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Allegations of Fraud in 2020 US Election

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CaptainHowdy said:
The Russians hijacked our 2016 election with a couple of sock puppets on Facebook. It's not that difficult.
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Several Russian operatives, "officials in Unit 26165 and Unit 74455 of the Russian government’s Main Intelligence Directorate", were indicted in 2018 by a DoJ grand jury for cyber crimes following actions taken during the 2016 election.

Not sock puppets. Difficult thing to do for the average user.
 
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Here is the pdf of the instructions for canvassing Michigan votes:
https://www.michigan.gov/documents/sos/BCC_Manual_464331_7.pdf

Start from page 28/115 to see detailed instructions. There is some kind of "tape" to tally total voters. The discrepancies are votes that needed some special attention.

Wards/precincts of Wayne County
https://www.waynecountyoh.gov/precincts/voter-ward-precinct-maps

There are some 66 wards. If there were 43 (the max) of unresolved ballots per ward, that gives you 2800 votes. More likely there were 500-1000 unresolved votes, as a source named a typical number of votes per ward as 3.

Biden won the county by 323,000 votes. Whether the "2800" questionable ballots were included in the total is irrelevant. It is also irrelevant statewide, where Biden won at least by 140 000.

We do vote for everything in the same ballot, from dog catcher to president. So it may make a difference in the votes for dog catcher if those 2800 votes were counted.
 
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Tero said:
Wards/precincts of Wayne County
https://www.waynecountyoh.gov/precincts/voter-ward-precinct-maps

There are some 66 wards. If there were 43 (the max) of unresolved ballots per ward, that gives you 2800 votes. More likely there were 500-1000 unresolved votes, as a source named a typical number of votes per ward as 3.

Biden won the county by 323,000 votes. Whether the "2800" questionable ballots were included in the total is irrelevant. It is also irrelevant statewide, where Biden won at least by 140 000.

We do vote for everything in the same ballot, from dog catcher to president. So it may make a difference in the votes for dog catcher if those 2800 votes were counted.
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Thanks for the effort, but - just a suggestion - you might consider using Wayne County, Michigan for this rather than Wayne County, Ohio.
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
They've certainly backed themselves into a corner. Every attorney on that team is a high profile type. Every reputation is on the line. If they don't produce something absolutely jaw dropping in court they'll all be considered liars and fools forever more.

If the election was to be stolen thru the voting machines/software it wouldn't take that many people. You'd need a few employees on the inside to tinker with the machines/software. Some of the attorney claims mention witness testimony of Dominion employees. Dominion has recently skipped out of a public hearing in PA and lawyered up.

https://www.wfmz.com/news/area/penn...cle_6020da90-2ba1-11eb-8420-534f51eeb494.html
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Fail! The Georgia recount was done by hand.

Also, this Lin Wood fruitcake's claim is that Trump really won in a landslide, with 70% of the popular vote.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...very-different-view-election-pro-trump-media/

“Donald Trump won, I believe, clearly, a 70 percent-plus landslide election in the nation,” Lin Wood, an Atlanta-area attorney, said on Fox News host Mark Levin's radio show this week. “He probably won over 400 electoral votes.”​

For this to be true, Trump would have needed to get around 108 million of the approx 154 million votes so far cast. That would require about 30 million votes to be flipped from Trump to Biden to achieve the current 80 million to 74 million margin.

A quick bit of math (30/108) reveals that is 28% of all the votes cast for Trump - more than one in every four Trump voters had their vote flipped to Biden. Given that American voters can actually check their vote online (and I'm assuming the even the dumbest of Trump voters can still remember who they voted for) then it would not be very hard for any group of Trump supporters to prove this, by simply checking their votes.

* Note that as I keep checking the live results, Biden's lead is still increasing, so the vote flipping would need to still be going on. The FBI could swoop in a seize machines to check them for the alleged vote flipping software - so why has this not happened yet?
 
Oops. well, then maybe the 90 is the better number for "bad" wards. 90x43 is 3800 votes. If they were not for Biden, or could not be given to Biden because voter was in the wrong place to vote (so the vote is no good), then Biden wins by 137000.

There are 1100 Wards in Wayne county and there were no discrepancies in the tallies of about 1000 wards.
https://www.waynecounty.com/elected/clerk/election-results.aspx
 
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smartcooky said:
F

A quick bit of math (30/108) reveals that is 28% of all the votes cast for Trump - more than one in every four Trump voters had their vote flipped to Biden. Given that American voters can actually check their vote online (and I'm assuming the even the dumbest of Trump voters can still remember who they voted for) then it would not be very hard for any group of Trump supporters to prove this, by simply checking their votes.
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Huh? No they can't. Voting is anonymous. There's nothing tying a ballot to a person by the time it's counted. IIRC, in GA when doing a mail in ballot one person verifies the information in the outer envelope to make sure the ballot contained is from a valid voter and marks off the ballot. That ballot is then removed from the envelope and given to a second person who verifies that the ballot itself is good and then it's given to a third person to actually feed the ballot into the machine. Once it leaves the first person, there's no connection of the ballot to the voter.

The most voters in the US can do is see if their vote was counted and see the breakdown of how their county/precinct voted as a whole.
 
