The Biden Presidency

[wareyin]

"praised" and "pushed" speaking of hand waving. show me the action. Show me where they did something to make this a reality.

Your statement is going to look really silly in a moment:

they did nothing. Not a goddamned thing about it.

Nothing at all, huh? Wait for it:

Because of Progressive gains. and even then 6 Dems opposed the Raise the Wage Act vs 3 Republicans that supported it. And the marijuana legalization bills provide ways for hedge funds to buy in but not to expunge the records and free nonviolent drug offenders. Which lines up with well know progressive *checks notes* John Boehner.

D'oh! 2 paragraph breaks ago you were claiming nothing was done, now you're taking credit for it! Hoo boy, that's some Trump levels of chutzpah! Yeah, those what, 6 progressive members of Congress are why the bills passed, not the rest of the centrist Dems!

Did you intentionally conflate the Senate with the House of Representatives? or are you that in over your head?

We have been discussing both, and I'm continuing to discuss both. Try not to get confused, please.

When one gets welcomed with open arms by the party leadership, it does.

As this both only happened in your fevered imagination, as well as only applies to those who currently claim to be Republican, no. It doesn't.

No, I'm asking if you think Porter and Levin flipping those seats was so easy, why didn't the Dems do it already?

I think that electing Dems from CA and NY is easy precisely because they have been doing so for a long time.

Ya, you're in over your head. Maybe just watch and listen for a little while.

Sorry it was your list of 4 names (of whom only one appears an active politician) and no quotes, which means it isn't my responsibility to figure out what you meant to say.

No, he is just inconvenient for you.

Nonsense. Manchin is not representative of centrist Dems or the Democratic party at all, and pretending that he is is simply dishonest.

Or you can support your claim, as is what you're supposed to do here.

That's rich, given all the support for your claims that you've provided. Tell you what, you provide an example of the 1930s Germany ads you're complaining about, and then I can find which Dem spoke out against it. As it stands, you're asking me to prove someone spoke out against something that you haven't provided evidence had happened.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

I don't believe you are. It appears convenient to pretend you are, but you don't normally seem to struggle with simple concepts so much.







A bit of a false dichotomy there, huh? Are you so vain as to claim to be the one progressive using those tactics to harm a Biden campaign in the general election? And that you only did so here and nowhere else? I think not. You didn't come up with the claims, you simply ran with the claims everyone else in your circle was making.



Once that tactic failed, you grudgingly voted in your own self interest. And now you want some sort of reward and/or praise for it. "After we stopped trying to convince everyone not to vote for Biden he won, so we were essential to that win" misrepresents your role.







Went to bat for Biden? Who? Where? How? What exactly did they do? I certainly never saw anything.







I think the progressives are going to complain unreasonably no matter who is selected or how many more policies they support get enacted by those ebil centrist meanies. I think this because they already are, and have been doing so a long time.

Omar and Tlaib both ran huge "get out the vote" campaigns in their respective states that were key to delivering victory in those swing states. Ilhan's district had 88% turnout. They easily could have won their own races without such an effort.

But yeah, some podcasters and Twitter nobodies made fun of Biden, so it's a wash.

 

[Aridas]

This has indeed been a big problem for progressives (or any group left of center in this country) for a long time. they didn't do the leg work. They showed up every 4 years and expected massive change. there are notable exceptions, but left-wing movements in the US tend to be more sizzle than steak.

However, that has changed. Progressives are making actual gains. Not just with candidates but with policy as well. Progressive ballot initiatives are winning in states like South Dakota, Missouri, and Florida. Progressive candidates like Katie Porter and Steve Levin flipping districts that had been red for decades. And instead of seeing a new energized voting bloc to engage, the establishment Dems attack them harder than they have ever attacked conservatives.

You have Democrats like Manchin, Donnely, Bredesen, and McCaskill openly attacking them in interviews. You have Democratic leadership changing the rules and consolidating power at the top. You have Congressional Democrats attacking Ilhan Omar for referencing a rap lyric to call out a lobbyist while not saying a goddamned thing about republicans practically quoting from the Protocols of Zion to scare their base. You have constant finger-wagging and lecturing from a bunch of professional second-place finishers who are still treating this like it's still the 80s.

So, yes, progressives were not great about organizing and engaging in the system. But now that they are, they are getting shut out by the people that are supposed to be on their team.

Without getting too deeply involved in this discussion, I feel like poking towards the New Jersey Democrats who outright tried to gerrymander New Jersey just a couple years ago... seemingly because they were worried about increasing power and enthusiasm from the more progressive part of the party. The attempt to railroad it in was derailed, thankfully, because Democrats, especially progressives, actually have principles and act upon them on the subject.

Because it's opposed by the donor class. The party is completely captured by wealthy interests.

