Ghislaine Maxwell

smartcooky said:
The statements I have read include both Epstein and Maxwell in the accusations, so in those cases one is as good as the other. They include statements by Victoria Guiffre, Annie Farmer, Maria Farmer and others



All irrelevant since I told you where I get my information from.

I deal in facts, which I get from the previously listed sources that deal in facts.

You're obviously someone who has a problem with how things are portrayed in documentaries... and them you watch them anyway :rolleyes:
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I was determined to get to the bottom of the truth. To my surprise, I could find very little authentic information that Maxwell is the monster she is portrayed as. As I said earlier, I dare say she is guilty to some degree but I doubt she is the wicked sinister depraved monstrosity that people (have a go at guessing who 'the people' are who have an interest in portraying her as thus?). Lots of compo to be had, lots of salacious lurid films and books to profit from.

You are not calling BS, I am calling BS. BS!
 
How many trafficking victims before a "monster" isn't too strong a word?
 
gnome said:
How many trafficking victims before a "monster" isn't too strong a word?
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Indeed.

Trafficking just ONE under-aged girl for sex makes you a monster.

Trafficking FOUR under-aged girls for sex makes you a monster and a serial offender.

Trafficking hundreds, under-aged or not, should result in your incarceration for the rest of your natural life.
 
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Vixen said:
I was determined to get to the bottom of the truth. To my surprise, I could find very little authentic information that Maxwell is the monster she is portrayed as.
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So you dismiss the statements by her victims as not being "authentic" information.

Why am I not surprised? :rolleyes:
 
Vixen said:
I did not say it was OK. I was stating a fact, in the same way I might say 'Paris is the capital of France'. Prostitution is extremely dangerous, especially for the street prostitutes. Surveys show that many, many of them have clients who beat them up, refuse to pay and/or commit various atrocities. I did not make any value judgement about anybody 'deserving' it.

Stop faking hysteria and outrage.
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I am outraged that you insist on comparing Epstein and Maxwell's victims -- of any age -- to street prostitutes.
 
gnome said:
How many trafficking victims before a "monster" isn't too strong a word?
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How do you know it is 'trafficking'? For all we know, Virginia Roberts' trip to London when she was seventeen and 7/12ths with Maxwell, was a simple invitation from Maxwell to visit London and see the sights, and in the meantime, she got to meet Maxwell's friend, Prince Andrew and got the 2001 equivalent of a 'selfie' as a memento of the holiday. The pair were good friends before they fell out.

How did Maxwell force Giuffre onto a plane to London, without the 'trafficked sex-slave' (her self-description) showing any signs of distress or making any effort to escape?

Yet we all take it for granted that she was brought to England specifically to have coerced sex with Prince Andrew and the photo proves it, which shows how willing people are to prefer the more titillating version of events.
 
smartcooky said:
Indeed.

Trafficking just ONE under-aged girl for sex makes you a monster.

Trafficking FOUR under-aged girls for sex makes you a monster and a serial offender.

Trafficking hundreds, under-aged or not, should result in your incarceration for the rest of your natural life.
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IF it actually happened. The fact that Maxwell was Epstein's girlfriend is not proof she trafficked underage 'girls' as you call them.
 
Vixen said:
IF it actually happened. The fact that Maxwell was Epstein's girlfriend is not proof she trafficked underage 'girls' as you call them.
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An interesting shift here--most of the discussion so far has been the severity of the accusations.

Of course if she didn't do it, she's not a monster. Do we need to discuss that?
 
Bob001 said:
I am outraged that you insist on comparing Epstein and Maxwell's victims -- of any age -- to street prostitutes.
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Stop trying to put a spin on what I said. I was not referring to social class, as in the chauffeur of a Mercedes is better than one who drives a Skoda, or a doorman at the local nightclub is lower class than one at the Dorchester. I was referring to sex work as a dangerous occupation whether a high-class call girl or a street walker. The relevance is the level of risk someone is willing to accept by taking up such a profession.

For example, we have idiots in England who travel to the Durdell Door jutting cliff in Dorset in order t jump off into dangerously shallow water whilst ignoring all the warning signs saying 'DANGER'. Many are seriously injured or even killed.

Now were I to do the same, make my way along the cliff edge of this promontory, see the clear signs warning of unauthorised access and danger, and throw myself off into the sea, sure you might sympathise with my ensuing injuries. However, were I to make an insurance claim, do you know what? The answer back from the insurance brokers would be a piffling handout with the very short explanation 'you contributed to your own misfortune'. Or do you not agree with this concept?
 
gnome said:
An interesting shift here--most of the discussion so far has been the severity of the accusations.

Of course if she didn't do it, she's not a monster. Do we need to discuss that?
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Shouldn't that be step number one? Establish exactly what Maxwell did do? Then come to a conclusion.
 
Vixen said:
Maxwell has no more control over the conditions of her birth and childhood than Giuffre had. Or are you advocating class envy?
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If you cast your mind back, you might remember that you were suggesting that she should get preferential treatment because of her background.
 
Vixen said:
Shouldn't that be step number one? Establish exactly what Maxwell did do? Then come to a conclusion.
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There was a lot of time spent on questioning the severity of the accusations. Was that something you weren't trying to argue?
 
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