Yoga still banned in Alabama.

[Dr. Keith]

Ran across this article which, among other things, included this quote, with citations.

In other documents, ALSDE said teachers may instruct students on poses, exercises and stretches associated with the practice as long as the "course is not called yoga."​

So apparently the exercises are okay, but the rest is right out.

So call it Agoy?

 

[theprestige]

ALSDE is the Alabama State Department of Education. And it kinda sounds like the secularized practice that the haters skeptics in this thread have been calling for is exactly what the horrible reasonable Alabama legislature has established.

 

[quadraginta]

ALSDE is the Alabama State Department of Education. And it kinda sounds like the secularized practice that the haters skeptics in this thread have been calling for is exactly what the horrible reasonable Alabama legislature has established.

And following the passage I quoted was this one:

Meditation - deemed as coming "from the mystical traditions of the East" - is also on the banned list if it involves focusing on deep breathing and a mantra, or repeated word or phrase.

"Secular" meditation is allowed, however.

"This is not to be confused with secular meditation which involves alert, reflective and cognitive contemplation," the ALSDE said.​

Although I'm not entirely certain exactly what is meant by "alert, reflective and cognitive contemplation".

Or just why a "repeated word or phrase" is so heinous.

What if the word was "hallelujah". Or "amen".

 

[Checkmite]

Dodgeball is already bad enough, don't you think?

Ran across this article which, among other things, included this quote, with citations.

Looks like dodgeball is also on the banned list.

 

[theprestige]

Well, dodgeball probably should be on the banned list.

 

[Checkmite]

Although I'm not entirely certain exactly what is meant by "alert, reflective and cognitive contemplation".

I can't say I know; but I speculate that MBSR and similar is likely what the author had in mind.

 

[Checkmite]

Well, dodgeball probably should be on the banned list.

Dodgeball should've never been on the exists list.

 

[theprestige]

Dodgeball should've never been on the exists list.

I think dodgeball is a perfectly cromulent game for consenting adults of similar skill levels and appropriate protective gear. Maybe not for young kids, but not existing at all? Don't hate the game, hate the player.

 

[arthwollipot]

I was sure I'd already written this response but it seems to have vanished so I must have done something wrong.

I've done both T'ai Chi and yoga. Both are surprisingly intense workouts.

For T'ai Chi, try this: Do a full squat. Now raise to halfway. Now take a step without coming up. Now take three steps. Now do a full 86-part form. It'll take you about 40 minutes. Don't come up out of that half-squat. Yeah.

The yoga I did was Bikram, which is done at 40C, 40% relative humidity. And while Bikram himself is a borderline cult leader who has been accused of shenanigans with his female students, the script that instructors have to follow when leading a class is 100% woo-free, consisting entirely of descriptions of the poses, sometimes amusingly translated from Hindi. But it's an intense workout. My favourite pose is Shavasana.

 

[Roboramma]

Who says that yoga instructors must be certified by the "Yoga Alliance"? A teacher doesn't need to be certified by a "football alliance" in order to teach football.

Most of the places that hire yoga teachers require Yoga Alliance certification.

 

[Roboramma]

That’s a big ‘if’. How many instructors does it apply to?

The vast majority. Yoga Alliance certification is a huge part of the business of yoga. It's generally the way that people make money in the business of yoga, both for yoga studios and for teachers who get beyond the point of making a few bucks teaching classes. Those who are making a decent living are mostly doing so by running Yoga Alliance certified teacher training courses.

 

[Roboramma]

Yeah, I have no idea, which is why I mentioned that I might be wrong. I'm a complete outsider, whose only contact with yoga is what I see in popular culture. I am neither a student of, nor obviously an instructor of yoga. Is this sort of certification a requirement to teach yoga?

There's no government body that requires people to have any particular certification to teach yoga anywhere that I'm aware of. If you wanted to teach yoga you could get up tomorrow and advertise a class.

But most of the gyms and yoga studios offering yoga classes only hire teachers with Yoga Alliance certification.

I also wonder whether the religious study is more of the informative sort or indoctrination? It's possible to teach people about a religion without indoctrinating them in the religion.

Yes, that's a valid point, but the point is that the religious study is considered an important part of the practice. It's not necessarily the case that teachers or their students are being indoctrinated, but at least the most well recognized body sees the religious aspects as an integral part of yoga.

 

[arthwollipot]

There's no government body that requires people to have any particular certification to teach yoga anywhere that I'm aware of. If you wanted to teach yoga you could get up tomorrow and advertise a class.

But most of the gyms and yoga studios offering yoga classes only hire teachers with Yoga Alliance certification.

I know that Bikram claims to hold the copyright on the script used in his organisation and that you can't legally get a copy of it without undergoing his training course in India.

That doesn't mean that you can't get a copy of it, of course. But he'll probably try and sue you. Most likely unsuccessfully.

