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Buying a TV while Black

theprestige said:
Either the cops had a good reason to intervene, or they didn't. Unless you're already certain they had no good reason, then it seems like some inquiry into the circumstances around the return is appropriate.
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It seems to me that you and others are very willing to dream up all sorts of scenarios for what the Grays were doing, such as returning an old television to commit fraud, although we know that this is not the case.

But you are not willing to ask why the cops rush straight in to grab the son without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate.
 
I am not aware of any evidence that any crime was committed by the customers. If I'm missing something, let me know.
 
Robin said:
But you are not willing to ask why the cops rush straight in to grab the son without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate.
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Okay. Why did the cops rush straight in to grab the son without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate?

Are we even sure that's exactly what happened?
 
theprestige said:
Okay. Why did the cops rush straight in to grab the son without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate?

Are we even sure that's exactly what happened?
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Did you see the video?
 
Robin said:
Did you see the video?
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Yes, we have store security video of it, did you not watch it or read my previous post summarizing what happened in it?

The first cop to arrive walks over to where Derek and his mother are talking with the employee. Derek and the cop exchange words (sorry not a lip reader) and then the cop tries to grab Derek's arm in an attempt to cuff him.

So yes, the cop walks in and immediately determines that the agitated black guy need to be in handcuffs, an action that started the entire incident.

This is the same cop that decided that since the black guy didn't allow him to put on those cuffs and was now walking away from him back to where his mother was, that the black guy needed to be tackled forcefully into a wall where a fire extinguisher was hanging, and then suplexed into the concrete floor of the store.
 
Robin said:
Also, no-one has suggested a crime that they could plausibly have been committing.
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The police did claim that Derek pulled the fire extinguisher from the wall in an attempt to attack the cop with it, though strangely he was never charged with it. Probably because the store video clearly shows that what really happened was that after being slammed into the wall and fire extinguisher by a cop tackling him from behind, Derek grabbed the fire extinguisher to try and prevent the cop from suplexing him into the concrete floor, an action that failed when the extinguisher simply came loose from its housing.
 
theprestige said:
Now imagine someone doing that with an old TV in the new TV box, trying to bully the clerk out of doing their due diligence, getting the police called on them for their belligerence, escalating, and calling the whole thing racism because he happens to be black.
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Are you suggesting that’s what happened this time?
 
theprestige said:
Either the cops had a good reason to intervene, or they didn't. Unless you're already certain they had no good reason, then it seems like some inquiry into the circumstances around the return is appropriate.
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Remember, this happened in America, land of the free and home of the brave -

- where a white cop can harass and detain a black man for picking up trash outside his home;

- where a white cop can walk into a black man's apartment and gun him down while he is sitting on his sofa eating ice-cream

- where white cops can bust into wrong house (and by "wrong", I mean 10 miles away from the one they were looking for), looking for a black suspect they already had in custody and shot the black woman owner eight times in her bed, killing her

- where two white rednecks (one an ex-Cop) can gun down and kill black jogger in cold blood, and it takes a leaked video months later, and a public outcry before law enforcement are shamed into taking action.

So, what the **** ever gave you the idea that a cop even needs a good reason to intervene when a black man is having an argument in a shop - he's ******* black isn't he? Hell yeah!!! That is the only ******* reason he thinks he needs!!
 
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PhantomWolf said:
Yes, we have store security video of it, did you not watch it or read my previous post summarizing what happened in it?

The first cop to arrive walks over to where Derek and his mother are talking with the employee. Derek and the cop exchange words (sorry not a lip reader) and then the cop tries to grab Derek's arm in an attempt to cuff him.

So yes, the cop walks in and immediately determines that the agitated black guy need to be in handcuffs, an action that started the entire incident.

This is the same cop that decided that since the black guy didn't allow him to put on those cuffs and was now walking away from him back to where his mother was, that the black guy needed to be tackled forcefully into a wall where a fire extinguisher was hanging, and then suplexed into the concrete floor of the store.
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I can't see the video due to the sites lazy approach to GDPR regs in Europe. Is there any video of the moments before the cops turn up or does it start with the cops walking in?

