PartSkeptic’s Thread for Predictions and Other Matters of Interest

Status
Not open for further replies.
However, most of JU's post is a personal and unwarranted attack.

Then you should have reported it instead of merely claiming so for rhetorical effect. It's easy to say, "You're all just picking on me," whether or not that's true. Submitting it for moderation requires another person -- ideally a team of people -- to agree with the accusation. You're following a pattern of avoiding subjective adjudication of your claims, in this case so that you have an excuse to dismiss others' posts as somehow unworthy of attention.

If I succeed JU will reference this post to negate any evidence that Emfs can cause harm.

Not an argument I made. Kindly deal with what I actually do, not with what you imagine I have done or will do.

You started out okay then descended into ad hominems.

it is not ad hominem argumentation to note that your responses to people contain many elements that are irrelevant to the points made. It is justifiable, however, to suspect that those may have been included as a distraction. Asking you to omit them in the future is perfectly reasonable.

Implying I do not know what I am talking about...

No such argument was made by that statement. Kindly confine yourself to the arguments made, not what you think they might imply about you personally. The argument was merely to illustrate that all the people who employ rigorous methodology do so for different reasons. The reason in your case would be to help determine what's making you sick, in hopes of curing it. I can't imagine what gymnastics that required to conclude that I was insulting you.

I respond to challenges.

Not substantively, no.

My credential are on records.

As are mine. But since both of us are putatively anonymous on this forum, I don't see what point you're trying to make. Either you can demonstrate substantive expertise by engaging with specialized topics, or you cannot. Your critics aren't convinced by frantic handwaving.

You talk a fancy game but not much support.

Nonsense. I have made several substantial contributions to this thread, which you admit you do not read.

You call my personal evidence anecdotes.

Because that's the definition of an anecdote.

You dismiss my supporting links to science.

I discussed your science at length. You did not respond.

You change the subject when asked for a direct response.

No, I attempt to stay on the subject while you try very hard to shove other arguments in my mouth and bait me to defend them. I interpreted that as you being knocked off your script by someone giving an honest, informed answer instead of what your political literature prepared you for. I warned you several times that I would not follow your road map. I renew that warning now.

They are scientists who post reviews in peer reviewed journals.

As, ostensibly, are those whose conclusions differ from the ones you're aware of. Your literature has given you only one side of the story and sidestepped the other by raising a political controversy instead. This is not a good way to suggest that the science is conclusive. Further, you seem immune to the notion that the side of the debate you favor cannot also have ulterior motives.

I told you it was an analogy to say that they both cause harm. You turn my argument into an equivalency and then attack your own straw-man.

Your analogy illustrated your argument only if the premise was equivalent cause and effect. So either your'e arguing from a factually incorrect basis, or you're arguing according to an irrelevant analogy. Which is it?

I responded to claims am a layman.

Your responses are most often simply denials. They don't demonstrate the expertise you claim. When you occasionally go beyond merely repeating your claim to superior expertise, the detail you provide is merely a recitation of easily determined facts, which you then fail to put into a useful context or connect to your conclusion, or even to discuss beyond their initial appearance. That is, it's a bluff. You seem to think an argument is made by merely stating static facts and then declaring victory.

I use my understanding of science and do research and then make things happen.

You haven't demonstrated an understanding of science. You've demonstrate the ability to use science words in your posts, but you don't seem to understand the concept of scientific inquiry, nor the actual problems and solutions that practical scientists today employ. When it comes down to determining whether you have a practicably testable claim, the experience of practicing scientists is a must. You cannot exhibit that experience, and you seem to resent it being exhibited by others.

I have a long list of accomplishments which you turn your nose up at.

A long list of life accomplishments doesn't make you a scientist. They are irrelevant to the claims you're making. If you cannot demonstrate expertise on the points at hand, and your argument is based on your claims to such expertise, then it does not matter what else you may have accomplished.

This forum dismisses EHS outright. And dismisses the possibility of harm done by EMF.

If that were the case then they would have dismissed your claim of personal harm outright. Instead they've proposed a win-win scenario where you get to test the causality you suspect, and hopefully come closer to a cure. Plus you get to provide evidence of the kind your critics want. They're helping you collect the evidence that would convince them, and they've agreed to lower the standard for significance. Given all the forbearance and assistance that has been shown to you, it's very unfair to say you have been dismissed out of hand.

