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Beavers being reintroduced to Wales

Sadly the BBC story-ette is long on vague generalizations about how this will be good for this or that, and very short on explaining specific problems the beavers are supposed to be solving, how they'll be solving them, and how the solution's progress will be measured.

For example:
It is hoped re-introduction of the mammals will help fell willow trees while environmentalists claim there will be further benefits in stabilising ecosystems.​

Why do more willow trees need felling in Wales? Why are beavers the best option here? Are there specific locations where there's a surplus of trees? Presumably those are the locations where the beavers are being released. What happens if the expected Welsh-willow-felling does not occur?

And just how unstable are these Welsh ecosystems? What specific ecosystem stabilization results are predicted? Is the anticipated stabilization part of the basis for this policy, or has it been tacked on ad hoc by environmentalists who weren't actually involved in the decision-making?

Who are these environmentalists, anyway? Is it all environmentalists? Just some? Do any of them have special expertise in Welsh ecosystems? Or are they all Scottish and just wanting to get rid of some beavers?

Are there any dissenting environmentalists? Or do the dissenters get lumped under "ome fishermen and farmers"?

Also, for The Don, why are fishermen and farmers "the usual suspects"? Are they supposed to be the villains of this story? Why does this story need villains? Why are you automatically assuming that the beaver-introducers are the heroes of this story? Is it because "environmentalists" say "there will be further benefits"?
 
Also, why "it is hoped"?

First of all, why the passive voice? Why not "these specific people hope"?

Second, why "hoped" and not "predicted by science"?

Honestly, I'm kind of with the usual suspects on this one. The BBC makes it sound kinda half-assed.
 
theprestige said:
Also, why "it is hoped"?

First of all, why the passive voice? Why not "these specific people hope"?

Second, why "hoped" and not "predicted by science"?

Honestly, I'm kind of with the usual suspects on this one. The BBC makes it sound kinda half-assed.
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I'm for environmentalism in general but introducing or reintroducing species where they don't currently exist is always going to result in unintended consequences. And expecting beavers to build their dams where they might be useful is just plain dumb. They're just as likely to cause unwanted flooding as they are to ameliorate damaging floods.

I'm a lifetime resident of "the beaver state" and was raised to love the little buggers, but they do what they want and are pests as often as they're adorable.
 
theprestige said:
Also, for The Don, why are fishermen and farmers "the usual suspects"? Are they supposed to be the villains of this story? Why does this story need villains? Why are you automatically assuming that the beaver-introducers are the heroes of this story? Is it because "environmentalists" say "there will be further benefits"?
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Because farmers (and by here I mean both farming institutions like the NFU and the majority of farmers I meet day to day) are consistently against biodiversity and any form of rules or regulation concerning their use of the land (such as restricting their rights to poison water courses with agrichemicals and/or animal waste.

They opposed the reintroduction of red kites (and indeed tried to poison as many as possible), their approach to containing any animal diseases is to propose a cull of wild animals (despite the paucity of evidence to support it), they routinely ignore rules deigned to protect birds nesting in hedges.
 
Babbylonian said:
I'm for environmentalism in general but introducing or reintroducing species where they don't currently exist is always going to result in unintended consequences. And expecting beavers to build their dams where they might be useful is just plain dumb. They're just as likely to cause unwanted flooding as they are to ameliorate damaging floods.

I'm a lifetime resident of "the beaver state" and was raised to love the little buggers, but they do what they want and are pests as often as they're adorable.
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That's why the beavers are being introduced, in limited numbers, in specific places. The intent, as with the population on the River Otter in Devon, is to study whether the anticipated benefits are achieved and if so, to continue with their introduction.
 
The Don said:
That's why the beavers are being introduced, in limited numbers, in specific places. The intent, as with the population on the River Otter in Devon, is to study whether the anticipated benefits are achieved and if so, to continue with their introduction.
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So if it goes horribly, horribly wrong they'll be able to fix the situation by TBD? Meanwhile the Welsh are floating off into whatever sea that is because a billion beavers (they're mad for *******) have changed every waterway to maximize their own convenience for rabies-sharing?
 