Is this the video?



I believe the full 27 minute video is available at this location I can't access it though. If it is 27 minutes long that suggests a fair bit of "something" before the cops became involved. Can somebody go over and have a looksee?
 
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theprestige said:
Now imagine someone doing that with an old TV in the new TV box, trying to bully the clerk out of doing their due diligence, getting the police called on them for their belligerence, escalating, and calling the whole thing racism because he happens to be black.
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While ST's overcome with excitement at finally having a fan fiction scenario where the black guy is in the wrong to get his teeth into, let's remember, of course, that even if this had happened, it was after Derek Grey had been accused by a police officer of committing a crime that had occurred only in that officer's imagination. There's literally no way Grey could be seen to be in the wrong in the encounter that led to the later incident (as well as, of course, not a shred of evidence that either Grey did a single thing illegal, immoral or even vaguely questionable at any point in the entire proceedings).

Dave
 
bluesjnr said:
I can't see the video due to the sites lazy approach to GDPR regs in Europe. Is there any video of the moments before the cops turn up or does it start with the cops walking in?

Is this the video?



I believe the full 27 minute video is available at this location I can't access it though. If it is 27 minutes long that suggests a fair bit of "something" before the cops became involved. Can somebody go over and have a looksee?
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That is it, though it's a bit chopped up. It doesn't show the initial grab which happened prior to first part of the video shown starting, and then later on for some reason they jump over it with an edit. It does show the tackle and "supplex" with Derek vainly grabbing hold of the fire extinguisher to stop himself from being thrown backwards.

The rest of the 27 minutes really is just the two on the ground with the cops holding them down before they are taken out as is shown in this edited version. Most of the "action" happens in the first couple of minutes.
 
Dave Rogers said:
While ST's overcome with excitement at finally having a fan fiction scenario where the black guy is in the wrong to get his teeth into, let's remember, of course, that even if this had happened, it was after Derek Grey had been accused by a police officer of committing a crime that had occurred only in that officer's imagination. There's literally no way Grey could be seen to be in the wrong in the encounter that led to the later incident (as well as, of course, not a shred of evidence that either Grey did a single thing illegal, immoral or even vaguely questionable at any point in the entire proceedings).

Dave
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The surname is Gray not Grey. It's not a colour thing. :p
 
theprestige said:
Now imagine someone doing that with an old TV in the new TV box, trying to bully the clerk out of doing their due diligence, getting the police called on them for their belligerence, escalating, and calling the whole thing racism because he happens to be black.
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I Am The Scum said:
I am not aware of any evidence that any crime was committed by the customers. If I'm missing something, let me know.
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You're missing that you have to imagine that's what they were doing. If you imagine hard enough you can convince yourself that everything's alright.
 
smartcooky said:
Remember, this happened in America, land of the free and home of the brave -

- where a white cop can harass and detain a black man for picking up trash outside his home;

- where a white cop can walk into a black man's apartment and gun him down while he is sitting on his sofa eating ice-cream

- where white cops can bust into wrong house (and by "wrong", I mean 10 miles away from the one they were looking for), looking for a black suspect they already had in custody and shot the black woman owner eight times in her bed, killing her

- where two white rednecks (one an ex-Cop) can gun down and kill black jogger in cold blood, and it takes a leaked video months later, and a public outcry before law enforcement are shamed into taking action.

So, what the **** ever gave you the idea that a cop even needs a good reason to intervene when a black man is having an argument in a shop - he's ******* black isn't he? Hell yeah!!! That is the only ******* reason he thinks he needs!!
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Why are you yelling at me?

ETA: Also, the attitude expressed in this post is every bit as bigoted as the attitude it condemns.
 
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Robin said:
Did you see the video?
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I've read PW's summary, which I trust to be accurate.

We don't know what happened before the beginning of that clip. We don't have any audio of what was said, before or during the clip.

So no, I don't think we can be sure that "without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate" is exactly what happened.

But okay, whatever. We can still question why what happened in that video happened in that video. Why did it happen? Do you know?
 
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