Just one piece of unassailable evidence is needed.

Why are you averse to collecting that evidence, then?

Oh, now you limit the experiment and propose some unknown variable in case I succeed.

The experiment has always been limited to you and your circumstances. What led you to believe otherwise?

What "unknown" variable have I proposed? If you oppose the word "extrasensory," then propose a different word and I'll happily accept it. You don't seem to have proposed any actual physiological mechanism for the causation you say is at work in your case, so it leaves everyone somewhat adrift in what words they can use to describe it. As if to allude to what might be happening, you've thrown out a smorgasbord of propositions from the literature. But they range widely from cancer to cardiological problems. None of that seems to fit your case. Instead of thrashing about, accusing your critics of "cunning" while they try haplessly to follow your high-speed goalposts, why don't you state a specific claim and stick to it.

You now pronounce that any result only shows correlation. Once again. Cunning.

Nonsense. You're bending over backwards to try to paint me as a mustache-twirling villain.

The experiment has ever only been, at this stage, to determine whether your headaches correlate in time to the operation of your home wireless network. Correlation does not imply causation, it is true. But the contrapositive is also true, and forms a cornerstone of science: the lack of correlation implies the lack of causation. If an objective regime of measurement does not establish a correlation between when you have your headaches and when the equipment is operating, then it is unlikely the equipment is the cause. No further investigation is necessary. Nobody is trying to cheat; you just don't understand science.

Previously when the trial was a binary variable, we could have used a statistical model based around the binomial distribution to determine whether your guesses again statistical significance. Now that you lately added the variable of signal strength, we have to use a different statistical model. Since the model we would ordinarily use in such a case, Student's t-distribution, requires more trials than it would be practical for you to do, I am proposing a simple analysis of variance based on Pearson's coefficient, r, a very well known estimate of covariance. A technique is available to determine the alpha for some r and some n. You challenged me to include signal strength in the model. I have met that challenge. It remains to be seen whether you will actually quit stalling and do the experiment.

Rubbish. No support for your claim [that my critics understand science better than I].

One has only to read the thread. I'm explaining how the science is done, and would be done in your case, to achieve a result that would justify more extensive investigation. All you're doing is throwing out one dictatorial denial after another. One of those demonstrates expertise. The other doesn't. I trust the reader can make the appropriate determination.

Further, in a post now relegated to the scrap heap, you admitted you were not specialized in everything. Why is it a problem to admit that others have more experience than you in designing scientific experiments?

Another cunning twist to discredit me.

I am simply pointing out your prior unwillingness to be tested objectively on various abilities you have at times claimed to have, such as prophetic insight, and opining that you are now persisting in that pattern. I cited your own anecdote in support of that unwillingness, and the lessons to be learned from it. It demonstrated the operation of a confirmation bias, and why objectively measuring performance is essential if you want credit for those abilities. If your reluctance tends to discredit you, then that's how life works. No one is obliged to credit you with abilities you cannot demonstrate under controlled conditions.

Now you claim my experiment is not science but "Woo" - supernatural (a trick of some sort to skeptics.)

That is exactly the opposite of my claim.

Your experiment merely establishes whether your symptoms correlate to the cause you suspect. We are employing our collective experience in science to help you conduct an experiment with as much rigor as can be expected from your circumstances. The hope is that we can obtain data that both sides consider valid.

I have had to respond to scoffing and disbelief by improving my knowledge and how I try to get others to see the truth.

I disagree with the sentiment that you are attempting genuinely to improve your knowledge. You are surrounded by people sharing their knowledge with you, and you reject almost all of it. You seem to be relying on whatever knowledge you already possess, buttressed at times by regurgitation from various sources, responses to which you ignore. Those verbally emetic spells are always framed by the sentiment, "Look how much I know." You may be acquiring new information, but it's always presented as if it's something your critics were unaware of, without attempting first to determine whether that's the case. The motive I would say more closely fits that pattern of behavior is the attempt to establish the illusion of pre-eminence, not the attempt to develop one's faculties.

