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Allegations of Fraud in 2020 US Election

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smartcooky said:
Need to keep following along with this thread. Rudy is being handed his arse!

ETA: OMG, he's making a complete fool of himself

"Rudy, at one point, accidentally suggests a FAR MORE LENIENT TEST FAVORING THE STATE because he doesn't understand what's going on. The judge, who is honest, corrects him and gently redirects him to the general vicinity of what he should be talking about."
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Almost feel bad for him. Almost.
 
BobTheCoward said:
Yes. Two people agree the claim is true. Most claims have substantially more than two people claiming it.
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What is you evidence for this assertion, and why would it be relevant?

BTW I have been on the jury of two criminal cases that resulted in convictions, and in both cases:-

1. only one person (the victim) claimed to have witnessed the crime itself.

2. It rested on their testimony of what the perpetrator(s) said.

3. we believed them.
 
smartcooky said:
Need to keep following along with this thread. Rudy is being handed his arse!

ETA: OMG, he's making a complete fool of himself

"Rudy, at one point, accidentally suggests a FAR MORE LENIENT TEST FAVORING THE STATE because he doesn't understand what's going on. The judge, who is honest, corrects him and gently redirects him to the general vicinity of what he should be talking about."
Click to expand...

Basically, Rudy's whole gig at this hearing has been to parrot Trump tweets. They've got no legal argument but that there was nationwide fraud, and that's why they need to have this hearing about curing votes in Pennsylvania.
 
smartcooky said:
Need to keep following along with this thread. Rudy is being handed his arse!

ETA: OMG, he's making a complete fool of himself

"Rudy, at one point, accidentally suggests a FAR MORE LENIENT TEST FAVORING THE STATE because he doesn't understand what's going on. The judge, who is honest, corrects him and gently redirects him to the general vicinity of what he should be talking about."
Click to expand...

I especially liked this one:

Rudy has moved past failing the "adequate advocate" test and is rounding the bend on failing the man woman person camera tv test.
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bignickel said:
I'm curious; has anyone out there applied Benford's Law to the 2000 and 2004 elections? I'm thinking if you took the half-ass and incomplete data from different reports back then during election day, you'd get the same effed-up results as armchair mathematicians are getting now. I searched interwebs and couldn't find anything (because every page out there mentioned Benfords is only interested in this election).
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The application of Benford's law to elections seems problematic at best.


Fact check: Deviation from Benford’s Law does not prove election fraud

I've got a hard time figuring exactly how you might try to apply it given that populations in an area are limited and just some percentage of that is voting for one over the other. It's just not like the typical normally random naturally accruing values where Benford's law would be applicable.


This part of the article seems, at least to me, a reasonable try.


The specific case of the Milwaukee results was also examined by Professor Boud Roukema of Poland’s Nicolaus Copernicus University. Roukema considered the application of Benford’s Law to the 2009 Iranian elections (arxiv.org/abs/0906.2789) . He told Reuters by email: "A major flaw in applying Benford's law to the Milwaukee results is that the logarithmic distribution - how many "powers of tens" there are - in the numbers of votes per ward in Milwaukee is very narrow. In other words, half of all the wards have total votes from about 570 to 1200, and the logarithmic average (mean) is about 800.

“Biden overall got about 70% of the votes in Milwaukee. So the most likely vote for Biden (in the simplest model, assuming no falsification) in a typical Milwaukee ward is something like 0.7 times 800, which is 560 votes. We expect about half the Biden votes to lie between about 400 and 850 in typical Milwaukee wards.

“So the most popular first digit of the votes for Biden should be 5 - the first digit of 560 - and 4s and 6s and 7s should also be reasonably frequent.

“This is just what we see in the blue vertical bars in top left figure in the diagram at (here). So Benford's law reasoning, applied to the real data, shows no reason to suspect fraud here.”
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Some years ago having had trouble finding house numbers 1, 5 and 3, all of the same style, to put on our new house, I found Benford's law. Having just joined the forum, I E-mailed Mr. Randi about it. Telling him the story and asking if he thought it might eventually get used to support some outlandish idea about numerology or other nonsense. He replied saying he couldn't recall it having been done and that it was an interesting question, noting that his expectation would be that people would eventually use just about anything to support their beliefs. Only took about 12.5 years.
 
Adjourned until Wednesday

"Judge: That's the end of my questions so let's discuss post-hearing matters. I will let plaintiffs file opposition to the motion to dismiss by end of tomorrow

Rudy: the what now

Judge: the brief in opposition to the motion to dismiss

Rudy: do we have leave to amend

Judge: . . ."

Rudy really is a walking, talking disaster area!