TragicMonkey said:
So if it goes horribly, horribly wrong they'll be able to fix the situation by TBD? Meanwhile the Welsh are floating off into whatever sea that is because a billion beavers (they're mad for *******) have changed every waterway to maximize their own convenience for rabies-sharing?
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Wales is, the the best of the BI, rabies free.
Interestingly there is interest in introducing (no 're-') beavers into Ireland.
 
catsmate said:
Wales is, the the best of the BI, rabies free.
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Well, it was. With a host of frothy-mouthed beavers roaming about, who knows? Perhaps the few Welsh who survive the flooding will be spared from the irony of dying of rabies, which used to be called hydrophobia. But I wouldn't bet a tin shekel, or whatever they use for money there.
 
catsmate said:
Wales is, the the best of the BI, rabies free.
Interestingly there is interest in introducing (no 're-') beavers into Ireland.
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I suggest they give it a go as an experiment. And, when(if) that doesn't work out, they can introduce the The African Black Mamba to control them. Saint Patrick would be proud.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Well, it was. With a host of frothy-mouthed beavers roaming about, who knows? Perhaps the few Welsh who survive the flooding will be spared from the irony of dying of rabies, which used to be called hydrophobia. But I wouldn't bet a tin shekel, or whatever they use for money there.
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There's no rabies at all in the British Isles. Beavers can't just kind of invent it and pass it on.
 
The Don said:
That's why the beavers are being introduced, in limited numbers, in specific places. The intent, as with the population on the River Otter in Devon, is to study whether the anticipated benefits are achieved and if so, to continue with their introduction.
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Is there an article or government document that explains this in more detail?
 
GlennB said:
There's no rabies at all in the British Isles. Beavers can't just kind of invent it and pass it on.
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I didn't realize these beavers were being created in-house in the British Isles, I thought they were being brought from somewhere. I guess if they're being assembled molecule-by-molecule the wizards can just leave out the rabies bits.

But of course the UK is no stranger to spontaneous mutations popping up, didn't Queen Victoria create her own brand of hemophilia? They say it can't have been intentional but I'm not so certain. I think she was trying to use the Force and create a Darth Vader but it backfired and contaminated her own midichlorians.
 
TragicMonkey said:
I didn't realize these beavers were being created in-house in the British Isles, I thought they were being brought from somewhere. I guess if they're being assembled molecule-by-molecule the wizards can just leave out the rabies bits.

But of course the UK is no stranger to spontaneous mutations popping up, didn't Queen Victoria create her own brand of hemophilia? They say it can't have been intentional but I'm not so certain. I think she was trying to use the Force and create a Darth Vader but it backfired and contaminated her own midichlorians.
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No, no, no. It was a side-effect of exposure to anti-werewolf weapons in 1879.
 
TragicMonkey said:
I didn't realize these beavers were being created in-house in the British Isles, I thought they were being brought from somewhere. I guess if they're being assembled molecule-by-molecule the wizards can just leave out the rabies bits.
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There are strictly applied laws concerning the import of animals from outside the British Isles, including vaccination for the animal and quarantine. There is no way an official agency would import rabies-carrying beavers. Any beavers introduced to Wales will be free of rabies, so don't worry about it.
 
GlennB said:
There are strictly applied laws concerning the import of animals from outside the British Isles, including vaccination for the animal and quarantine. There is no way an official agency would import rabies-carrying beavers. Any beavers introduced to Wales will be free of rabies, so don't worry about it.
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I can't not worry, now that you've put the notion of Force-using beavers plotting to create a new plague through mental concentration into our heads! They'll be an unstoppably destructive murderteam, felling trees in the day time and creating new viruses at night! What few Welsh survive the floods will be riddled with a new airborne form of rabies. I think it's no exaggeration to say that this is clearly going to be the inexorable destruction of the entire principality and all therein. It's long past time to panic, this is the exact plot of a Resident Evil game and they're doing it for real!!!
 
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