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smartcooky said:
Given that American voters can actually check their vote online (and I'm assuming the even the dumbest of Trump voters can still remember who they voted for) then it would not be very hard for any group of Trump supporters to prove this, by simply checking their votes.
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Voters in some states who voted by some methods may be able to verify if their vote was counted. In no case is there a means for anyone, including the voter, to verify which candidate someone voted for. That would be a huge problem for protecting the secrecy of votes.
 
More Detroit

In a press conference Thursday, President Donald Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, claimed to have evidence of voter fraud in Michigan based on sworn affidavits from four individuals. According to Giuliani, those four affiants reported seeing "thousands and thousands" of Biden ballots in what appeared to be a food truck hauled into the Detroit, Michigan polling center at 4:30 a.m after all Republican inspectors had left the site.

"What they swear to is that at 4:30 in the morning a truck pulled up to the Detroit center where they were counting ballots. The people thought it was food so they all ran to the truck. Wasn't food. It was thousands and thousands of ballots," Giuliani said.

Republican challenger Andrew Sitto implied the "tens of thousands of ballots" he saw cast for former vice president Joe Biden were proof of fraud, but the judge considered those ballots "not surprising."

"It is not surprising that many of the votes being observed by Mr. Sitto were votes cast for Mr. Biden in light of the fact that former Vice President Biden received approximately 220,000 more votes than President Trump," Judge Kenny wrote in his ruling.

Sitto also suggested that the batch of ballots referenced previously were somehow different because they were brought in through the back from vehicles with out-of-state license plates.
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Er, most rental trucks have out of state plates.
https://www.cnn.com/business/live-n...nformation/h_a6f9f4db41324634af5cda8e5f252fab
 
Hlafordlaes said:
Several Russian operatives, "officials in Unit 26165 and Unit 74455 of the Russian government’s Main Intelligence Directorate", were indicted in 2018 by a DoJ grand jury for cyber crimes following actions taken during the 2016 election.

Not sock puppets. Difficult thing to do for the average user.
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Trump has now done more to undermine US democracy than anything the Russians could do.

His legacy will be a lack of faith in the voting system that will be very difficult to restore.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Okay, so remember those affidavits by the two Wayne County officials who wanted to rescind their votes to certify the results? Here's something that hasn't been widely reported: they were attached to a Notice of Voluntary Dismissal, filed by Giuliani. In other words, they're intended to make headlines, to distract from the fact that Trump & co are dropping the case.
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Yes, Rudy said as much at their presser the other day that the case had been dropped as they were to receive an audit.

dirtywick said:
They did a hand recount in GA bro
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Yes, they did. They counted the same ballots as were counted the first time without checking to see if they were legal or not. They also found several thousand uncounted ballots that were added to the count this time. Good deal.
 
Nessie said:
Trump has now done more to undermine US democracy than anything the Russians could do.

His legacy will be a lack of faith in the voting system that will be very difficult to restore.
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One could make the same argument against Al Gore.......
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
I looked it up too. Isn't that crazy? Why in the World would anyone have such a law? You could never check for fraud after the first count if there was an "out of balance". Every election will have a few issues. It's hard to believe MI citizens would accept it.
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It's one of those cases where I assume I must be missing something, because on the surface, it looks so incredibly stupid that it can't possibly to be true.

It seems like they are saying that if something happens which suggests an error or fraud (i.e the ballot count doesn't balance), you are not allowed to take a step which might help fix the error. Moreover, this is due to a clause that would have to be deliberately inserted into the law. If they had simply overlooked some possibility and forgot to add a clause to correct a problem, I could understand it, but it seems like they deliberately invented the clause and inserted it to prevent fixing a problem.

I find it so puzzling that I cannot even come up with an explanation of what they were trying to accomplish with the law.




If anyone can figure it out, please offer up a suggestion, because it seems nuts to me.
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
One could make the same argument against Al Gore.......
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That made me search for Al Gore and election fraud, which found this interesting article from 2016;

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...rigged-election-bush-gore-florida-voter-fraud

" The history of 'rigged' US elections: from Bush v Gore to Trump v Clinton...
The battle over Florida ripped a veil off a dysfunctional system and offered an opportunity for meaningful electoral reform and new forms of political warfare"

Confidence has been declining in the voting system and Trump has pushed hard against an already opening door. This is from 4 years ago;

"Opinion polls suggest that Trump’s charges of a “rigged election” have struck a nerve: 41% of voters believe him when he says the election could be stolen, according to one survey. More than two-thirds of all Republicans believe that if Hillary Clinton is declared the winner, it will be because of illegal voting or vote-rigging, according to another."
 
Meadmaker said:
It's one of those cases where I assume I must be missing something, because on the surface, it looks so incredibly stupid that it can't possibly to be true.

It seems like they are saying that if something happens which suggests an error or fraud (i.e the ballot count doesn't balance), you are not allowed to take a step which might help fix the error. Moreover, this is due to a clause that would have to be deliberately inserted into the law. If they had simply overlooked some possibility and forgot to add a clause to correct a problem, I could understand it, but it seems like they deliberately invented the clause and inserted it to prevent fixing a problem.

I find it so puzzling that I cannot even come up with an explanation of what they were trying to accomplish with the law.




If anyone can figure it out, please offer up a suggestion, because it seems nuts to me.
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Why do people accept the TSA? People just don't think about these things.
 
ChrisBFRPKY said:
Yes, they did. They counted the same ballots as were counted the first time without checking to see if they were legal or not. They also found several thousand uncounted ballots that were added to the count this time. Good deal.
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Dropping the voting machine nonsense then. Good deal.
 
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