You seem very convinced that what you believe is true. This has led you to engage in blatantly circular reasoning, and you have displayed absolutely no interest in others' efforts to help you see the circularity. In fact, you have concocted a conspiratorial narrative that you extend as needed to encompass any who are not convinced by your rhetoric, and who have supplied good reasons why. I can't imagine how you would think this constitutes improving your ability to convince others. You're simply relying on the same transparent devices by which you've floundered in every debate you have had heretofore at this forum. It falls short not only of being a convincing argument for the points you raise, but also of your sincerity in arguing for them. If these impressions matter, you will be wise to heed others' advice for how to formulate an argument they find convincing.
 
Symptom severity, specifically pain severity, is typically measured on either a 5- or 10-point scale. Signal strength is a continuous value, but can be similarly discretized. I don't know what equipment he has, but the question of whether to discretize it on a linear or logarithmic scale is pertinent.

But if we've dispensed with the on-off versus sick-well schema, then the binomial distribution no longer applies. It's no longer a matter of guessing a binary variable, but of matching strength of symptoms to strength of signal. Assuming proper scaling of the values, the Pearson's coefficient would be a suitable statistic if we're only going to do 10 trials, and it can be computed for a given confidence interval.

Again, the typical method requires some number of runs with some number of trials per run. Then the t-test is appropriate, since we don't know the expected variance of the signal strength. But it is unlikely at this point that PartSkeptic will consent to any test, regardless of its simplicity.

As you note, the one-tailed bias would have to be determined prior to the experiment. Assuming, but not knowing whether, it has an effect will introduce an extraneous control that destabilizes the result. This is why we typically ignore putatively insignificant confounds unless their effect can be shown significant, and are one-tailed. I mentioned this in a previous post.

I can think of a couple of different calibration protocols. But I would like to see if PartSkeptic can think of them before I explain them. He seems to have the opinion that they're too onerous, or that the task is fundamentally impossible.



Give me your protocol for calibrating the measuring instrument - namely me. I cannot wait. The medical profession would love to know.

How do you account for me going to the shops and getting exposure to emfs? How do you account for me being slightly dehydrated, or having to much coffee? Too onerous for me? Easy to say when it is not your health on the line. And yet you cannot see the problem, or why I am not unreasonable in my wanting more.

Are you not confounding or confusing this study with the sample of one (me) with an epidemiological study with a last number of inputs (many people with multiple symptoms) that require various algorithms and statistical analysis?

Are you being practical?

Here is one for you:

I got a pain in my side after 5-10 minutes in a certain spot in our front yard after the tower was energized. When I moved away, which I did quickly because the pain was severe and sharp, it faded quite quickly. Reasonably repeatable but I avoided the spot. A three inch long vertical pain.

1. What does this have to do with the tower? (It does).
2. What is the medical explanation? (I did find out eventually).
 
While my degree is in this area, I have never worked for any Telco. I built my own companies (long since gone) in the area of encrypted credit transactions over whatever device. Not intentional, it just happened.

Scariest part of that is that the banks themselves are so impossibly naive about it.


Okay. Some credible disclosure. I will agree with how naive the banks are. I had an idea of how they could improve some transactions very simply - and yet they only do it for international transactions. So easy a step but they would rather have some fraud.
 
Alas, that is also the claim. It appear that it is not the rest of us who are unsure what the claim actually is. The proponent is unsure. That is a problem.

We all end up stamping on the random fires generated by random claims. And the next claim will be different. The entire edifice seems to be a mobile load of it.


What! :jaw-dropp

Why is the experiment I proposed so difficult to grasp without shredding and distorting some simple statements about time division multiplexing on the towers.
 
You made an earlier claim, below

To which I thought wow that's intriguing, let's investigate.

From what you have subsequently posted, you should probably retract that claim?


Simple. I do not want to get a headache and then ask my wife if she is using the WiFi. This is how I discovered my sensitivity.

If she turned off the cold water while I am in the shower, and I get scalded, I will ask her to warn me when she is about to turn off the cold water while I am in the shower.
 
I am concerned - that you are misrepresenting the science to support your confirmation bias.


Whereas you do want 'electrosmog' to be dangerous, and are manipulating propaganda with just enough truth and falsehoods to create doubt - except not skillfully enough to convince us.


A single message is enough. It means you believe in the Supernatural, so you are delusional by definition.

How do you figure that? How could a non-existent being chose anyone?

There is no such thing as good or bad 'fortune' - there are just things that may be beneficial or not depending on the situation.