"So schedule is opposition end of Wednesday, reply noon Thursday. Judge also suggests that technically plaintiffs need new motion for injunction since old one is mooted by amended complaint. Every indication he plans to rule swiftly."
 
Time for trumpism to start calling guiliani part of the deep state. I don't know if they can flip perception like a trump debate performance.
 
I just read that the republican rep on the elections board in Michigan has refused to certify the ballot count from Wayne County (Detroit). You want to see a court case that gets won, just wait for Biden to file.

"What are your grounds for not certifying the election?"
"There was election fraud"
"What is the evidence for that?"
"There is a lot"
"Why haven't you presented it in court? "
"We did but the judges ruled against us."
 
pgwenthold said:
I just read that the republican rep on the elections board in Michigan has refused to certify the ballot count from Wayne County (Detroit). You want to see a court case that gets won, just wait for Biden to file.

"What are your grounds for not certifying the election?"
"There was election fraud"
"What is the evidence for that?"
"There is a lot"
"Why haven't you presented it in court? "
"We did but the judges ruled against us."
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Court case is unnecessary. It goes up to the state board to canvas.
 
trustbutverify said:
Are you serious? Both parties agree on what was said.
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Is it possible Graham could broach the topic of throwing out all votes from counties with a high rate of signature mismatches without quite realizing that what he's asking is, "Can you throw away legal votes?"

Because of course you can't, Lindsey, you dunce. But maybe top Republican leadership is so far down the rabbit hole they don't even understand what they are saying right now.

This makes me wonder - they keep the ballots; do they keep the envelopes? How could this be audited in a meaningful way?
 
Minoosh said:
Is it possible Graham could broach the topic of throwing out all votes from counties with a high rate of signature mismatches without quite realizing that what he's asking is, "Can you throw away legal votes?"

Because of course you can't, Lindsey, you dunce. But maybe top Republican leadership is so far down the rabbit hole they don't even understand what they are saying right now.

This makes me wonder - they keep the ballots; do they keep the envelopes? How could this be audited in a meaningful way?
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California keeps the envelopes for 22 months

https://www.capradio.org/articles/2...ifornia-counties-it-gets-recycled-eventually/
 
pgwenthold said:
I just read that the republican rep on the elections board in Michigan has refused to certify the ballot count from Wayne County (Detroit). You want to see a court case that gets won, just wait for Biden to file.

"What are your grounds for not certifying the election?"
"There was election fraud"
"What is the evidence for that?"
"There is a lot"
"Why haven't you presented it in court? "
"We did but the judges ruled against us."
Click to expand...

Article:

https://www.freep.com/story/news/lo...yne-county-election-certification/6309668002/

The Wayne County Board of Canvassers has four members, appointed, two Republican and two Democratic. The two Republicans voted not to certify the canvas.

Having refused to certify the results, the documentation has to be provided to the Michigan Board of State Canvassers, who also consist of two Republicans and two Democrats. They meet tomorrow morning, although not for certification. The agenda just includes an update on the progress of the canvassing. I would assume that what they expected was, "All the counties are done." With this development, things could get ugly.

I couldn't find anything which would tell me what happens now. I'm guessing that as long as the state board doesn't do the same thing, i.e. the GOP reps on the state board don't go along with this farce, then everything's fine. If the state board members play along, and refuse to certify, I don't know who decides. The lawyers will be out in force for sure.

ETA: The article contains a quote claiming that no county board of canvassers has ever before refused to certify a set of election results.
 
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smartcooky said:
Need to keep following along with this thread. Rudy is being handed his arse!

ETA: OMG, he's making a complete fool of himself
Click to expand...

That my friends is what $20000 a day can buy you.

The finest legal minds in the business (people are saying)

worth every cent.

You are all going to be so tired of all the winning.

Though it does behoove an enquiring mind to ponder:

i) is Rudy being paid in advance?
ii) if he's just invoicing Trump, is he more likely to be fired than paid?
iii) if he does get fired will he sue?
iv) if he does sue who will represent him, and what level of scrutiny will they request?
v) has he tucked in his shirt?
 
She's right.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/n...fying-november-3-election-results/6324274002/

ETA: Probably a key part of the change of heart:

"The change in course was approved by the two Republican and two Democratic canvassers with the demand that the Secretary of State's office conduct an audit of unbalanced absentee counting board results."

Basically, there were, in fact, a lot of errors in the counting. More than there ought to be. It only affected a small number of votes, but it wasn't a good outcome. So, it looks like the canvassers talked amongst themselves and agreed to certify the results in exchange for an official examination of the process in Wayne County, especially in Detroit. Seems fair.
 
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