Thermal
August Member
They say the dead guy had a knife and wouldn't drop it as he advanced on the cops. So the cops cracked off about seven shots each. That's a lot of bullets to stop a guy walking with a knife.
Riots, looting, vandalism, etc.
- Thread starter Puppycow
- Start date
They say the dead guy had a knife and wouldn't drop it as he advanced on the cops. So the cops cracked off about seven shots each. That's a lot of bullets to stop a guy walking with a knife.
CaptainHowdy
Graduate Poster
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2012
- Messages
- 1,819
They cracked off as many shots as was required to stop the guy with the knife. If you want to feel a sense of outrage the question to ask is: how many times was the guy shot after he dropped the knife and fell to the ground?
CaptainHowdy
Graduate Poster
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2012
- Messages
- 1,819
Until an unarmed black man is able to peacefully threaten law enforcement with a knife without the fear of being shot for no reason, your hair care products will never be safe. NO JUSTICE NO WEAVES!!!
Thermal
August Member
How many shots were required to drop him? I'd guess one, maybe two. In the video the cops are still cracking off shots as he falls to the ground. Can't be too careful with their kind, right? Keep shooting even as the body hits the floor..
https://www.instagram.com/tv/CG0sweiBKpX/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
Thermal
August Member
Damn straight. Cuz they will shoot till you are full horizontal. You or I would likely go down for murder if we kept shooting as he was falling, but hey...it's not like he was an upstanding young white citizen, amirite?
bonzombiekitty
Graduate Poster
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2011
- Messages
- 1,848
A bit of clarity on why people in Philly are so upset about the shooting.
According to the guy's family, he was having a mental break and they called for an ambulance. Instead of getting the help they were expecting, the police showed up and just escalated the situation. They didn't have tazers, so they shot him.
Even if in the moment the police had a reasonable fear for their safety, there's a lot of issues that lead up to that moment.
According to the guy's family, he was having a mental break and they called for an ambulance. Instead of getting the help they were expecting, the police showed up and just escalated the situation. They didn't have tazers, so they shot him.
Even if in the moment the police had a reasonable fear for their safety, there's a lot of issues that lead up to that moment.
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2003
- Messages
- 61,796
I'm not sure why the number of shots is supposed to tell you all that much.
Here's body cam of another police shooting of an attacker with a knife:
https://twitter.com/FJNewsReporter/status/1283259326501662720
I count the officer firing nine times before the attacker goes down. A lot of the shots probably missed, and watching the video I can't tell which ones hit. In the heat of the moment I bet the officer couldn't tell either.
Last edited:
Nakani
Graduate Poster
Every body knows this. There are rules citizens follow when interacting with the police. Black people aren't exempt.
When they are white, nobody cares, "Man with knife shot by police", Wooptee doo.
uke2se
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2010
- Messages
- 14,424
How should black people interact with the police to avoid being shot? There are many people who would like to know.
Not complying with instructions can result in being shot. Not complying with instructions quickly enough can result in being shot. Complying with instructions can result in being shot. Standing around can result in being choked out.
What's the magic recepie?
TurkeysGhost
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Apr 2, 2018
- Messages
- 35,043
Who could have predicted a man having a mental health crisis would not respond rationally to the fear of being shot?
Bikewer
Penultimate Amazing
As noted, we are taught to shoot until the threat ends. In a situation like this, with both officers and suspect moving, shots are going to miss, or hit “peripheral” areas.
The Taser is not an appropriate weapon in such a circumstance, they simply are not reliable enough. I just watched a video in a very similar circumstance, a man with a knife advancing on a female officer. She shoots him with the Taser, and he dutifully falls down.... And almost immediately gets up and continues his attack, stabbing her (fortunately in the vest). The officers end up shooting him....
In cases like this.... What do you do? The fellow is having perhaps a psychotic break, or he’s in full drug-induced paranoia. He’s armed, and is dangerous to anyone around him.
You’re not likely to call a “mental health worker” to “de-escalate this fellow while he’s armed and charging around at people. You can’t talk them down as they are far from rational... They’re not even hearing you.