I see someone who is in denial of their confirmation bias and adamant that their delusion is real.

But it won't. It will muddle on like it always has. We could hope to better, but we won't because too many people are driven by irrational fear and delusion.


Pity about your post. You seem certain that there is no supernatural. If you were right, then I would be delusional, everything would be confirmation bias, and you would be correct.

Where is the proof/evidence that there is no supernatural?
 
PartSkeptic, please use the ordinary quote feature of this forum to respond to my posts. Do not inline them and force me to refer back and forth, copy and paste, to address your remarks in context.

You missed the point - deliberately I would say.

Paranoia is not an argument.

...and proved you wrong with specifics.

No. You regurgitated some marginally relevant facts without connecting them by any sort of argument to your claim. I proposed an argument I would accept, if you were able to make it. You ignored it.

Microprocessors were only just coming into their own...

Is it your argument that band pass filters did not exist before microprocessors? In any case, I remain unimpressed. You designed electronics as part of your college experience. In what way does this qualify you to say what you are saying about your critics and their ability to recommend good scientific procedure?

So you do not know how to distinguish between two people with different levels of intelligence.

I made no such claim.

You use scorn and ridicule...

I pointed out that you were making an argument of the type you previously denied ever having made.

...to try to bring people down to your level. And what level would that be?

The personalization of this argument is taking you very far off the rails. You say you have already been warned about making personal attacks on your critics. Is it your goal to keep doing that until you are banned, and then claim to be some martyr for the cause? Is it your goal to so infuriate your critics that they abandon you, whereupon you claim you confounded them with your superior scientific acumen?

Please trying to maintain a civil tone.

You have made this an ongoing personal attack. You just will not stop.

Report posts for moderation that you feel are personal attacks. Do not keep insinuating as such for rhetorical effect.

First I need to see some knowledgeable dispute rather than attempts to subvert this thread.

You have been given several, which you admit you do not read. If posts are off-topic, as you claim, report them for moderation so that they will cease to distract you and derail the thread.

What is your motivation to avoid any possibility of a display of emf harm?

Not a claim I have made. I wrote a rather lengthy post some days ago in response to why people dispute fringe claimants. Consult that if you wish to explore my motives in challenging your claims.

Why is the power so high at times and not at other times.

This is not a response to anything I asked. You're proving my point that you just throw out random discussion without connecting it to your claim.

Why is the measurement using my meter not good enough?

Your ability to measure signal strength would be an impediment to a good experiment, yes. But again this is an ad hoc objection. You presumably purchased the equipment you have on hand with the expectation that it would measure the effects you say are causing your illness. You claim an expert knowledge in such things, so we must conclude your choice was not naive. You have previously used it to attempt to map out the electromagnetic field strength in your environment.

Now that it comes time to use that equipment in a more rigorous way, you suddenly agree with your critics that it may not suffice. Why the change of heart?

The problem is that I am very aware I am not in a lab situation where the variables (including my health) are controlled.

Asked and answered. You haven't changed your tune. On a daily basis you're simply coming up with a new reason to move the goalposts so that you don't actually have to submit to the test. The reasons you're giving suggest you don't know how a valid scientific experiment would accommodate those things.
 
Give me your protocol for calibrating the measuring instrument...

The part you highlighted in my quoted post has absolutely nothing to do with instrument calibration.

How do you account for me...
Easy to say when it is not your health on the line.

Emotional handwaving. Please try to remain dispassionate.

Are you not confounding or confusing this study with the sample of one (me) with an epidemiological study with a last number of inputs (many people with multiple symptoms) that require various algorithms and statistical analysis?

No.

Are you being practical?

Yes.

Here is one for you:

If you want me to conduct an investigation to help you test the proposed causes of your symptoms, kindly adhere to the standard I propose for such an investigation. If you are unwilling to do that, then accept the consequences of claiming something you are unwilling to prove.
 
<snip>



If you want me to conduct an investigation to help you test the proposed causes of your symptoms, kindly adhere to the standard I propose for such an investigation. If you are unwilling to do that, then accept the consequences of claiming something you are unwilling to prove.

Which is pretty much what he has done for the entire thread. ;)
 
Simple. I do not want to get a headache and then ask my wife if she is using the WiFi. This is how I discovered my sensitivity.

