14-year-old Florida boy beaten for supporting Trump

[TurkeysGhost]

snipped for brevity

And apparently beat someone up.

I hadn't seen your post, it certainly changes things.

Yes, if this isn't a single incident, as the MAGA mom claims, then looking backwards at prior incidents is probably worth while.

As far as my comments about school kids, I think it does matter. Often school misbehavior is treated differently than out of school activity. To be honest, I think most "crimes" committed by children should be treated as a behavior problem and not as a criminal matter. Only egregious acts should be treated as a criminal justice problem. Middle school children should not be going to jail as a remedy for school misbehavior.

Given that this now appears to be a back and forth case of student fighting, it's probably best for the police to not treat this as a criminal matter.

It's really the schools fault at this point. Multiple fights are occurring on the bus and nothing is being done. The best way forward would be for criminal charges to be dropped and the school actually do their damn job of managing student behavior.

This only solidifies my opinion of MAGA momma being a right wing crank. No mention of her precious child's previous fight. It doesn't serve the narrative, so it was omitted.

 

[plague311]

But the big issue here is that you are stooping to insulting and ridiculing a boy who has not breathed word one to the public, or even been quoted as saying anything. I'm officially signing off now, cuz I don't want to see your next level down.

I will address this since it's personally attacking my character.

First, I gave the initial video and information the credibility it should have been given. When I joined the thread the police and the school had investigated. They both said, specifically, that the hat didn't play a role in the beating which was in contrast to what the mother said.

Second, nothing says that the mother of the black girl didn't hand over the video in the initial investigation (which the police were apart of). The police had no reason to release it at all, so I'm not sure what this snide "you said you were happy, right, RIGHT?!?!?!" is all about. Yes, I was and am happy.

Third, as far as your "please think of this child" while clutching your pearls that I made derogatory comments about him, you can save it for someone that would actually believe it. I said they were ********, which playing the victim in an event while actually being part of the cause for the event, would absolutely make you. About the closest thing you got to truth here is that the kid hasn't said much publicly. I don't find that to be particularly brave (since neither have the other kids) and there's just as much a chance that he isn't saying something, because he could have started this, as anything. The other kids got charged, why didn't this kid? Both of the incidents have the same amount of evidence, video of the fight taking place. What makes one worse than the other? Why isn't Trump supporter kid getting pegged with a first class misdemeanor too?

 

[theprestige]

I hadn't seen your post, it certainly changes things.

Yes, if this isn't a single incident, as the MAGA mom claims, then looking backwards at prior incidents is probably worth while.

As far as my comments about school kids, I think it does matter. Often school misbehavior is treated differently than out of school activity. To be honest, I think most "crimes" committed by children should be treated as a behavior problem and not as a criminal matter. Only egregious acts should be treated as a criminal justice problem. Middle school children should be going to jail as a remedy for school misbehavior.

Given that this now appears to be a back and forth case of student fighting, it's probably best for the police to not treat this as a criminal matter.

It's really the schools fault at this point. Multiple fights are occurring on the bus and nothing is being done. The best way forward would be for criminal charges to be dropped and the school actually do their damn job of managing student behavior.

This only solidifies my opinion of MAGA momma being a right wing crank. No mention of her precious child's previous fight. It doesn't serve the narrative, so it was omitted.

I'm not sure where you're getting this stuff from. The article cited in the OP says the mom alluded to the prior conflict to explain the fight on the bus.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

I'm not sure where you're getting this stuff from. The article cited in the OP says the mom alluded to the prior conflict to explain the fight on the bus.

her narrative of the MAGA kid being the target of one-way bullying seems a bit unrealistic given there is a video of him wailing on another student on a bus.

 

[Thermal]

her narrative of the MAGA kid being the target of one-way bullying seems a bit unrealistic given there is a video of him wailing on another student on a bus.

But what is the context of this earlier fight? Did he start it, or was he finishing it?

What did Tyler tell his mom? If he was ending a fight started by the other kids (or was in the middle, it's a very short clip), it doesn't conflict with anything. [eta: the mom specified that the hospital found older bruises, indicating fighting. How much Tyler told her about how many shots he got in seems a little academic. She knew the punches were flying beforehand. The OP was just over the top]

And yeah, seriously, what is up with this bus driver? Freaking WWF on this bus.

 

[Thermal]

I will address this since it's personally attacking my character.

No, it's addressing your irrationality. Big difference.

First, I gave the initial video and information the credibility it should have been given. When I joined the thread the police and the school had investigated. They both said, specifically, that the hat didn't play a role in the beating which was in contrast to what the mother said.

Second, nothing says that the mother of the black girl didn't hand over the video in the initial investigation (which the police were apart of). The police had no reason to release it at all, so I'm not sure what this snide "you said you were happy, right, RIGHT?!?!?!" is all about. Yes, I was and am happy.

