Anarchy in Seattle--Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

[CORed]

Given what is really happening with CHAZ as opposed to what Fox News wants people to think is happening, which strategy for the authorities make more sense? A military type operation with tear gas, rubber bullets and batons, or just wait until everybody gets tired of camping out? After all, it's Seattle. Camping out in the street may be fun in June, but sometime this fall, it's going to start raining. A lot. Do we really think all these people are going to stay in the street when that happens?

 

[BobTheCoward]

Given what is really happening with CHAZ as opposed to what Fox News wants people to think is happening, which strategy for the authorities make more sense? A military type operation with tear gas, rubber bullets and batons, or just wait until everybody gets tired of camping out? After all, it's Seattle. Camping out in the street may be fun in June, but sometime this fall, it's going to start raining. A lot. Do we really think all these people are going to stay in the street when that happens?

I think the answer is for the cops to conduct business as usual. Either people will let them, or they will be guilty of a crime.

 

[Stout]

Yes, I know it's rather upsetting when a black activist asks supposed white allies to to a little more than things like posting a black square on Instagram. It's somewhat disconcerting to white American Liberals to hear those requests coming from a Marxist enclave that they support, in theory because it looks good on the Facebook.

It's easy to push a few buttons and signal to the world "I'm a good person" and retweet an article you dug up but when it comes to actual action, when it comes to putting their money where their mouths are, white American Liberals get all defensive and spew all sorts of nonsensical garbage in an effort to try and spit the hook.

"clickbait", "fox news" "some internet random" "racist" you exclaim as you try to live down the shame of allowing Donald Trump to get himself elected as your president.

Truth be known, some black leaders are on to you.

Oh yea, one more thing white American Liberals. The far left hates you. They think that you're not only poseurs abnd they suspect that a lot of you secretly voted republican.

 

[Stout]

Given what is really happening with CHAZ as opposed to what Fox News wants people to think is happening, which strategy for the authorities make more sense? A military type operation with tear gas, rubber bullets and batons, or just wait until everybody gets tired of camping out? After all, it's Seattle. Camping out in the street may be fun in June, but sometime this fall, it's going to start raining. A lot. Do we really think all these people are going to stay in the street when that happens?

It'll be like Occupy. once the tourists get bored and wander away. There'll be little groups of 911 truthers, Plandemic supporters etc. and homeless people who came for the free food and stayed for the safe place to camp out.

By this time next year, this action will be a distant memory.

 

[Silly Green Monkey]

Are you saying, then, that non-violent protesting cannot possibly effect change? That the very act of protesting without damaging anything, is something easily ignored and brushed aside by those in power?

 

[Giordano]

Yes, I know it's rather upsetting when a black activist asks supposed white allies to to a little more than things like posting a black square on Instagram. It's somewhat disconcerting to white American Liberals to hear those requests coming from a Marxist enclave that they support, in theory because it looks good on the Facebook.

It's easy to push a few buttons and signal to the world "I'm a good person" and retweet an article you dug up but when it comes to actual action, when it comes to putting their money where their mouths are, white American Liberals get all defensive and spew all sorts of nonsensical garbage in an effort to try and spit the hook.

(snip)

Oddly some demographic is contributing large sums of money to racial justice groups such as BLM. So much that they can’t always take it all in:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/14/...tion=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

But maybe it’s not the wealthy liberals you are denouncing who are contributing all this cash? Maybe it’s Trump supporters. Or unemployed 19 year old anarchists. I wonder.

Of course one could argue that sending money is not the same as being willing to protest in person, to put one’s body on the line. Interesting then that there are so many white faces in the photos I’ve seen of the protests and at CHAZ.

This whole topic is really a diversion from the OP, and I intend to not be drawn into it further. Especially because Stout continues to beat on this drum without regard to what facts or other aspects of the discussion are presented to him. But the essential point I wish to point out is that the BLM movement has united a huge swarth of society, young and old, poorer and wealthier, of all races. And people of all kinds have provided all kinds of support, from money to being out there being tear gassed. Some others apparently are frightened by this, or simply cannot comprehend it without trying to parcel the world in divisive little ways that date from our racially segregated past and are not relevant in this movement.

Attempting to make it an “us” versus “them” (those supporting the demonstrations) will leave the self-appointed “us” very lonely. Look around. Seeking more racial equality has created a powerful and large We.

 

[Giordano]

Given what is really happening with CHAZ as opposed to what Fox News wants people to think is happening, which strategy for the authorities make more sense? A military type operation with tear gas, rubber bullets and batons, or just wait until everybody gets tired of camping out? After all, it's Seattle. Camping out in the street may be fun in June, but sometime this fall, it's going to start raining. A lot. Do we really think all these people are going to stay in the street when that happens?

I doubt the vast majority of the people there ever had any intention to make this permanent. They certainly don’t have the means to do so. Like all demonstrations the point was to capture public attention. And in this case to provide a bit of theater and demonstrate some alternatives to rigid thinking about self-governance and the relative violence of the police versus the demonstrators.