You informally investigated only one possible cause, and then have clung to it like a drowning man to a liferaft. You're telling your story in a skeptics forum. How else would you expect skeptics to respond except by helping you apply more rigor to your observation in hopes of narrowing down the cause?

If she turned off the cold water while I am in the shower, and I get scalded, I will ask her to warn me when she is about to turn off the cold water while I am in the shower.

But at this point that's apples and oranges. Until a few days ago you were quite content to have the experiment be on-off, and you're scalded. Now you've made it into a continuous-valued problem, ostensibly so that you can propose a giant heap of hitherto unimportant potential confounds, as an excuse not to take a test. It's the same as proposing a complex fluid-dynamics flow regime inside the pipe that makes it now pointless to take the temperature of the shower water, because turning off the cold water only now sometimes scalds you. It wasn't part of the original model that you were content with before.
 
Here is the point I was trying to make to see if anyone grasped it. I actually thought it was a giveaway.

1. Why is the power so high at times and not at other times.

a. It is not location, because I moved it around to check that.

You're using a cheap power meter which does not give accurate measurements. Simple.

b. It is possible that the modem decided to communicate using a tower that was much further away. Hence the power boost.

Conjecture.

c. There is another possibility. I have heard (but cannot verify) that the Telcos use home WiFi to get improved coverage. They "hijack" a modem and then steer inputs and outputs. The home owner is not charged for the data through put but it seems to be an sly use of equipment they do not own or rent or license. This may be insider info that would be hard to verify unless someone like me did some measurements. But I would need much more sophisticated instruments. If I had the time I could build my own spectrum analyzers that would be specific to my requirements but I do not.

Paranoid conjecture, and frankly pretty laughable. Regarding licencing - you are aware that there is an implicit licence to use your modem already? It's called a SIM card. You are paying to use their network. The modem is useless without it.

You do realise, of course, that there are various apps that make use of your data to make calls? Whatsapp, Telegram, to name but two.

Of course, this will not change any operating frequencies - you'll still communicate via WiFi to your modem, and the modem will still communicate with the tower via cellular frequencies.

Build your own spectrum analyser(s)? O RLY? I'm sure Ulrich Rohde is quaking in his boots.

2. Why is the measurement using my meter not good enough?

a. The meter has a wide bandwidth and cannot tell me whether the modem has changed the communication mode. Frequency and/or mode. I have had one person who claims to be EHS tell me the different modes (2G, 3G and 4G) affect her differently. I do not know how much power pulsation take place between the different modes. I do not know how important the frequency is.

At the risk of repeating myself, you're using a cheap power meter which does not give accurate measurements. Simple.
 
Give me your protocol for calibrating the measuring instrument - namely me. I cannot wait. The medical profession would love to know.

This is a pretty easy question to answer. At the base of all your arguments is your theory that you are affected by EM radiation. You yourself said that it takes roughly 15 mins for these effects to manifest themselves. So, essentially you are the canary in the coal mine, and this effect is something we can test.

So, we put you in an RF anechoic chamber - you know, one of those rooms which is totally RF proof. We would leave you there for a good couple of hours. Ideally a day, as you say these effects sometimes linger, but I get the impression, from your anecdotal evidence, that a day is sufficient.

Any effects that manifest themselves after that would then, by inference, have nothing to do with RF.

So, you are now effectively baselined. Then we put a sweep generator in the room with you. Low power, of course. We do not tell you when it switches on, what frequencies it sweeps to, and when it is off. Actually, all you'd see is the antenna array, so you would have no idea at all of the state.

You then mark down on a prepared sheet at what times you believe you feel affected by EM radiation. An independent moderator (perhaps your wife) will be outside the chamber noting when the generator is on and when it's off, and what the sweep is. She will not communicate with you until after the test is finished.

Afterwards, the sheets are compared.

Just think, one day and you'll know if you need to seek treatment elsewhere.

How do you account for me going to the shops and getting exposure to emfs? How do you account for me being slightly dehydrated, or having to much coffee? Too onerous for me? Easy to say when it is not your health on the line. And yet you cannot see the problem, or why I am not unreasonable in my wanting more.

My test procedure will negate these influences.

So, will you do it? Your health is, after all, on the line. What is one day of fairly mild exposure in strictly controlled conditions as compared to a lifetime of worry and tilting at windmills?
 