These are extremely dangerous and volatile situations that can go south in an instant.
The Taser is not an appropriate weapon in such a circumstance, they simply are not reliable enough. I just watched a video in a very similar circumstance, a man with a knife advancing on a female officer. She shoots him with the Taser, and he dutifully falls down.... And almost immediately gets up and continues his attack, stabbing her (fortunately in the vest). The officers end up shooting him....
In cases like this.... What do you do? The fellow is having perhaps a psychotic break, or he’s in full drug-induced paranoia. He’s armed, and is dangerous to anyone around him.
You’re not likely to call a “mental health worker” to “de-escalate this fellow while he’s armed and charging around at people. You can’t talk them down as they are far from rational... They’re not even hearing you.
These are extremely dangerous and volatile situations that can go south in an instant.
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2006
- Messages
- 54,545
Yet you can point a rifle at federal officers and end up in government instead of a grave. Being white has so many advantages.
https://www.npr.org/2020/10/22/926279072/militia-leader-known-as-the-bundy-ranch-sniper-seeks-a-new-title-senator
https://www.npr.org/2020/10/22/926279072/militia-leader-known-as-the-bundy-ranch-sniper-seeks-a-new-title-senator
Thermal
August Member
Not that this other shooting is relevant, but the attacker seems to reel backwards after the first shots and is in a standing fetal position for the duration. A sitting duck, some might say.
Again, irrelevant to the Philly killing. In the OP (with a very poor video caveat) the knife weilder appears to be going down at the first shots. Shots are still being fired as he hits the ground.
The cops outnumber two to one against knife boy, who appears to be just walking around in circles anyway. Their guns are drawn and ready to fire. Is it to much to ask the police to fire once, maybe twice, then assess if the threat has stopped? I think Wallace might have lived, or at least been more of a justified shooting. It shows a real commitment to killing, not merely stopping, to unload that many shots in such short order. 14 rounds in the space of two seconds with the suspect actively falling (in a street surrounded by bystanders) is a ******* firing squad.
Last edited:
Nakani
Graduate Poster
These are good but before things escalate. Read the situation, look at it from their point of view, help them do their job.
I ask for permission before doing anything. I don't threaten the police, verbally or physically. (On occasion, I might get cheeky but only jokes ment to diffuse the situation, nothing insulting.) I look directly at the officer speaking with me, I communicate as clearly as I can in a calm manner. I give them what they want with no attitude, regardless of the way they act.
Sounds like there are a few details missing
Too many variables for a science based formula that always works.
Magic? Really?
ponderingturtle
Orthogonal Vector
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2006
- Messages
- 54,545
This might be a justifiable shooting, the problem is that there are so many unjustied ones and ones where the police claims about what happened do not match the video records that giving the police the benefit of the doubt is just not going to happen.
Thermal
August Member
Agreed. That's the problem. Police are well known for being far too willing to shoot people. It should be a dead last resort, not the first and only. The few times I have had guns pointed at me, it was by police. I was never armed or threatening, and not even a bad guy (wrong place and time stuff). It was the first and only means of possible, maybe, kinda-sorta, could be theoretically dangerous threat mitigation that was even on the table. Straight to lethal, before the threat was assessed.
That's a different problem, although I partially agree. In the current culture, a white guy being shot is not news because it is somehow assumed that he must have deserved it (Dan Shavers family glances over). A black victim raises automatic questions about motivation and guilt, and people taking sides, often blindly.
thaiboxerken
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2001
- Messages
- 34,611
Be white. That's all they have to do, they have to be white.
I've seen a FB post by a black person that says he has a MAGA hat in his car for when he gets pulled over, and that it works. The police treat him much nicer when he has it on.
Skeptic Tank
Trigger Warning
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2013
- Messages
- 3,121
Maybe someone has already enlightened you on this, but in case not - this is due to police training.
The training is to basically fire a large number of shots, be totally certain the individual is completely neutralized, on the ground. Why? Because there have absolutely been situations previously (and even since) this was made the norm, where a suspect had a knife or a gun, got shot once or twice, was thought to be neutralized, then shot / stabbed the cop and killed them.