
Oh, I know. Just that our resident right-wing chain-yankers like to use "antifa" as a nasty catch-all smear for anyone who opposes their stinky orange god.
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I appreciate that, but it's not in me to let such an opportunity pass. We've heard often enough that "You people call anybody you don't like a fascist", but in Mussolini's case it's open and shut.


Would I like to see Donny dead? Nope. He just needs to be gone forever. To a squalid and cold little Soviet-style concrete apartment in the filthier outskirts of Moscow would suit me. I'm sure Pootie could scrape together some spare pocket-change to put him up. :wink:
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I too would prefer Trump to suffer in life, but if it's between him getting away with it and the piñata treatment I'll go with the latter every time. I'll feel no guilt because I'll have had no responsibility for it, any more than you will. Had Hilary Clinton been assassinated by one of those "2nd Amendment people" Trump would have had some responsibility for it, but I very much doubt Warp12 took exception to that speech. Go figure.
 
Warp12 said:
It would be awesome to see the results of tax audits on the typical person bitching about Trump's taxes. A large portion of those people are no doubt cheating like hell on theirs. :D
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Warp12 said:
Get real, Bob.



More people are cheating on their taxes, but fewer are going to jail
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/4/16/18311366/tax-day-cheating-prosecutions-jail

And that doesn't count the vast amount of undocumented "cheating" or "fudging" that certainly occurs. So, yeah, lots of people cheat on their taxes...and I am sure plenty of those criticizing Trump fall into that group. Perhaps even some in this thread. But, such hypocrisy is typical when it comes to political matters.
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Foster Zygote said:
Dude! At least wash that off before you post it here. We all know from whence it was pulled.
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:thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
From Warp's own reference:
Some of the worst offenders are businesses who pocket payroll taxes, according to the inspector general for the Treasury’s Tax Administration. Thousands of employers are getting away with tax embezzlement each year, the IRS watchdog warned back in 2017, and that probably won’t change unless employers face jail time.
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Of course, just because everyone does it doesn't make it right. ;)
 
Damn. As much vociferous complaint as my suggestion set off, I suspect some of you suddenly reflected upon your own tax history.

The funny part is, I never excused him for any potential wrongdoing. I just made the point, that even statistically, there has to be a lot of hypocrisy amongst those pointing fingers at Trump.

The funniest part was Bob implying that Trump is somehow more accountable to pay his taxes than a "regular" person or business. This really drives my point home.
 
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There's a reason Trump lied repeatedly about releasing his taxes and why he's fought so damn hard to not do so. And it's not because they're being audited.
 
Norman Alexander said:
Mafia Don believes he has no "equal", so he has no obligations to anyone. Ever.
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The only reason he's not actual Mafia is he's not Italian. But they'd never have him. He shoots his mouth off too much. If he was an actual member, they'd have put a hit out on him long ago. He'd be under ten feet of cement next to Jimmy Hoffa.
 
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