Oh good grief Charlie Brown. Look at the manual I gave you. Mobile Wifi.

I dealt with the points - and did so in my previous post.

Another example of scorn based on erroneous assumptions which are biased negatively against me.

The phone uses WiFi to communicate with the modem. A WiFi passward is needed to make the connection. The modem connects to the internet via a cell tower. Why do you think I call it a modem?

I have fibre-in-the-home.

In effect, you are claiming that my fibre optic modem is not a modem because...why?

Are you not aware that a modem is not defined by the medium is uses?
Because it doesn't connect to cell towers?

Did you omit to read that I have used such devices in the past? Some of those were Vodafone/Huawei types in fact. I still have a couple stored away.

Beyond that, please be clear. Is it the Wifi or the cell connection or both, and how have you determined that?

I just now saw I am getting warnings for being personal.

I suppose getting me banned is one way to stop this thread. And stop me from responding to the attacks upon me - quit while supposedly ahead.
Will not happen if you can manage to remain within the may you actually agreed to when you joined.

And everyone can crow that they "saw me off". It is often time to go when it gets to the point that all I get is jibes and insults. People here can dish it out but not take it.

Personally, I would rather you stayed. I want to find out if you are willing to do what you committed to do.

Here is the point I was trying to make to see if anyone grasped it. I actually thought it was a giveaway.

1. Why is the power so high at times and not at other times.
Because you bought a cheap crappy meter from a cheap crappy company.

a. It is not location, because I moved it around to check that.
And the only logical conclusion one can draw from that is location within your locale appears to make no difference at that particular time.. You can provisionally rule out location within, but only provisionally.

b. It is possible that the modem decided to communicate using a tower that was much further away. Hence the power boost.
Or some random guy stopped his car near your house to watch another idiotic yooboob video and you detected that. Or any of hundreds of other possibilities, including the possibility that you have a crappy meter from a company that has a vested interest in scaring the pants off you.

c. There is another possibility. I have heard (but cannot verify) that the Telcos use home WiFi to get improved coverage. They "hijack" a modem and then steer inputs and outputs. The home owner is not charged for the data through put but it seems to be an sly use of equipment they do not own or rent or license. This may be insider info that would be hard to verify unless someone like me did some measurements. But I would need much more sophisticated instruments. If I had the time I could build my own spectrum analyzers that would be specific to my requirements but I do not.
Wow. Once again, you heard partial facts, and then made up a load of rubbish on top. This does, in effect, actually happen, that part is true. The rest of it is not.

There is no hijacking, it is by consent. In effect, you agree to allow slack time on your modem to be used by any other customers in wifi range when YOU are not using it. In turn, you, as a customer, gain the use of the slack time on any other users wifi which you happen to be in range of who has also consented.

But you do not have to consent. You are at liberty to refuse.

If you refuse, nobody gets to use your wifi, and you don't get to use anyone elses.

If you agree, then the number of places where you can get a wifi connection is huge and saves on data charges on your phone.

This enjoyed a certain vogue for a while, right up until unlimited data became a thing. At that point it became a bit of a fifth wheel and fizzled out.

2. Why is the measurement using my meter not good enough?

a. The meter has a wide bandwidth and cannot tell me whether the modem has changed the communication mode. Frequency and/or mode. I have had one person who claims to be EHS tell me the different modes (2G, 3G and 4G) affect her differently. I do not know how much power pulsation take place between the different modes. I do not know how important the frequency is.
Was there supposed to be a b.?

Put simply, you have a crappy meter sold by a company whose sole raison d'etre is to exploit people who believe as you do.

To suggest I run test after test on myself to investigate is not an option. The short test I described gave me after-effects that lingered for a day. I think. The problem is that I am very aware I am not in a lab situation where the variables (including my health) are controlled.
But you were all gung ho to do it and now you are doing everything to avoid it.

And how exactly did you determine the cause of these claimed "after-effects"?

For all you know, it could be metal toxicity caused by your constant contact with your shielding devices.

For example, you claimed to be experiencing early onset Alzheimers. That's what took my father years ago, so I would not wish that on anyone, having seen it to it's end. Don't give up. Treatments are improving all the time.

But Alzheimers is linked to aluminium. The link is poorly understood, but does exist. Research continues.

