Jogging in Georgia while black.

[Skeptic Tank]

If two black people, one of them an ex-cop, had chased down a white jogger who they'd seen looking round a construction site, then shot him dead when he tried to defend himself, would you consider that reasonable too, and expect no charges to be brought?

Dave

If he charged them and grabbed a gun while punching? Sure.

That scenario is less likely to occur but not impossible.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Has it been established yet who made the 911 call saying that there was a black man running down the road? IIRC, the McMichaels said that they called 911, and ISTR that the other 911 call was made by someone else.

Whoever it was who made that call, I would say that it was indicative of a racist mindset.

 

[Dave Rogers]

If he charged them and grabbed a gun while punching? Sure.

So are you arguing that the law on citizen's arrest is irrelevant, that anyone is acting reasonably if they initiate an armed confrontation with anyone else for any perceived crime they believe the other has committed even if it's as trivial as walking briefly on to someone else's property, and that if the supposed criminal dies as a result of the situation it's their own fault? Are you, in effect, arguing for vigilante justice with no enforceable limits?

I just hope nobody with a gun ever sees you jaywalking.

Dave

 

[Skeptic Tank]

Has it been established yet who made the 911 call saying that there was a black man running down the road? IIRC, the McMichaels said that they called 911, and ISTR that the other 911 call was made by someone else.

Whoever it was who made that call, I would say that it was indicative of a racist mindset.

My understanding is that the first call was made by Travis, the second one was made by Greg as they were in the truck tailing Ahmaud. The "black male running down the road" was quick wording in the heat of a chase, and you're overthinking it and looking to frame everything as racism.

That phrase was not the entirety of that call, was it? Isn't that phrase from the same one where the shooting starts and the call cuts off?

EDIT: Actually I'm still giving you too much credit. What's even wrong with that wording anyway? It accurately described WHAT THE POLICE SHOULD BE LOOKING FOR WHEN THEY ARRIVE.

This "any reference to black people ever, or any interaction with black people by white people - is always racist" crap is absolutely beyond the point of tiresome and deep in the heart of stupidity.

So are you arguing that the law on citizen's arrest is irrelevant, that anyone is acting reasonably if they initiate an armed confrontation with anyone else for any perceived crime they believe the other has committed even if it's as trivial as walking briefly on to someone else's property, and that if the supposed criminal dies as a result of the situation it's their own fault? Are you, in effect, arguing for vigilante justice with no enforceable limits?

I just hope nobody with a gun ever sees you jaywalking.

Dave

I'm saying they were within the citizen's arrest law, as the trial will show.

 

[uke2se]

This got silly 40 pages ago. Now it's disgusting. Please stop engaging the racists. Pretty please.

They are wrong. You know it, they know it, we all know it. You don't have to post that they are wrong in this thread. Doing so is taking part in the game they are playing.

 

[Garb]

I'm saying they were within the citizen's arrest law, as the trial will show.

You have not once been close to demonstrating this.

 

[Dave Rogers]

I'm saying they were within the citizen's arrest law, as the trial will show.

It's been repeatedly demonstrated in this thread that they were not, as they had no reasonable grounds for suspicion that Arbery had committed anything more than a misdemeanor and no direct knowledge that he had committed even that. In your interpretation of the law, summary execution for dropping a crisp packet would be impossible to prosecute as a crime.

Dave

 

[carlitos]

For the UKian-challenged - "crisp packet" = "empty bag of chips" in USAian.

 

[Robin]

I'm saying they were within the citizen's arrest law, as the trial will show.

We will see.

It certainly wouldn't wash in Australia, you can't go after someone with deadly force for a vague suspicion that someone might have committed a minor crime.

We have things like perspective, restraint and common sense over here.

 

[Skeptic Tank]

We will see.

It certainly wouldn't wash in Australia, you can't go after someone with deadly force for a vague suspicion that someone might have committed a minor crime.

We have things like perspective, restraint and common sense over here.

From Wikipedia:

"African Australians are Australians of African ancestry.[1][2] Large-scale immigration from Africa to Australia is only a recent phenomenon, with Europe and Asia traditionally being the largest sources of migration to Australia.

1.6% of Australian population"

ETA: For reference, Brunswick Georgia is 59.23% Black

Try living somewhere with that percentage some time. Check back with me.

 

[Robin]

We will see.

It certainly wouldn't wash in Australia, you can't go after someone with deadly force for a vague suspicion that someone might have committed a minor crime.

We have things like perspective, restraint and common sense over here.

And I'm not saying things are perfect here. Far from it.

 

[Robin]

From Wikipedia:

Why do you keep bringing race into it?

I haven't mentioned that once.

And it is completely and utterly irrelevant to what I said.

 

[Dave Rogers]

So apparently the whole citizens' arrest discussion isn't about race except when it is, and the racists get to decide which is which.

Dave

 

[Crossbow]

This got silly 40 pages ago. Now it's disgusting. Please stop engaging the racists. Pretty please.

They are wrong. You know it, they know it, we all know it. You don't have to post that they are wrong in this thread. Doing so is taking part in the game they are playing.

You are quite correct.

All too often the Forum has tolerate all sorts of stupid, idiotic, lying nonsense.

 

[Robin]

ETA: For reference, Brunswick Georgia is 59.23% Black

Try living somewhere with that percentage some time. Check back with me.

Again, I can't understand the relevance of this to what I said.

What I said has nothing to do with race whatsoever. Are you trying to suck me into a race debate?

 

[Skeptic Tank]

Again, I can't understand the relevance of this to what I said.

What I said has nothing to do with race whatsoever. Are you trying to suck me into a race debate?

I'm saying that you bragging about Australia not having armed citizens protecting their neighborhoods struck me as similar to if you had bragged about how little need you feel for the cruel practice of using sled dogs.

 

[MarkCorrigan]

So, what you are saying then is that Aussies don't feel the need to have an armed populous because they have a very small number of immigrant black people, whereas because this part of Georgia is over 50% black it is natural that the white locals will want to have guns?

 

[I Am The Scum]

So apparently the whole citizens' arrest discussion isn't about race except when it is, and the racists get to decide which is which.

Dave

Also, you're the bad guy for even mentioning this fact.

 

[Robin]

I'm saying that you bragging about Australia not having armed citizens protecting their neighborhoods...

I didn't say that. I said we had perspective, restraint, perspective and common sense.

You can have that whereever you live, whatever your demographic.

The McMichaels suspected this guy of pilfering stuff from a building site and went after him with a shotgun and a Magnum .357, yes?

They ended up bungling the job so badly they got him killed. That is, to put it mildly, dumb.

If all they wanted to do was to get this guy arrested then anyone with even rudimentary intelligence could have achieved this without anyone getting hurt.

And all this is under the assumption that they didn't want the guy killed.

 

[JoeMorgue]

So apparently the whole citizens' arrest discussion isn't about race except when it is, and the racists get to decide which is which.

Dave

Again, and we saw this with the Guyver thread as well, we're for some reason forced to accept what the people who gunned down the black person claim about their state of mind as accurate without question.

Again we are being told we have to start at "Well we asked the person are you a racist and they said no so I guess that's case closed" and stay there.