Cont: The Trump Presidency: Part 26

[Blue Mountain]

Another take on this. The first COVID-19 death in the US was 276 days ago. Since then 275,131 Americans have died from it.

The attacks of September 11, 2001 killed 2,977 Americans. COVID-19 deaths are currently at 92 × 9/11 deaths, or the equivalent of one 9/11 attack every three days.

The 9/11 attack brought the nation together and spurred a massive response—and an equally massive expenditure of money and people. Just imagine what the response would be if terrorists managed to perpetrate such a massive attack every three days in the States? Instead you have a president who essentially denies there's a problem, and people going to their graves insisting they're not suffering from a "non-existent" disease.

 

[rdaneel]

My answer: as of November 30, just short of 151,000.

Being in Canada, I usually compare Canada and the US. The Canadian government was initially slow to react, but once it did its messaging has been consistent and cautious. Unfortunately, the second wave started hitting us in October and November, with a surge in new cases and deaths.

The population of the United States is 8.6 times that of Canada. Based on population alone, all other things being equal, one can expect the number of deaths from COVID-19 to be 8.6 times that of Canada.

One thing that is decidedly not equal is the extreme outlying numbers in New York State, currently at 1,777 deaths per million population. There's nothing comparable to it in Canada; the worst hit province is Quebec, and their death rate is half that of New York's at 830/million. Therefore, in the following table I attempt to even out the numbers by subtracting out New York State's population and deaths, then applying the resulting deaths/million to the entire US population.

US population |

330.986​

| million
Less: population of New York State |

19.456​

| million
Adjusted population |

311.530​

| million
Total US deaths to 3 November |

275,131​

| worldometer.com (831/million)
Less: deaths in New York State |

345770​

| worldometer.com (1777/million)
Adjusted death count |

240,554​

| (=275,131 - 34,577)
Adjusted deaths/adjusted million population |

772​

| (=240,554 ÷ 311.530)
Adjusted total deaths |

225,577​

| (=772.0 × 330.986)
Deaths in Canada to 3 November |

12,181​

| canada.ca/coronavirus (323/million)
Expected US deaths based on Canada:US ratio |

104,757​

| (=12,181 × 8.6 [Canada:US population ratio])
Excess US fatalities compared to Canada |

150,821​

| (=225,577 - 104,757)

Based on this analysis, there are more than 150,000 excess deaths compared to Canada after evening out the numbers from New York State. In my opinion, a huge number of these are due to the inept response of the Trump administration. Another factor is the push by Trump to get the economy going again in hopes of boosting his re-election chances, and governors willing to follow that advice. And some of it is due to the tendency of Americans to distrust their government.

And doesn't this sort of assume a response starting at about the same time Trump was first informed of it?
Clinton likely would still have had CDC staff in China that probably would have warned her much sooner and she would have been prepared with an actual pandemic response team and playbook.
I would also assume she would have reached out to our allies and helped to coordinate containment protocols that might have helped slow the spread globally.
It seems to me that United States is a powerful enough country that a proper, timely response could have had a huge impact inside and outside of our borders.

 

[acbytesla]

And doesn't this sort of assume a response starting at about the same time Trump was first informed of it?
Clinton likely would still have had CDC staff in China that probably would have warned her much sooner and she would have been prepared with an actual pandemic response team and playbook.
I would also assume she would have reached out to our allies and helped to coordinate containment protocols that might have helped slow the spread globally.
It seems to me that United States is a powerful enough country that a proper, timely response could have had a huge impact inside and outside of our borders.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[Roger Ramjets]

Another take on this. The first COVID-19 death in the US was 276 days ago. Since then 275,131 Americans have died from it.

The attacks of September 11, 2001 killed 2,977 Americans. COVID-19 deaths are currently at 92 × 9/11 deaths, or the equivalent of one 9/11 attack every three days.