Nevertheless, you claim you wrap it around your head. Seems a rather odd tactic to me for someone who claims early onset of the disease to seek to make it worse intentionally.
 
Pity about your post. You seem certain that there is no supernatural. If you were right, then I would be delusional, everything would be confirmation bias, and you would be correct.

Where is the proof/evidence that there is no supernatural?
Where is proof that there is?

You have none to offer.

This is a very simple concept.

You claim that there is a god. So far so good?

I claim that I do not believe in any god, since no evidence has been presented for any god, ever.

You then claim that I have a burden of proof for my claim.

I accept. I don't believe is any god, and my evidence is that I do not believe in any god, because I don't. It is a simple fact that I believe in not a single god. This is a fact because I don't believe in any god. Why should I? There is no evidence for any of them.

Would I believe in your god, or any other god if you or anyone else rocked up with actual evidence for that god? Sure. Immediately.

Would I worship it? Well, that is a very different question. No, your thug god is not worthy of worship. It's vile. And also not demonstrated to actually exist, so I care not.

If you are unable to show your god exists, why should anyone believe it?

As usual, you will claim that I am stating that no god exists, and as usual you would be wrong. My claim is that I believe in no gods at all. Because I do not.

There could be gods, perhaps. But I have seen or heard from exactly none.
 
If that were the case then they would have dismissed your claim of personal harm outright. Instead they've proposed a win-win scenario where you get to test the causality you suspect, and hopefully come closer to a cure. Plus you get to provide evidence of the kind your critics want. They're helping you collect the evidence that would convince them, and they've agreed to lower the standard for significance. Given all the forbearance and assistance that has been shown to you, it's very unfair to say you have been dismissed out of hand.

Exactly. I and others have gone out of our way to help PartSkeptic design a test that would produce meaningful results. Whilst I am sceptical of the causality he suspects I am open to the possibility, and if his dry run supported his hypothesis I would encourage him to proceed to more formal testing. If it does not that is also a win for him, because it means he can stop wasting his time on a red herring. But the only response we get to our efforts to help him is insults and accusations.
 
Simple. I do not want to get a headache and then ask my wife if she is using the WiFi. This is how I discovered my sensitivity.
But it's a really intriguing position to pursue, it should be pursued to nail down what is going on. If you can detect wifi it's probably game changing.

If she turned off the cold water while I am in the shower, and I get scalded, I will ask her to warn me when she is about to turn off the cold water while I am in the shower.

To use your water analogy, what if you got scalded and then found out that your wife didn't turn off the cold water?
Lets nail down what's going on, you know the craic let's do it.
Do the test.
 
If you wanted to use the shower water analogy, you might note that this is an easily repeatable event, which does not require anyone actually to be scalded. You can measure the temperature of the shower and see what happens when someone does something elsewhere in the house. After you've established what causes what, it then makes sense to tell your spouse when you're in the shower so that event won't occur.

That said, your plumbing seems to be as strange as everything else in your environment, because in most houses it's turn ON the cold water in some place other than the shower that causes the shower to become scalding.
 
That said, your plumbing seems to be as strange as everything else in your environment, because in most houses it's turn ON the cold water in some place other than the shower that causes the shower to become scalding.

Heh, I think I made the same error. I think we all know what we're talking about.
 
Exactly. I and others have gone out of our way to help PartSkeptic design a test that would produce meaningful results.
Sure. Your error is in thinking that he wants to test his hypothesis. He does not. He wants to cling to it at all cost.
Whilst I am sceptical of the causality he suspects I am open to the possibility,
As am I and I suspect most here. But no evidence exists and our proponent is fighting tooth and nail against any test at all.

and if his dry run supported his hypothesis I would encourage him to proceed to more formal testing.
Sure. But having at first agreed to it, now he is refusing to do it. Not much we can really do with such intransigence, is there?

If it does not that is also a win for him, because it means he can stop wasting his time on a red herring. But the only response we get to our efforts to help him is insults and accusations.
I believe it was Dillahunty who nailed that.

If you had any evidence to present, you would have done so already. The simple fact that you have not done so means that you do not.

And this applies to this protagonist. No evidence, just claims about how many painkillers he ate today.

My biggest fear in this, there is some underlying medical condition being neglected because of it.

None of us can fix that.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom