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Anybody else ready for libertarianism?

Are you ready for libertarianism?


  • Total voters
    68

MrFrankZito

Thinker
Joined
May 14, 2005
Messages
226
Anybody else a bit tired of the old liberal/conservative dichotomy? I am equally dissatisfied with the Republicans and the Democrats. The Republicans are slaves to the wacko religious right. The Democrats are so enslaved to unions that they insist on opposing Free Trade, which, in contrast to protectionism, actually stimulates the economy. The Republican party has become a party of imperialism, which views the rest of the world as a huge chess board. According to the Republicans, we should "move the pieces" as we see fit, in order to craft a world better suited to us. Then the Democrats oppose a common-sense measure like drilling for oil in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge. For somebody like me---social liberal, fiscal conservative, free trader, military isolationist---the only party left is the Libertarian Party. Libertarians believe in personal freedom, personal responsibility, maximum liberty and rugged individualism.

What do you-all think about libertarian ideals such as my own? Is the US ready for libertarian governance?
 
Anybody else a bit tired of the old liberal/conservative dichotomy? I am equally dissatisfied with the Republicans and the Democrats. The Republicans are slaves to the wacko religious right. The Democrats are so enslaved to unions that they insist on opposing Free Trade, which, in contrast to protectionism, actually stimulates the economy. The Republican party has become a party of imperialism, which views the rest of the world as a huge chess board. According to the Republicans, we should "move the pieces" as we see fit, in order to craft a world better suited to us. Then the Democrats oppose a common-sense measure like drilling for oil in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge. For somebody like me---social liberal, fiscal conservative, free trader, military isolationist---the only party left is the Libertarian Party. Libertarians believe in personal freedom, personal responsibility, maximum liberty and rugged individualism.

What do you-all think about libertarian ideals such as my own? Is the US ready for libertarian governance?

I agree with much of the LP's platform, however I don't think they will ever amount to much sadly. One of the major things I disagree with their platform and you is military isolationism, otherwise I am basicall a social liberal fiscal conservative. Not much room seemingly in any country on this planet for us.

Edited to add I'd a voted for Planet X but you didn't make it an option. :(

:)
 
Want a good test of whether you are a libertarian or not? Read the following 15 position statements, taken from libertariandefender.blogspot.com

They are NOT 100% libertarian. But, they are generally libertarian, and should serve as a useful tool here.

1. The government should get out of the marriage business and instead issue only civil union licenses. As an element of that, such licenses should be granted to homosexual couples, polygamous groups and incestuous couples, providing that they are all consenting adults.

2. The government should get out of the censorship business, and revoke the FCC's unconstitutional power to declare certain things "indecent" or "obscene." Indeed, not even state/local governments should have such authority. The standards should be very simple: If a real crime of some sort is depicted on the videotape or in the magazine, one may prosecute the crime committed.

3. Free trade policy should be fully embraced, and global free trade alliances sought. Tariffs and protectionism should be considered "dirty words" and never viewed as a viable solution to any problem.

4. Military spending should be drastically cut. The military should only be used for defense, and never for imperialistic purposes. With such a policy, the US would never have gotten involved in Vietnam, the Rwandan genocide, Kosovo, the current Iraq debacle, or the Mid-East peace process.

5. Drastically cut back foreign aid (perhaps to zero), particularly military/political aid. Slowly begin to withdraw from, or play a lesser role in, organizations such as NATO and other permanent military alliances.

6. Remove religion from the public square. No more "Under God" and no more "In God We Trust." No more swearing on Bibles in the government and no more publicly posted Ten Commandments. Religion, much like pornography, for example, must be isolated to the realm of the private.

7. Finally end the War on Drugs. Period. Legalize all drugs for adult sale/use, including substances such as steroids and ephedra.

8. Formally recognize that personal medical decisions are PERSONAL medical decisions. The government has no right to interfere with such things as abortion or assisted suicide.

9. Outlaw capital punishment. Any government that has the power to kill its citizens is too powerful. And, one must never forget that innocent people have been executed, and many people have been exonerated while on Death Row awaiting execution.

10. Cut back government spending on health coverage, with the goal of making it zero. The government footing one's health bills only gives the government more justification to interject itself into one's personal health choices. If one is responsible for one's own medical bills, one will have full freedom to make whatever healthy/unhealthy choices one wishes.

11. Since an educated populace is any country's greatest strength, renew federal efforts to make education more accessible, more affordable and of better quality. School vouchers will NEVER be a part of the solution; vouchers are part of the problem. After all, apparently, private schools have a right to teach fiction as truth (Intelligent Design).

12. Reduce our use of coal and oil. Work toward creating better means of producing energy. Aim for a time when the US will have no use for oil whatsoever. Then, we can truly free ourselves from Middle Eastern policy.

13. Crack down on illegal immigration. Deport illegals, irrespective of if they've been here for 2 days or 2 decades. Do not reward criminal behavior with amnesty or work-toward-legalization programs. Crack down on companies that hire illegals, and file lawsuits against such companies.

14. Secure the right of law-abiding gun owners to own firearms. Punish the crime: not ownership. While background checks are just common sense, making things illegal to all (criminals and non-criminals) is overly intrusive and unacceptable.

15. "Nanny laws" such as seatbelt laws and helmet laws are totally inappropriate with respect to adults. The government shall enact no law that is "for your own good" or "designed to protect you from yourself."
 
MrFrankZito, you previously registered as WWFStern, didn't you? You posted some things in this thread before, here to be exact.

I suggest you go report yourself to a moderator for a possible violation of forum rules.
 
Anybody else a bit tired of the old liberal/conservative dichotomy? I am equally dissatisfied with the Republicans and the Democrats. The Republicans are slaves to the wacko religious right. The Democrats are so enslaved to unions that they insist on opposing Free Trade, which, in contrast to protectionism, actually stimulates the economy. The Republican party has become a party of imperialism, which views the rest of the world as a huge chess board. According to the Republicans, we should "move the pieces" as we see fit, in order to craft a world better suited to us. Then the Democrats oppose a common-sense measure like drilling for oil in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge. For somebody like me---social liberal, fiscal conservative, free trader, military isolationist---the only party left is the Libertarian Party. Libertarians believe in personal freedom, personal responsibility, maximum liberty and rugged individualism.

What do you-all think about libertarian ideals such as my own? Is the US ready for libertarian governance?

Mr Frankie,

You may want to stop now. The Libertarian Party worshipers have all been pretty much laughed off the forum. For example, I don't think Shanek has posted for quite a while.
 
I am active on numerous forums, and I usually try to have uniformity in my handle.

I no longer use the WWFStern handle on a regular basis (primarily because it refers to something that no longer exists, 'The World Wrestling Federation,' and often makes people think I work for the 'World Wildlife Fund').

I now generally use MrFrankZito, and thus re-registered with my "universal" identity. WWFStern can be deleted from the forums, as I have no intention of going back to that handle.
 
Well, MrFrankZito, I suggest you explain that to a moderator/administrator because on this board having more than one handle is "streng verboten". You could be banned for it.
 
I voted "all wrong" because that's the closest answer.

But it's not correct. The poll is flawed seriously, and needs a "they are all full of it" option.

Many aspects of libertarianism are sensible. Some are absurd. The same is true of unbridled capitalism, enormously true of nearly every aspect of extreme socialism and communism.

But there's no way to state that in the poll.
 
I'm surprised. I mean, I would understand it if somebody was making a post and having two sock puppets agree with it robotically. In a case such as this, though, where WWFStern is retired, never to appear again, I'm surprised it matters. Anyway, we'll see what happens. I certainly don't want to be banned! :o
 
I'm surprised. I mean, I would understand it if somebody was making a post and having two sock puppets agree with it robotically. In a case such as this, though, where WWFStern is retired, never to appear again, I'm surprised it matters. Anyway, we'll see what happens. I certainly don't want to be banned! :o
Well the forum rules state that "You may only have one membership account. Multiple accounts (sock puppets) are not permitted." You're probably right that retired accounts isn't what they're aming at, but you could just PM a moderator and ask them to delete your old account.
 
7. Finally end the War on Drugs. Period. Legalize all drugs for adult sale/use, including substances such as steroids and ephedra.

You ever here of something called antibiotic resistance? Now in the light of that can you see why the above is stupid?
 
quote: Finally end the War on Drugs. Period. Legalize all drugs for adult sale/use, including substances such as steroids and ephedra.

yep, you really want to make a point of stressing steroids and ephedra because they're responsible for sooooo many deaths compared to the amount of people who use them.
 
Seems to me Liberatarianism is all about people running their own lives, without interference from any government.

Problem is two-fold, at least: 1. most people are stupid. 2. Stupid actions committed by party A can often have adverse effects on parties B through
Z, through no fault of their own.

Since party A doesn't have the brains to see his actions are harming others, someone has to step in to protect others from him.

Seems to me many of the things Libertarians want would be, at least initially, very harmful to many folks. Remove Government assistance from health care and make poor people shoulder that burden alone? I'll thank you to leave my dying mother's Medicare-funded oxygen tanks alone.

Oh, the poor should have made good decisions through life so that they can take care of themselves? Think about all the systems that would have to change (like schools to name just one), in order to effect that policy. Makes me shudder. Not gonna happen.

Libertarianism is good for some things, but not for everything. This is only my opinion, so no, I'm not going to spend my time trying to "prove it." Take it or leave it are the only options I'm offering.
 
1. Given that marriage is often a passport to other entitlements, polygamy could be a way to abuse these entitlement. Also define consenting, many incestuous relationships may be superficially consenting but underneath there may be an abuse of power.

5. Aid is a way of positively influencing world opinion. To cut it may be prejudicial in the long term

7. Bad idea for the reasons described by Geni

12. Nice idea, but how ? Nuclear energy requires raw materials and somewhere to send the waste

15. Nanny laws protect me (or my insurance premiums) from you
 
Libertarianism is good for some things, but not for everything.

Name one thing that Libertarianism is good for, that isn't found in other political philosophies.

This is only my opinion, so no, I'm not going to spend my time trying to "prove it." Take it or leave it are the only options I'm offering.

I won't ask that you prove it, then. But I will ask you to name just that one thing. :)
 
Name one thing that Libertarianism is good for, that isn't found in other political philosophies.

I won't ask that you prove it, then. But I will ask you to name just that one thing. :)
But when he answers with that "one thing," do you promise not to ask him to prove that? ;)
 
Anybody else a bit tired of the old liberal/conservative dichotomy...
Welcome aboard. Even though you've been here before, your post and subsequent replies indicate you haven't seen a lot on this board. Most of us who've been here a while know about, for example, the "smallest political quiz." We've beaten some of this stuff to death.

Mostly, I think you'll find the American posters here are "small l" libertarians.

edited quote function
 
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Mostly, I think you'll find the American posters here are "small l" libertarians.
Bingo. I like freedom for individuals and businesses. However I concede that there needs be some degree of regulation and even socialism. The question is, how much? I like the typical, less is more approach. Too much worries more than too little.
 

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