2020 Democratic Candidates Tracker Part III

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Venom said:
Seems to play great among Democrats in general. They can't all be progressives right, especially in a state like Iowa. :rolleyes:

No lost tribe in Iowa. Just Americans sick of lack of healthcare and jobs.
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And where were all these voters in 2020?
 
SezMe said:
Can I have some of that stuff you're smoking?

"Compromise" actually became a serious liability ever since Moscow Mitch said their primary goal was a one-term president. The 2010 midterms establsished that as GOP orthodoxy.
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One of my great concerns is that the Dems might adapt the same policy.
Democracies cannot exist without compromise. Get rid of compromise and all you have left is a choice of authoritarianisms.
 
SezMe said:
That ad stinks. It will not move one single voter who is not already in the tank for Bernie.
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I know I am going to get hell for saying this but..the behavior of some..not all...of the Bernie Bros is pretty similar to that of the Trump supporters: a incredible ability to live in their own reality.
 
dudalb said:
I know I am going to get hell for saying this but..the behavior of some..not all...of the Bernie Bros is pretty similar to that of the Trump supporters: a incredible ability to live in their own reality.
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.... Which, one could argue, makes him more electable, since they are immune to the kind of Fake News attacks we are certain to see.
 
dudalb said:
I know I am going to get hell for saying this but..the behavior of some..not all...of the Bernie Bros is pretty similar to that of the Trump supporters: a incredible ability to live in their own reality.
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Damn, dude; you gonna answer my question or not? :rolleyes:


Cabbage said:
I do have a question I'd like to ask (my apologies if I am being redundant and you have already answered this previously--I don't recall seeing it):

This is directed to the people who are strongly condemning/warning against/whatever you wish to call it a Sanders primary win. Segnosaur and dudalb, for example (based on what I have seen).

If Sanders wins the primary, will you vote for him in the general?
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SezMe said:
Damn, used to be one could win a million bucks by being able to read people's minds.
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Yes, it does in fact require mind reading to be sure that Warren attempted to smear Bernie...

Oh, you mean my conclusion. Taken in context about the rest of what I said in that same point, I'm confident in sticking by it. Motivated reasoning gets the best of us. But if it makes you happy, feel free to add in 'there doesn't appear to be any reason to make the false assumptions you made except by working backwards from the conclusion you want'. Wait, I already said almost exactly that.
 
d4m10n said:
Serious question: Has Sanders ever once won any public office as a Democrat?
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No. He really isn't a Democrat and sometimes I think people don't give the Dems enough, well, 'credit' is the wrong word because it shouldn't be extra, for having the unfortunately uncommon 'basic decency' to allow him to run with as much access as he has.

While again I prefer Warren by a large margin and did vote for Bernie in the primary last time, I don't think being a 'Democratic Socialist' is as large a problem as some make it out to be. Yes, when you poll about the term it is a HUGE negative (more so than a lot of other negatives), but somehow that doesn't always transfer to someone who that label attaches too. Americans tend to poll as self identifying as conservative at a slightly higher rate than progressive too, but when you strip policies of scare terms and poll those, most Americans turn out to be decidedly progressive. Removed from their political tribal identity, they like most of the Dem ideas. Hell, when you ask about ideal ranges for a ton of things, like pay differences, they are EXTREMELY progressive and EXTREMELY mistaken on the current state of affairs.

So in a general I would depend on how Bernie played it. The independent Senator who has fought against the establishment of both parties for decades without giving in to either? Wins in a landslide. The Democratic caucus member who is a true socialist? Loses. Gives in to the personality cult followers? Loses. Throws those same followers under the bus to get more establishment support (a.k.a. going full McCain), loses.

There are so many factors being certain this candidate or that of the major ones will DEFINITELY lose or DEFINITELY win is foolish. EDIT: I see good arguments on both sides of the Bernie 'socialist' isusse. All the rest I want to say has pretty much been covered by Tragic Monkey I think.
 
Giz said:
I’m not sure that age is such a big thing this time... at least not between Bernie, Biden and trump.
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People in those age brackets wear their years very differently.
Trump does all right with his age- he comes across as a stupid ass, but not a particularly decrepit one.
Sanders has a kind of fire that might give him another heart attack- but keeps him seeming vibrant.
Biden, OTOH, really seems like he is fading fast- the "sleepy Joe" doesn't seem too far off the mark.
 
Distracted1 said:
People in those age brackets wear their years very differently.
Trump does all right with his age- he comes across as a stupid ass, but not a particularly decrepit one.
Sanders has a kind of fire that might give him another heart attack- but keeps him seeming vibrant.
Biden, OTOH, really seems like he is fading fast- the "sleepy Joe" doesn't seem too far off the mark.
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Bernie has something to say...
 
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tyr_13 said:
No. He really isn't a Democrat and sometimes I think people don't give the Dems enough, well, 'credit' is the wrong word because it shouldn't be extra, for having the unfortunately uncommon 'basic decency' to allow him to run with as much access as he has.

While again I prefer Warren by a large margin and did vote for Bernie in the primary last time, I don't think being a 'Democratic Socialist' is as large a problem as some make it out to be. Yes, when you poll about the term it is a HUGE negative (more so than a lot of other negatives), but somehow that doesn't always transfer to someone who that label attaches too. Americans tend to poll as self identifying as conservative at a slightly higher rate than progressive too, but when you strip policies of scare terms and poll those, most Americans turn out to be decidedly progressive. Removed from their political tribal identity, they like most of the Dem ideas. Hell, when you ask about ideal ranges for a ton of things, like pay differences, they are EXTREMELY progressive and EXTREMELY mistaken on the current state of affairs.

So in a general I would depend on how Bernie played it. The independent Senator who has fought against the establishment of both parties for decades without giving in to either? Wins in a landslide. The Democratic caucus member who is a true socialist? Loses. Gives in to the personality cult followers? Loses. Throws those same followers under the bus to get more establishment support (a.k.a. going full McCain), loses.

There are so many factors being certain this candidate or that of the major ones will DEFINITELY lose or DEFINITELY win is foolish. EDIT: I see good arguments on both sides of the Bernie 'socialist' isusse. All the rest I want to say has pretty much been covered by Tragic Monkey I think.
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The "Bernie is not a Democrat" attack strikes a bit hollow

If Bernie is not a Democrat, then neither are his many supporters. Does the establishment really want them to vote 3rd party?
 
I wonder which "responsible moderate centrists" will expose themselves as a NeverBernie nonvoter when the general election rolls around.

You've seen the "Bernie Bros" who've posted recently in this thread willing to hold their nose for the nominee.
 
Venom said:
I wonder which "responsible moderate centrists" will expose themselves as a NeverBernie nonvoter when the general election rolls around.

You've seen the "Bernie Bros" who've posted recently in this thread are willing to hold their nose for the nominee.
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Libs hate socialists more than they hate fascists. Just wait and see
 
Venom said:
I swear on my account I will refrain from posting for a year if Sanders is nominated and loses to Trump.

Joe Biden has never won a primary contest in his three runs for president. Primary voters aren't energized and excited for Biden. Sanders in his very first try, with media already crowning Clinton the nominee and giving millions in free coverage to Trump, won more than 13.17 million in the popular vote to Clinton's 16.85 million.

Sanders is the safer choice. **** an avatar bet, I'll bet my account on it.
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Mmm. My first response to this is... "to what end?" There's little to nothing to be gained by those who disagree with you if they "win" that bet.

My second is... that it's excellent cover for just tuning out of everything for a year, for better or worse.
 
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