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Jogging in Georgia while black.

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SuburbanTurkey said:
Why would there be as much public attention now? The three murderers have been arrested and charged. It's not really going to be in the news until they plead guilty or go to trial, which is likely to be months.

The thrust of the original story, that a murder was swept under the rug, is no longer relevant.
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Disagreed. The sweeping under the rug issue is still alive and kicking. The DA and company haven't been brought up on charges, yes? And as I see it, they are just as bad if not far worse than the murderers.
 
wareyin said:
:confused:

That wasn't the question asked nor the answer given. People here have been carded for calling a member a racist. The first question was "Which racists are using the term on ISF?" The answer was that naming names would get one carded. That's the rule 12 break.

So far as I know, only one forum member admits to being a racist, and he is the only member we are allowed to call a racist.
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Fair point. I'd be satisfied with a collection of quotes that include the term, and readers can infer the predilections of the posters themselves.

I think there's a bit of an exception when members self-identify as racists though. I think we're allowed to refer to them as such if they've acknowledged the appropriateness of the term.
 
wareyin said:
:confused:

That wasn't the question asked nor the answer given. People here have been carded for calling a member a racist. The first question was "Which racists are using the term on ISF?" The answer was that naming names would get one carded. That's the rule 12 break.

So far as I know, only one forum member admits to being a racist, and he is the only member we are allowed to call a racist.
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I’m pretty sure that member is still around. I’d better not name the member, but he or she started out in the 9/11 section before moving around other sections and did openly agree he or she was a racist.
 
wareyin said:
Because rule 12 applies if one names forum members, or even makes it clear which forum members one is naming. I thought that was common knowledge here?
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I can't point out where I think you are confused as I suspect it's leading to a derail which will see posts getting moved and contributing to our collective "body of work".

Let's just leave it at this shall we?
 
Skeptic Tank said:
Anyway, isn't it wild to think back to when Ahmaud Arbery was a big story? Now it's like "who?"
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Clearly ST fails to grasp that what's happening in the rest of the US does not help the defendants. Any jury will have in the back of their minds the burning cities and weeks of protests and be considering these three might be a sacrifice they are willing to make to keep the peace.
 
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Ryokan said:
There was one victim and three men involved in the shooting.

How can there be four counts of felony murder?
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Your reasoning is not correct to start with. Each defendant faces the nine stated charges.

I don't understand the nuances of Georgia Law, but I think it might be to do with the predicates for felony murder. AIUI, it is somewhat like a person being charged with both murder and manslaughter for a single killing. The charge might fail on the murder but succeed on the manslaughter charge.
 
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I see. Thanks. The concept of felony murder is a little confusing, but I think I get it now.
 
Malice murder is the kicker in this.. it attracts a possible death penalty!

2014 Georgia Code
Title 16 - CRIMES AND OFFENSES
Chapter 5 - CRIMES AGAINST THE PERSON
Article 1 - HOMICIDE
§ 16-5-1 - Murder; malice murder; felony murder; murder in the second degree
Universal Citation: GA Code § 16-5-1 (2014)

(a) A person commits the offense of murder when he unlawfully and with malice aforethought, either express or implied, causes the death of another human being.

(b) Express malice is that deliberate intention unlawfully to take the life of another human being which is manifested by external circumstances capable of proof. Malice shall be implied where no considerable provocation appears and where all the circumstances of the killing show an abandoned and malignant heart.

(c) A person commits the offense of murder when, in the commission of a felony, he or she causes the death of another human being irrespective of malice.

(d) A person commits the offense of murder in the second degree when, in the commission of cruelty to children in the second degree, he or she causes the death of another human being irrespective of malice.

(e) (1) A person convicted of the offense of murder shall be punished by death, by imprisonment for life without parole, or by imprisonment for life.​

It would not be hard to make a solid case for (b) against Travis


The fact that he called Arbury the n-word after he shot him pretty much confirms the external circumstances (Travis' clear racism), and the fact that Arbury was trying to escape and did not provoke any of the three, will make it very difficult for their lawyers to argue against malicious intent.
 
quadraginta said:
It very likely actually is mediaeval. Or at least as close to it as British style common law gets. Much of legal phrasing, even in the U.S., is derived from that.
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Indeed, if I understand the wikilink below, it derives from "depraved indifference" which is probably a term most here are more likely to have heard before.

"It ["depraved heart" murder] is the form [of murder] that establishes that the wilful doing of a dangerous and reckless act with wanton indifference to the consequences and perils involved is just as blameworthy, and just as worthy of punishment, when the harmful result ensues as is the express intent to kill itself. This highly blameworthy state of mind is not one of mere negligence... It is not merely one even of gross criminal negligence... It involves rather the deliberate perpetration of a knowingly dangerous act with reckless and wanton unconcern and indifference as to whether anyone is harmed or not. The common law treats such a state of mind as just as blameworthy, just as anti-social and, therefore, just as truly murderous as the specific intents to kill and to harm.
​

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depraved-heart_murder
 
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I'm not a lawyer, but this charging docket makes me hopeful. Often there are accusations of corrupt prosecutors deliberately overcharging in a gambit to get an acquittal.

This docket pretty much covers the entire spectra of criminal behavior, so even an waffling jury will find convictions they can endorse. If the capital murder charge doesn't stick, there's still the other lesser charges that make felony murder a strong option.

Additional reporting from the GBI sounds like the vehicle chase was much longer than originally known to the public, and damage to one of the trucks indicate that the murderers were committing acts of violence towards Arbery well before the video we've seen.

I remain optimistic that the malice murder charge will stick and our boys will be facing a possible death sentence.
 
What is more astonishing than anything else is the contrast between the original "no crime to answer for" decision and now the charges of murder. In UK terms this isn't like the prosecutor changing their mind from "bodily harm" to "grievous bodily harm", it's chalk and cheese.
 
Darat said:
What is more astonishing than anything else is the contrast between the original "no crime to answer for" decision and now the charges of murder. In UK terms this isn't like the prosecutor changing their mind from "bodily harm" to "grievous bodily harm", it's chalk and cheese.
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I am wondering how things are going to go for the DA's and cops involved with the initial investigation once the full evidence becomes public record. Especially if the murderers don't plead out and take it to trial.

The delicate legal fiction the DA tried to spin of a citizen's arrest that lead to a self-defense shooting is going to collapse spectacularly, even more so than it has already. Best case scenario is that they were so incompetent they didn't even do the bare minimum of police work to challenge the word of someone who committed a broad daylight murder. Many are going to smell a cover-up.
 
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