The all-new "US Politics and coronavirus" thread

[newyorkguy]

First of all, before we start talking about people being out of work for two years we might want to take a deep breathe. No public health official I am aware of is predicting that. We might be in for some rough economic times but that's not going to directly kill you the way coronavirus might. Public health officials say, the danger is, not that we can drag on like this if all the states reopen. The danger is this epidemic could explode if all the states reopen too soon. And by too soon I don't think they mean before 2022.

Good to remember- There is no effective treatment. There is no vaccine. As Dr. Fauci has said repeatedly, if this truly got out of control the economic damage it might do could dwarf the effects of a prolonged shutdown.

It would also do well to remember what we could be dealing with.

The 1918 influenza pandemic was the most severe pandemic in recent history. It was caused by an H1N1 virus with genes of avian origin. Although there is not universal consensus regarding where the virus originated, it spread worldwide during 1918-1919. In the United States, it was first identified in military personnel in spring 1918. It is estimated that about 500 million people or one-third of the world’s population became infected with this virus. The number of deaths was estimated to be at least 50 million worldwide with about 675,000 occurring in the United States. Link

 

[acbytesla]

First of all, before we start talking about people being out of work for two years we might want to take a deep breathe. No public health official I am aware of is predicting that. We might be in for some rough economic times but that's not going to directly kill you the way coronavirus might. Public health officials say, the danger is, not that we can drag on like this if all the states reopen. The danger is this epidemic could explode if all the states reopen too soon. And by too soon I don't think they mean before 2022.

Good to remember- There is no effective treatment. There is no vaccine. As Dr. Fauci has said repeatedly, if this truly got out of control the economic damage it might do could dwarf the effects of a prolonged shutdown.

It would also do well to remember what we could be dealing with.

I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm looking at the politics of this. I.dont live in a highly dense city but I have lived in Queens, Seattle and LA. I also have spent particularly recently a lot of time in rural America. The shutdown from their perspective has been more oppressive than the virus. Trump isn't going to win NY and California, so he's throwing them overboard.

 

[Aridas]

Yep.

What this event really shows is the failure of the capitalist system dealing with something like this. This may affect the super-wealthy but the people that really will pay are ordinary Americans. Maybe some actual leadership in the White House might make a difference. By that I mean a President who isn't an idiot and isn't spending every minute trying to divide the country and world.

To poke at this...

Amid the Coronavirus Pandemic, America's Billionaires Survive and Prosper

Financially, they are doing remarkably well. According to the Institute for Policy Studies, between March 18 and April 28, as nearly 30 million Americans applied for unemployment benefits, the wealth of America’s 630 billionaires grew by nearly 14 percent. During April 2020 alone, their wealth increased by over $406 billion, bringing it to $3.4 trillion. According to estimates by Forbes, the 400 richest Americans now possess as much wealth as held by nearly two-thirds of American households combined.

Some of the super-rich have fared particularly well. Jeff Bezos (the wealthiest man in the world) saw his wealth soar between January 1 and early May 2020 to $142 billion―an increase of $27.5 billion. During that same period, Elon Musk’s wealth grew by $11.4 billion to $39 billion and the wealth of Steve Ballmer (ranking sixth in wealth) increased by $8 billion to $66.1 billion. The gains of Mark Zuckerberg (ranking third) were more modest, but his wealth did rise to $79.3 billion.

Although some billionaires lost money, this was not likely to put them out on the streets. The wealth of Bill Gates (ranking second) dropped from about $113 billion to $106 billion, while the wealth of Larry Ellison (ranking ninth) slipped from $58.8 billion to $58.7 billion.

Capitalism working as usual. As a general rule, capitalism causes wealth to gather towards a very few people - which is one of the major reasons why trickle-down theory was farcical from the start. Accelerating the trickle-up tends to accomplish the exact opposite of what needs to happen for long-term sustainability.

 

[Craig4]

Checking the news lately has been really disappointing. I keep hoping Trump will catch the virus.

 

[carlosy]

Checking the news lately has been really disappointing. I keep hoping Trump will catch the virus.

It will porbably bounce off of him, like all the other countless scandals he is producing on a weekly basis.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Businesses Chafing Under Covid-19 Lockdowns Turn to Armed Defiance

Armed militia-style protesters have helped businesses across Texas defy coronavirus lockdowns and reopen. Protesters say they are enforcing the Constitution.

SHEPHERD, Texas — When Jamie Williams decided to reopen her East Texas tattoo studio last week in defiance of the state’s coronavirus restrictions, she asked Philip Archibald for help. He showed up with his dog Zeus, his friends and his AR-15 semiautomatic rifle.

Mr. Archibald established an armed perimeter in the parking lot outside Crash-N-Burn Tattoo, secured by five men with military-style rifles, tactical shotguns, camouflage vests and walkie-talkies.

In at least a half dozen cases around the state in recent days, frustrated small-business owners have turned to heavily armed, militia-style protesters like Mr. Archibald’s group to serve as reopening security squads.

Around the state, groups of rifle-carrying demonstrators have volunteered their services to small-business owners, and have taken to social media to urge people to defy the authorities where necessary and reopen with armed support.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

trump: "We have more cases than anyone else in the world. Why? We're testing. When you test, you have a case. When you test, you find something is wrong with people. If we didn't do any testing we would have very few cases."

Also, "doctors and nurses are "running into death just like soldiers running into bullets" and that "it's a beautiful thing to see."

But yes, I know, I'm a virtue signalling libtard who's just sore Clinton lost, this is taken out of context, fake news, MSM witch hunt, and butbutbutobama/obamagate/biden/her emails/the flu.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Focusing on death isn't going to change the minds of the macho no mask crowd. That they might wind up incapacitated would scare them more.