The 9/11 attack brought the nation together and spurred a massive response—and an equally massive expenditure of money and people. Just imagine what the response would be if terrorists managed to perpetrate such a massive attack every three days in the States? Instead you have a president who essentially denies there's a problem, and people going to their graves insisting they're not suffering from a "non-existent" disease.

2,977 Americans killed is a tragedy, 275,131 are a statistic.

 

[Horatius]

And doesn't this sort of assume a response starting at about the same time Trump was first informed of it?
Clinton likely would still have had CDC staff in China that probably would have warned her much sooner and she would have been prepared with an actual pandemic response team and playbook.

Conservatives today are crowing about new reports of "Leaked documents show China lied about Covid-19 case totals and mishandled pandemic", because they've been accusing China of lying all along.

Of course, they ignore the fact that anyone with sense expected China to lie about **** like this. That's why the US had their own people on the ground in China.

Or at least they did, until Trump cut that program.

We'd likely have known the truth of what was going on in China a lot sooner if those people had been allowed to continue doing their jobs.

 

[slyjoe]

Another take on this. The first COVID-19 death in the US was 276 days ago. Since then 275,131 Americans have died from it.

The attacks of September 11, 2001 killed 2,977 Americans. COVID-19 deaths are currently at 92 × 9/11 deaths, or the equivalent of one 9/11 attack every three days.

The 9/11 attack brought the nation together and spurred a massive response—and an equally massive expenditure of money and people. Just imagine what the response would be if terrorists managed to perpetrate such a massive attack every three days in the States? Instead you have a president who essentially denies there's a problem, and people going to their graves insisting they're not suffering from a "non-existent" disease.

I have thought about this too. What I remember is that we came together because we had an enemy that WASN'T US. They were foreigners, and America is know for sticking together when foreigners attack.

However, the same kind of response from leadership was evident. Because it didn't affect our daily lives, we were outraged, but didn't do much except send our troops to the wrong place. Bush encouraged everyone to go fly, go shopping, and ignore the problem.

With the pandemic it isn't affecting our lives ENOUGH for the general population to get riled up about it. I've often thought that if the virus was fast and severe enough (where you catch it and burst into flames within an hour), the response would be different.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

CNN just pushed news that the DOJ is investigating a “pay for pardon” scheme, revealed by court documents.

“The Justice Department is investigating a potential bribery scheme related to funneling money to the White House or related political committee in exchange for a presidential pardon, court records reveal.”

I’m sure more will follow...

 

[dirtywick]

Historically, handling a pay for pardon scheme would be one of the line items in Trumps personal lawyer job description. Not that Giuliani is the type of guy that would act as a liaison between Trump and less than reputable characters, but it’s also reported he was asking for a preemptive pardon for crimes unknown.

Ah probably just fake news.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

An interesting question is can Trump still pardon someone when he or an associate has taken payment for that pardon?

It seems likely not, but I’m sure the courts will have to rule on it and there’s no telling these days.

 

[TragicMonkey]

An interesting question is can Trump still pardon someone when he or an associate has taken payment for that pardon?

It seems likely not, but I’m sure the courts will have to rule on it and there’s no telling these days.

He'll pardon everyone for participating in a corrupt pardon scheme.

 

[Resume]

Georgia elections official Gabriel Sterling emotionally spoke out about the threats made toward election officials in the wake of the 2020 election, particularly criticizing President Trump and Republican lawmakers who have not spoken out.

Think Trump will call out threats?

Bwahahahahahahahahaha!!

If anything, he'll encourage more.

 

[Blue Mountain]

And doesn't this sort of assume a response starting at about the same time Trump was first informed of it?
Clinton likely would still have had CDC staff in China that probably would have warned her much sooner and she would have been prepared with an actual pandemic response team and playbook.
I would also assume she would have reached out to our allies and helped to coordinate containment protocols that might have helped slow the spread globally.
It seems to me that United States is a powerful enough country that a proper, timely response could have had a huge impact inside and outside of our borders.