I disagree with "completely" there. I will certainly agree that the wealthy interests wield far, far more influence than they should, though. I'm ever reminded of the anti-BDS vote, though. Clear violation of the 1st Amendment. All but one of the Republican house members and about half of the Democratic Party house members voted for it. It serves as a pretty good representation of my thoughts on the level of problems in the parties, I think.

Wait, you think actively working to prevent his election was no actual harm? But since convincing others not to vote for him failed, and you eventually grudgingly held your nose and voted in your own self interest, you should be praised?

To be clear, are you complaining about many progressives having supported other Democratic candidates in the primaries? I certainly didn't see progressives actively work to prevent his election for the general. Very much the opposite, really.

 

[acbytesla]

Biden's popular vote mandate increases

Joe Biden expands his lead over soon to be the country's jilted ex. But Donnie did pass a milestone.

President Elect Joe Biden: 80,349,702

#Diaper Don: 74,001,402

Difference for America: 6,348,300

 

[dudalb]

I think in his inaugrual Biden needs to channel Winston CHurchill, and give give a staright up speech that does not sugar coat the problems the US faces, a "I have nothing to offer but blood, toil,tears and sweat' style speech. i thas been along time since we have a national leader give the kind of speech.

 

[wareyin]

Omar and Tlaib both ran huge "get out the vote" campaigns in their respective states that were key to delivering victory in those swing states. Ilhan's district had 88% turnout. They easily could have won their own races without such an effort.

But yeah, some podcasters and Twitter nobodies made fun of Biden, so it's a wash.

I see. Asking people to vote for themselves was going to bat for Biden in your eyes.

And hey, we've gotten you to admit that it was actually a massive social media campaign aimed at convincing people not to vote for Biden and not just little old you all on your lonesome. That's some progress at least!

 

[wareyin]

To be clear, are you complaining about many progressives having supported other Democratic candidates in the primaries? I certainly didn't see progressives actively work to prevent his election for the general. Very much the opposite, really.

No, and I thought repeatedly specifying that I was not talking about in the primaries and that I was talking about the general election made that clear.

 

[Distracted1]

I think in his inaugrual Biden needs to channel Winston CHurchill, and give give a staright up speech that does not sugar coat the problems the US faces, a "I have nothing to offer but blood, toil,tears and sweat' style speech. i thas been along time since we have a national leader give the kind of speech.

Well, we did have Jimmy Carter telling us to turn the thermostat down and put on a sweater. That has got to count for something.

 

[Donal]

I'd personally love to see that. Maybe point out how things will get worse before they get better, but we can get through it together.

But I can't imagine how that would play out in the media.

 

[acbytesla]

I think in his inaugrual Biden needs to channel Winston CHurchill, and give give a staright up speech that does not sugar coat the problems the US faces, a "I have nothing to offer but blood, toil,tears and sweat' style speech. i thas been along time since we have a national leader give the kind of speech.

I cannot disagree more. Churchill was a racist right wing leader whose rhetoric was perfect for inspiring England to make it through the war. But Churchill was a lousy peace time leader

I don't think the nation should focus on sacrifice, but on working to improve the lives of eveyone. One can be direct, honest and yet appeal to our better angels. Jimmy Carter tried the approach you're describing with his malaise speech and was excoriated for it. I think Carter was right in what he said and yet it was politically stupid for him to say it.

 

[Donal]

I cannot disagree more. Churchill was a racist right wing leader whose rhetoric was perfect for inspiring England to make it through the war. But Churchill was a lousy peace time leader

I mean, ya, but that doesn't mean you can't take a few pointers from his rhetorical style. Just because there isn't an enemy shooting at you doesn't mean you aren't in a fight.

I don't think the nation should focus on sacrifice, but on working to improve the lives of everyone.

They aren't mutually exclusive

One can be direct, honest and yet appeal to our better angels. Jimmy Carter tried the approach you're describing with his malaise speech and was excoriated for it. I think Carter was right in what he said and yet it was politically stupid for him to say it.

Or maybe times have changed a little and you can take that approach, if somewhat modified?

 

[acbytesla]

I mean, ya, but that doesn't mean you can't take a few pointers from his rhetorical style. Just because there isn't an enemy shooting at you doesn't mean you aren't in a fight.

They aren't mutually exclusive

Or maybe times have changed a little and you can take that approach, if somewhat modified?

No question that Churchill was a great speaker. His cadence in particular was excellent. I saw it copied somewhat in JFK's/-Ted Sorensen's speeches. Tremendously effective. But the content of sacrifice is not going to sell. It didn't work for Churchill after the war and it didn't work for Carter (granted Carter didn't have Churchill's flair) and I don't think it's going to work at this time.