What percentage of them smoke, do you suppose? Or overeat?

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

There's a lot of people that cannot stand being unemployed for a year or two.

They could with the right government assistance. But I know that the US has a real issue when it comes to welfare.

Or, at least, when that welfare is aimed at poor people, rather than big businesses and farmers.

 

[chrispy]

The 53,000 Americans killed by your vehicle emissions every year (some of them moms) say, "hey!"

http://news.mit.edu/2013/study-air-pollution-causes-200000-early-deaths-each-year-in-the-us-0829

We are making choices for our individual benefit that kills others every day. No one is innocent.

Disingenuous at best. You know thatm I know that, so stop.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Disingenuous at best. You know thatm I know that, so stop.

No. It is the same thing.

 

[newyorkguy]

Where we may have a real crisis is FY 2021 when so many of the states have massive budget deficits due to the enormous drop in tax revenue. No one knows how that will play out and it's not in the news yet. But funding things like schools, public safety, roads, etc may be very difficult. Based on what happened following the 2008-2009 recession this is going to be huge problem.

 

[Regnad Kcin]

There is also that the focus on immediate death sanitizes it somehow. Like it is a binary thing. Not dying means full recovery. Sort of like being shot in a 50s TV western.

It is too early to be certain as to the degree, but it is clear this thing will cause people long term damage. Sure, maybe the fatality rate is 1%, but if another 20% suffer serious damage that limits their ability to work, that is perversely going to be a bigger problem. It is easy to ignore the dead. The walking wounded not so much.
Focusing on death isn't going to change the minds of the macho no mask crowd. That they might wind up incapacitated would scare them more.

Everything Trump touches dies, or thereabouts.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Where we may have a real crisis is FY 2021 when so many of the states have massive budget deficits due to the enormous drop in tax revenue. No one knows how that will play out and it's not in the news yet. But funding things like schools, public safety, roads, etc may be very difficult. Based on what happened following the 2008-2009 recession this is going to be huge problem.

It's been in the news here, some of it anyway.

The GOP is claiming states want a bailout because they were 'already failing' (**coughBlueStatescough**). McConnell and Trump both are using this dishonest talking point. They will block 'bailouts' yada yada. And here's the kicker: Unless Trump gets the tax cut he wants he won't sign the next bill.

Tax cuts? Is he kidding? Tax cuts for the ******* rich! No bailouts for Blue states! This is a stale playbook. They are already getting pushback on the so called bailouts for states which obviously are not just the Blue states.

I don't think Trump's tax cuts, which no doubt he still thinks is an election winner, has gotten enough news coverage. The only people that can possibly benefit from the "payroll tax cut" are people with good paying jobs who don't need financial help. That or said payroll tax cut will go to employers? And almost certainly McConnell has his eye on cutting the FICA tax (Federal Insurance Contributions Act). Gee what a coincidence that is the tax that specifically funds Social Security.

 

[Delphic Oracle]

Purportedly from Columbus, OH.

Note the street is blocked so patrons can spread out and be safe(r).

 

[Beelzebuddy]

The GOP is claiming states want a bailout because they were 'already failing' (**coughBlueStatescough**).

The frustrating thing is it would be so easy to flip the script, because it's actually the red states that are deeply dependent on federal handouts.

If the blue states even hinted they'd be okay on their own all of the red states that are currently pissing away their long-term stability for short-term economic gains are going to be ****, because they're counting on Uncle Sam to ultimately foot the bill for treating Jackass McBarfly's grandma's hospital bill.

All it would take is a fraction of the disregard for human suffering that the GOP displays on a daily basis.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

The frustrating thing is it would be so easy to flip the script, because it's actually the red states that are deeply dependent on federal handouts.

If the blue states even hinted they'd be okay on their own all of the red states that are currently pissing away their long-term stability for short-term economic gains are going to be ****, because they're counting on Uncle Sam to ultimately foot the bill for treating Jackass McBarfly's grandma's hospital bill.

All it would take is a fraction of the disregard for human suffering that the GOP displays on a daily basis.

Makes me think of a retort to McConnell's not wanting to bail out states in trouble before the shutdown: Name the states. But it would be wrong because the real issue is, states in trouble or not, they still need help now for this.

 

[newyorkguy]

As the week ends we're closing in on 90,000 deaths from coronavirus and Saturday's figures are not recorded yet. Just a few short weeks ago lt. gov. Dan Patrick was complaining to Tucker Carlson that all the estimates were overblown. That the death toll would be less than 60,000. trump made similar comments. Since May 1 almost 25,000 Americans have lost their lives to coronavirus, an average of over 1,600 a day. It seems to come in waves but at the current rate we'll pass 100,000 by the end of next week.

 

[fromdownunder]

I doubt that the deaths actually come in waves. I just checked worldometer and over the past seven weeks the two smallest death rate days every week have been Sunday and Monday. I suspect that the purported "waves" are simply an artifact of reporting methods.


Norm

 

[bruto]

As the week ends we're closing in on 90,000 deaths from coronavirus and Saturday's figures are not recorded yet. Just a few short weeks ago lt. gov. Dan Patrick was complaining to Tucker Carlson that all the estimates were overblown. That the death toll would be less than 60,000. trump made similar comments. Since May 1 almost 25,000 Americans have lost their lives to coronavirus, an average of over 1,600 a day. It seems to come in waves but at the current rate we'll pass 100,000 by the end of next week.

I thought I heard on today's news (Saturday) that the number was already over 100K.