 

[dann]

The fact remains that you used exactly the same fallacious argument that prohibitionists (who are trying to prove that marijuana is a gateway drug) are using. You never denied a causal link until you were called out.

It is hardly any wonder that you would get linked to the conservative lunatic fringe if you make their arguments for them.

No, I didn't deny a causal link because I never claimed one. Your strawman didn't call anything out. It invented a claim of a causal link that wasn't there. That is the point of a strawman. That you link me "to the conservative lunatic fringe" is no big concern of mine. Lunatic links don't bother me much.

But speaking of causal links, let me provide you with one:

New Zealand represents an ideal country in which to study the association between cannabis and respiratory tract cancer. New Zealand has a high rate of cannabis use, and it is rarely mixed with tobacco within the joint as is the custom in the United Kingdom. New Zealand has among the highest rates of lung cancer worldwide with the indigenous Maori population having the highest incidence of any ethnic group.
(...)
While cannabis smoking (defined as lifetime use of ≥20 joints) was not associated with a significantly increased risk of lung cancer (Table 3), those with the highest tertile of use (>10.5 joint-years of exposure) had a significantly increased risk, RR=5.7 (95% CI 1.5 to 21.6), after adjustment for age, sex, ethnicity, pack-years of cigarette smoking and a family history of lung cancer. Using the prevalence of the highest tertile of cannabis smoking of the controls we estimated that about 5% of lung cancer in those aged 55 years and under in New Zealand may be attributable to cannabis smoking.
(...)
This population-based case-control study provides evidence of a relationship between smoking cannabis and lung cancer in young adults. For each joint-year of cannabis exposure the risk of lung cancer was estimated to increase by 8%.
CANNABIS USE AND RISK OF LUNG CANCER: A CASE-CONTROL STUDY (PCI, Aug. 14, 2008)

For some reason, this never seems to bother advocates of marijuana.

I don't think anything links yoga to lung cancer ...

 

[psionl0]

No, I didn't deny a causal link because I never claimed one.

You didn't "claim" one but you used an argument that the loony right uses to imply that a causal link existed.

You just can't help championing the loony right. Not a gateway drug after all? Then find another reason to jail marijuana users - any reason at all. "That'll teach them bastards not to lick my jack boots".

 

[Roboramma]

I know that Bikram claims to hold the copyright on the script used in his organisation and that you can't legally get a copy of it without undergoing his training course in India.

That doesn't mean that you can't get a copy of it, of course. But he'll probably try and sue you. Most likely unsuccessfully.

I don't remember the details and didn't really follow it that much, but I think he ended up with just owning the name Bikram Yoga, and people who want to use the name (for instance, opening up a Bikram Yoga Studio) have to go though him, but I think his plan to copyright his sequence didn't hold up in court. I may be wrong about that though.

I do know that "hot yoga' which was basically Bikram by another name, was very popular for a while. It's still around, but isn't quite as popular as it was.

 

[Roboramma]

I know that Bikram claims to hold the copyright on the script used in his organisation and that you can't legally get a copy of it without undergoing his training course in India.

That doesn't mean that you can't get a copy of it, of course. But he'll probably try and sue you. Most likely unsuccessfully.

Oh, and just to add: My understanding is that Bikram still makes most of his money from teacher training courses, partly because people using the Bikram name have to hire teachers who were trained in one of his courses.

 

[Checkmite]

You just can't help championing the loony right. Not a gateway drug after all? Then find another reason to jail marijuana users - any reason at all. "That'll teach them bastards not to lick my jack boots".

A reason that marijuana might not be healthful to use doesn't equate to a reason to jail people for using it. Where did this bizarre tangent even start? Dann never implied that yoga practitioners belong in jail.

 

[theprestige]

I know that Bikram claims to hold the copyright on the script used in his organisation and that you can't legally get a copy of it without undergoing his training course in India.

That doesn't mean that you can't get a copy of it, of course. But he'll probably try and sue you. Most likely unsuccessfully.

It's been a while since I looked into this, but IIRC Bikram's script has been legally recognized as his proprietary information (in some jurisdictions, at least). So if he were able to show that you were actually using his script or some close variation, and that you were getting paid for it, his lawsuit would most likely be successful. At the very least, he'd be able to get an injunction against you continuing to use his script.

 

[psionl0]

A reason that marijuana might not be healthful to use doesn't equate to a reason to jail people for using it. Where did this bizarre tangent even start? Dann never implied that yoga practitioners belong in jail.

It started in post #36 where dann quoted an argument that yoga is a "gateway drug, into meditation and New Ageism".

When it was pointed out that this was a "gateway fallacy" he denied it and then used the "affirmation of the consequent" fallacy to argue that marijuana is a gateway to hard drug use. Since that argument is normally used by the hard right to justify treating marijuana users as criminals, the rest follows.