 

[Firestone]

Joe Biden expands his lead over soon to be the country's jilted ex. But Donnie did pass a milestone.

President Elect Joe Biden: 80,349,702

#Diaper Don: 74,001,402

Difference for America: 6,348,300

With the NYC absentee ballots added (finally), Biden's lead now 6.91 million.
Biden now has more than 81 million votes.

https://twitter.com/Redistrict/status/1333905142882689027?s=19

 

[acbytesla]

I made a huge mistake.

Biden crushed Trump in NYC'S 5 burroughs

Biden: 81,050,147

Trump: 74,112,769

Difference: 6,937,378

 

[acbytesla]

I made a huge mistake.

Biden crushed Trump in NYC'S 5 burroughs

Biden: 81,050,147

Trump: 74,112,769

Difference: 6,937,378

Wasserman is good. This was super close to his ballpark figure he made more than a week ago.

 

[acbytesla]

Just how bad Trump did in NY City.

These were the Absentee vote totals in each of NYC'S 5 boroughs. You would think they might treat a favorite son better.

Staten Island
Biden: 63%
Trump: 35%

Queens
Biden: 81%
Trump: 16%

Brooklyn
Biden: 85%
Trump:13%

Bronx
Biden:86%
Trump:12%

Manhattan:
Biden: 90%
Trump:8%

 

[TurkeysGhost]

I see. Asking people to vote for themselves was going to bat for Biden in your eyes.

And hey, we've gotten you to admit that it was actually a massive social media campaign aimed at convincing people not to vote for Biden and not just little old you all on your lonesome. That's some progress at least!

Tlaib won her district by 60 points. Omar won by 39 points. They could have sat back and still won handily. Give me a break with this willful obtuseness. They were out there running up the vote for Biden to win the state. Progressive activists getting out the vote in big cities in swing states is a non-trivial part of Biden's 2020 win, and if you were being even the slightest bit honest you would admit it.

 

[wareyin]

Tlaib won her district by 60 points. Omar won by 39 points. They could have sat back and still won handily. Give me a break with this willful obtuseness. They were out there running up the vote for Biden to win the state. Progressive activists getting out the vote in big cities in swing states is a non-trivial part of Biden's 2020 win, and if you were being even the slightest bit honest you would admit it.

Biden got more votes in Omar's district than she did. Are you certain that her campaign was at all helpful to him? Seems an honest person would admit that when a politician campaigns to get out the vote, they have their own election in mind.

I can't find a comparison of Biden vs Tliab votes with a quick Google, but I have no doubt that Biden outperformed her as well.

On a Tliab note, she is also being considered for spot onn Biden's team. Guess that's the evil centrist meanies keeping the progressives out again, isn't it? Or ... when Tliab does get the nod, suddenly she isn't progressive enough anymore right?

 

[Aridas]

No, and I thought repeatedly specifying that I was not talking about in the primaries and that I was talking about the general election made that clear.

You did specify that. It's just that I really have no idea what you could actually be referring to, then. As far as I saw, throughout the general election period, progressives pushed *hard* for Biden and then delivered, even with their reservations, which is the opposite of what you keep trying to claim happened.

Biden got more votes in Omar's district than she did. Are you certain that her campaign was at all helpful to him? Seems an honest person would admit that when a politician campaigns to get out the vote, they have their own election in mind.

I suppose that, based on this, I should conclude that you're quite set on trying to find some spin, any spin, to justify sweeping progressives under the rug and dismiss anything and everything that they could possibly have done.

On a Tliab note, she is also being considered for spot onn Biden's team. Guess that's the evil centrist meanies keeping the progressives out again, isn't it? Or ... when Tliab does get the nod, suddenly she isn't progressive enough anymore right?

*headdesk*

Oooooo. Considered. Yeah, that's totally proof that progressives don't have reason for concern with the picks already announced, individually and overall, and the likely consequences of such. Seriously, take a few steps back and actually consider why you're trying to piss all over legitimate concerns using such... "wonderful" arguments.

 

[acbytesla]

Biden got more votes in Omar's district than she did. Are you certain that her campaign was at all helpful to him? Seems an honest person would admit that when a politician campaigns to get out the vote, they have their own election in mind.

I can't find a comparison of Biden vs Tliab votes with a quick Google, but I have no doubt that Biden outperformed her as well.

On a Tliab note, she is also being considered for spot onn Biden's team. Guess that's the evil centrist meanies keeping the progressives out again, isn't it? Or ... when Tliab does get the nod, suddenly she isn't progressive enough anymore right?

Minnesota 5th
Biden: 328,764. 80%
Omar: 255, 920. 64%

Michigan 13th
Rashida Tliab 223,205. 78.1%
Biden:
Can't find precisely Biden's number in the 13th, but I see indications he outperformed Tliab by about 5 points.