Excellent points. I'm basing the excess deaths in the US based on Canada's response, which in turn may have been hampered by having to rely on China and the World Health Organization for data. If the US still had people in China when the initial outbreak occurred, not only the US but its allies could have had a significant lead in handling this. Also, had the US jumped on this much earlier I think Trudeau might have been emboldened to act sooner as well.

 

[Trebuchet]

Conservatives today are crowing about new reports of "Leaked documents show China lied about Covid-19 case totals and mishandled pandemic", because they've been accusing China of lying all along.

Of course, they ignore the fact that anyone with sense expected China to lie about **** like this. That's why the US had their own people on the ground in China.

Or at least they did, until Trump cut that program.

We'd likely have known the truth of what was going on in China a lot sooner if those people had been allowed to continue doing their jobs.

Of course China lied. That's what authoritarian regimes (like Trump's) do. We've known they were lying since February or so. Just like Trump.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Another take on this. The first COVID-19 death in the US was 276 days ago. Since then 275,131 Americans have died from it.

The attacks of September 11, 2001 killed 2,977 Americans. COVID-19 deaths are currently at 92 × 9/11 deaths, or the equivalent of one 9/11 attack every three days.

The 9/11 attack brought the nation together and spurred a massive response—and an equally massive expenditure of money and people. Just imagine what the response would be if terrorists managed to perpetrate such a massive attack every three days in the States? Instead you have a president who essentially denies there's a problem, and people going to their graves insisting they're not suffering from a "non-existent" disease.

By that logic, there is a lot of multiple 9-11s.

What are you doing about heart disease?

 

[crescent]

If you illegally bribe the President to give you a pardon, and he actually then pardons you -- can you later get unpardoned??

I mean, none of this can likely be proven or stopped until after pardons have been granted. The pardons may appear to be legal at the time they are granted, and even after Trump leaves office.

Justice Department investigating potential presidential pardon bribery scheme, court records reveal

 

[Aridas]

Of course China lied. That's what authoritarian regimes (like Trump's) do. We've known they were lying since February or so. Just like Trump.

I think there's another point that should definitely be made here. "We," the public, may have known that they were lying since February or so. The information about China almost certainly lying and the potential actual threat that was posed was known in the government much, much sooner than that - at least as early as back in early November 2019 sooner. That particular one apparently crossed Trump's desk in early January - with the delay likely having much to do with how Trump worked and the people he surrounded himself with.

 

[fromdownunder]

By that logic, there is a lot of multiple 9-11s.

What are you doing about heart disease?

1. Preventative medications like blood thinners and cholesterol control.
2. Nitroglycerin pump sprays.
3. Angiograms
4. Exercise Regimes
5. Pacemakers
6. Bypass surgery
7. Heart transplants.
8. Regular blood tests and medical checks.



Norm

 

[autumn1971]

1. Preventative medications like blood thinners and cholesterol control.
2. Nitroglycerin pump sprays.
3. Angiograms
4. Exercise Regimes
5. Pacemakers
6. Bypass surgery
7. Heart transplants.
8. Regular blood tests and medical checks.



Norm

Yeah. The “people die from aging, why aren’t you fixing that first?” from some is kinda tiresome.

And most leaders other than Regan and the current *******-in-chief haven’t simply decided that ignoring massive public health issues will make them go away.

 

[Stacyhs]

By that logic, there is a lot of multiple 9-11s.

What are you doing about heart disease?

Putting healthy food in schools and taking out the vending machines full of crap. Oh wait...

The Trump administration has proposed new school lunch rules that critics say would allow for more pizzas, burgers and french fries to be served to children across the country instead of veggies — a cut to former first lady Michelle Obama’s signature achievement to try and make school lunches healthier.

The proposal was announced by the US Department of Agriculture on Friday, and would let schools cut the amount of fruits and veggies served up to the nearly 30 million American students in the public school system.

 

[Delphic Oracle]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3338317/#!po=2.17391

We haven't exactly been casual about it...

ETA: and for the 10,000th time:

HEART DISEASE ISNT ******* SPREAD THROUGH AEROSOLS/DROPLETS!