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Cont: 2019-nCoV / Corona virus Pt 3

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Sherkeu said:
Why is it that we always know exact numbers of those dead and injured in a terrorist attack?
No one asks family in that instance even though many die in hospital. Those numbers aren't even as important as a pandemic.
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It may be because those people die from a crime rather than because of a disease. HIPPA covers the diseased, but not the murdered.

I think.
 
Darat said:
That is simply not true. It may be SOP to inform family before updating the statistics but that is a policy not a legal requirement.
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It is true. The cause of death is confidential medical information and confidentiality does not stop with death. The hospital cannot legally release that information without consent of next of kin. There is a legal requirement for a doctor to certify cause of death, and that certificate has to be presented to the registrar of deaths etc. by the next of kin*. A copy of that certificate then goes to central statistics office that record data such as age sex etc. so national statistics can be produced. The office has a legal duty to produce reports so are not bound by confidentiality. Since the numbers are aggregated over an area and time rather than being from a specific hospital on a particular day the data is far more anonymous.

Since Covid-19 is a notifiable infectious disease there is a separate requirement to notify all cases to the local public health department, effectively this is done by an end of day line listing emailed to the department. again there is then a national collection of data.

* This may be done electronically.
 
Planigale said:
It is true. The cause of death is confidential medical information and confidentiality does not stop with death. The hospital cannot legally release that information without consent of next of kin. There is a legal requirement for a doctor to certify cause of death, and that certificate has to be presented to the registrar of deaths etc. by the next of kin*. A copy of that certificate then goes to central statistics office that record data such as age sex etc. so national statistics can be produced. The office has a legal duty to produce reports so are not bound by confidentiality. Since the numbers are aggregated over an area and time rather than being from a specific hospital on a particular day the data is far more anonymous.



Since Covid-19 is a notifiable infectious disease there is a separate requirement to notify all cases to the local public health department, effectively this is done by an end of day line listing emailed to the department. again there is then a national collection of data.



* This may be done electronically.
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No it is not true. Updating the number of deaths in a hospital does not breach confidentiality.
 
Now I'm wondering how UK's statistics on, say, traffic accidents are collected. Do they have to ask permission from every family that a had member die before it can be put into the national statistic?
 
lionking said:
My son who recently returned to Australia from London has just been diagnosed with the virus.

Fortunately he has been in complete isolation since his return.
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I'm so sorry, Lionking. My thoughts and good wishes are with him and your family.
 
Ulf Nereng said:
Now I'm wondering how UK's statistics on, say, traffic accidents are collected. Do they have to ask permission from every family that a had member die before it can be put into the national statistic?
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No because there is a legal requirement to certify cause of death and for that certificate to be sent to the registrar of deaths etc. So the legal requirement overrides confidentiality. These are then amalgamated and become anonymised in that process. In any case a RTA is an unnatural death and goes through a different process in England a coroners court and in Scotland the fiscal. Like other courts a coroner's court is usually open to the public and the coroner legally has charge of the body and can make decisions with regards to what information goes into the public domain.
 
lionking said:
Is this a serious question?

London is not his home, he didn’t have a job there and he had no family there. And that’s just for starters.

**** me, what a stupid question.
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Whoa, dude!

The answer to the question "Why?" is, "Because Australia allows flights from Britain."

If Australia were dealing with this pandemic in the ultimately correct way it would not be (or not have been) allowing the flights. The emotions of a father and the occupation of a son would not matter.

How is Australia (or any country) supposed to beat this virus if it is continually imported from other places via the airlines? Your son brought Covid-19 from Britain to Australia.

Any country that would have "done it right" would have disallowed the entry of every single person without exception. Emotions and jobs are meaningless things when a deadly pandemic is happening.
 
Meridian said:
Thanks! I'd seen that but forgotten it; it's certainly highly relevant. Unfortunately to be really useful one would also need to know how many people from Vò were hospitalized/died. Someone knows that, but is the information publicly available? I've not manged to find it. It's not the best name for searching!
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3,300 tested, 89 positive:~50% asymptomatic or nonsymptomatic, ~20% mild typical symptoms, two hospitalised, one dead. The exact numbers are in one of the studies.
 
Darat said:
That is simply not true. It may be SOP to inform family before updating the statistics but that is a policy not a legal requirement.
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They were citing data protection laws. If they release cause of death then a person could be identified.
 
Babbylonian said:
Which "dept of health?" Because a cause of death by itself (e.g., "we have had a death caused by bacterial pneumonia today") is not protected medical information and health departments can require hospitals to report such information to them when there is a public health concern.
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England.
Identifying cause of death could lead to the identity of the deceased so it would break data protection laws is the line they were spinning
 
Planigale said:
It is true. The cause of death is confidential medical information and confidentiality does not stop with death. The hospital cannot legally release that information without consent of next of kin. There is a legal requirement for a doctor to certify cause of death, and that certificate has to be presented to the registrar of deaths etc. by the next of kin*. A copy of that certificate then goes to central statistics office that record data such as age sex etc. so national statistics can be produced. The office has a legal duty to produce reports so are not bound by confidentiality. Since the numbers are aggregated over an area and time rather than being from a specific hospital on a particular day the data is far more anonymous.

Since Covid-19 is a notifiable infectious disease there is a separate requirement to notify all cases to the local public health department, effectively this is done by an end of day line listing emailed to the department. again there is then a national collection of data.

* This may be done electronically.
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It isn't notifiable anymore, they changed that a couple of days ago.
 
Planigale said:
But the cause of death is confidential.
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Cause of death is a public record and therefore available for anyone to see. It is simply a compassionate policy to seek the relatives permission before releasing it and the death certificate being lodged. If you think about it if it was a legal requirement how would the death of people without known relatives be recorded?
 
ChristianProgressive said:
Also in China, scientists who caught the virus and recovered have come up positive AGAIN. It's mutated.
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Not just doctors.

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...onavirus-patients-test-negative-then-positive

But some Wuhan residents who had tested positive earlier and then recovered from the disease are testing positive for the virus a second time. Based on data from several quarantine facilities in the city, which house patients for further observation after their discharge from hospitals, about 5%-10% of patients pronounced "recovered" have tested positive again.

:boggled:
 
Belz... said:
Well don't keep us waiting. What do you believe it will have to do with?
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Many things.
If you look at the death rates in other countries they don’t seem to be dependent upon any particular form of government, leader or health care systems.
Mainly the nature of the virus.
Maybe Americans are more likely to ignore warnings. The roads were packed this morning and I am an hour east of NYC. Home Depot was packed (I didn’t go in),
I am guilty of this too although I was going to a deserted beach this morning. I don’t know if this is true or a dumb generalization.
People from all over the world come to NY and the US although this is true of other countries.
 
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a_unique_person said:
I'll offer up some prayers to medical science. My niece is returning from the UK. I'm hoping she makes it back without being infected.
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I don't understand this. Except for critical essential travel, why the hell is anyone flying after a pandemic is declared?

Here in Hawaii we are truly, finally calling out the selfish, ignorant and evil of people knowingly bringing this crap to each other. Its unthinkable to me, but hey, our morbid obesity makes texas look lean
 
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