I’ve read a few articles that at least several key organizers of the protests are negotiating with the city as to how to turn back control to the city government. This includes not arresting the occupiers when they seek to leave.

 

[Giordano]

Are you saying, then, that non-violent protesting cannot possibly effect change? That the very act of protesting without damaging anything, is something easily ignored and brushed aside by those in power?

Sadly it does seem true, doesn’t it? Even the non-violent movements that achieved change, such as those of MLK JR and Gandhi, captured attention and support because of the violence unleashed against them.

 

[Stout]

Are you saying, then, that non-violent protesting cannot possibly effect change? That the very act of protesting without damaging anything, is something easily ignored and brushed aside by those in power?

No. I presented the words of a black activist, paraphrased to apply an internet discussion. wondering whether they would be rejected. Words that were asking for more than money, more than protest, more than intenet activism but a general reorganization of society along Marxist principals.

Granted, I did it in a rather provocative manner but it was a heck of a lot more interesting than simply posting a link and asking " Is this guy for real?"

This is about one representative of one intentional community.

 

[crescent]

It'll be like Occupy. once the tourists get bored and wander away. There'll be little groups of 911 truthers, Plandemic supporters etc. and homeless people who came for the free food and stayed for the safe place to camp out.

By this time next year, this action will be a distant memory.

You might actually be right. It is funny to me. Stout's take on the issue is probably the same take that the right-wing media will also now take.

All that talk of Seattle being under control of a communist warlord, of food shortages, checkpoints and walls to keep undesirables out or to prevent exit, all that will be forgotten. Fox news will just move on to the next thing as if it never really tried to encourage a military assault on a peaceful protest. As if it never engaged in wholesale fabrication of facts to encourage what amounts to warfare against our own people.

And the right will just go right along with that. Memories are short.

 

[sts60]

So, wait... Seattle has not actually turned into a Mad Max-type hellscape of Antifa and BLM goons assaulting real Americans? It’s just a generally peaceful social experiment involving a few blocks squared?

Damn it. What do we even have A-10s for?

 

[Stout]

Time will tell. Maybe a year from now, a few good left wing media outlets will do a one year anniversary story on the establishment of CHAZ or maybe, one year form now, when you Goohgle the word CHAZ all you'll get is Chaz Bono references for the first few pages.

 

[Mader Levap]

Yes, some degenerates would like that right-wing lies became forgotten.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Why stop there? Give up all your wealth and belongings too! Your white privilege is so evident it's sickening! How racist can you be anyway!

Yes, they are asking white people to give black people money.

https://nypost.com/2020/06/13/protester-in-seattles-chaz-demands-white-people-give-out-cash/

It's metaphorical for Pete's sake. What a way to distort what a speaker was talking about.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

What a poor response, I'll ask again:...

Reparations are required, hurry up and report back!

First reparations and the BLM are different issues. Why are you conflating them?

Second, a lot of people don't understand reparations. It's not about passing out checks to blacks. It's off topic but I'll give a quick example then it needs another thread.

Million-dollar masterpiece paintings have been recovered from Germany and returned to the heirs of the people the paintings were stolen from.

Do you think that's OK?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

If you guys are so keen on wealth redistribution, I could use some scratch. I call my autonomous zone 'Cops Unwelcome Near Thermal's Street'. Cash is fine.

Now reparations has become "wealth redistribution".

Yep, all them black welfare queens. Let's bring that dog whistle in too.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

So, wait... Seattle has not actually turned into a Mad Max-type hellscape of Antifa and BLM goons assaulting real Americans? It’s just a generally peaceful social experiment involving a few blocks squared?

Damn it. What do we even have A-10s for?

The Capitol Hill Block Party that takes over some of the same streets and Cal Anderson Park for three days every summer is more like what we're seeing here minus a lot of the food, beer and music. Streets are blocked for ~5 days because there is also set up and take-down.

Maybe not as long, but it also takes over more blocks and the loud music goes on later into the night.

 

[Stout]

It's metaphorical for Pete's sake. What a way to distort what a speaker was talking about.

Sure...and my post at #95 was also a metaphor.

 

[Ranb]

I watched a video of a preacher being confronted by occupiers in CHAZ. There was a scuffle and lots of shouting. Various websites including crackpot ones are posting the video. Can't find it on more mainstream news sites though. The Blaze website is the first site that shows up on DuckDuckGo. The videos I've seen were edited.

 

[sir drinks-a-lot]

Okay! But so far they haven’t asked me for anything. Except to not be murdered by the police.

I think this particular type of hyperbole probably explains why you think the left leaning media is not warping reality. The idea that people have to ask not to be murdered by police is silly and has absolutely no basis in reality. It's extraordinarily easy to not be murdered by police and, yes, this includes people of color.