Third, as far as your "please think of this child" while clutching your pearls that I made derogatory comments about him, you can save it for someone that would actually believe it. I said they were ********, which playing the victim in an event while actually being part of the cause for the event, would absolutely make you. About the closest thing you got to truth here is that the kid hasn't said much publicly. I don't find that to be particularly brave (since neither have the other kids) and there's just as much a chance that he isn't saying something, because he could have started this, as anything. The other kids got charged, why didn't this kid? Both of the incidents have the same amount of evidence, video of the fight taking place. What makes one worse than the other? Why isn't Trump supporter kid getting pegged with a first class misdemeanor too?

Look at the two hilites. The kid has said NOT A GOD DAMNED WORD. But you again try to spin it to 'not said much'. Holding the door for the cops again?

Every other poster is leveling criticism at the claimant: mamasan. Tyler has said nothing, and all we know about his POV is that he was in two fights.

It's not 'think of the children'. It's 'think about your projection'.

 

[theprestige]

her narrative of the MAGA kid being the target of one-way bullying seems a bit unrealistic given there is a video of him wailing on another student on a bus.

Back up. You said the mother had omitted mention of the earlier fight. According to the OP citation, you were wrong about that. Do you agree that the mother did in fact mention the earlier fight? Have you changed your analysis based on this new information?

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Back up. You said the mother had omitted mention of the earlier fight. According to the OP citation, you were wrong about that. Do you agree that the mother did in fact mention the earlier fight? Have you changed your analysis based on this new information?

I didn't see any mention of a previous fight. Maybe you can point it out to me.

The mother says that her son was the target of bullying. No mention that he had previously been in a fistfights

 

[Darat]

Realistically, how much are the police going to look into a fight between schoolchildren? The kid wasn't wearing a Trump hat when he got stomped, so its relevancy is already dropping from a police perspective.

Political ideology isn't a protected class, so there's not really much for the police to do on that front there anyway. Stomping a MAGA chud isn't a hate crime, it's just a normal crime.

If this animosity between these students is long running, the cops aren't going to go into the weeds trying to parse out motivations and inciting incidents. The kid got beat up, it's battery, make an arrest, case closed. Going into who called who a MAGA chud last Tuesday or who called who a Dumbocrat in civics class three weeks ago isn't something the cops care about.

Expecting some definitive report seems unrealistic. The school will claim one thing, the mother may disagree, and the cops will do their own thing and probably not even bother with the whole MAGA hat angle. Somewhere along the line, you have to accept some degree of uncertainty or, more likely, just lose interest.

That the police are involved at all is criminal!

 

[Darat]

Again, not what you said:







And again, retweeting memes (which are only vaguely alluded to here) does not indicate psychosis. You have a long way to go to connect those dots.



If you get bored, you can always present some of that evidence stuff to support this 'proven inability to distinguish between fact and fiction'. Support both the proof presented, argued and accepted (you did say 'proven'), and the demonstrable psychosis.

According to her twitter feed she believes in several fantasies. That is enough evidence for me to conclude her reasoning is unsound and she cannot discriminate between fact and fiction.

So I'll reiterate my views on her ability to distinguish fact from fiction is not based on her political affiliations.

 

[pgwenthold]

According to her twitter feed she believes in several fantasies. That is enough evidence for me to conclude her reasoning is unsound and she cannot discriminate between fact and fiction.

So I'll reiterate my views on her ability to distinguish fact from fiction is not based on her political affiliations.

Perhaps it's the other way? Her political affiliations are based on her inability to distinguish fact from fiction? It's certainly true the Trumpets have alternate reality (white Christian men are the most persecuted group in America is a belief held by more than 60% of them for example)

 

[plague311]

Look at the two hilites. The kid has said NOT A GOD DAMNED WORD. But you again try to spin it to 'not said much'. Holding the door for the cops again?

Fine, didn't say a word. I don't really care. He's being portrayed by his mother, and I would say the media, as being the victim of bullying. Yes, I do and have held the door for cops since I do that for everyone when we walk into the same building because I'm not a douche.

The two hilites mean absolutely ******* nothing. I don't even know why you bothered hiliting them. It certainly doesn't change anything.

Every other poster is leveling criticism at the claimant: mamasan. Tyler has said nothing, and all we know about his POV is that he was in two fights.

Great, she had to get the information from somewhere. Where did she come up with this "my son is the victim" story she's been peddling?

Would you agree it's equally as likely as any other possibility that Tyler lied to his mom about how these fights started, and the events that took place leading up to them, that caused this specific altercation on the bus? Perhaps he's not the target of bullying he's implying.

It's not 'think of the children'. It's 'think about your projection'.

What does projection mean in this sense? I'm really not sure how I'm projecting anything about myself onto this situation. I'm evaluating evidence available.

 

[theprestige]

I didn't see any mention of a previous fight. Maybe you can point it out to me.

The mother says that her son was the target of bullying. No mention that he had previously been in a fistfights

I think you've parsed yourself out of any semblance of a good faith discussion on this topic. Better luck next time!

 

[cullennz]

That the police are involved at all is criminal!

Why?

 

[Thermal]

Fine, didn't say a word. I don't really care. He's being portrayed by his mother, and I would say the media, as being the victim of bullying. Yes, I do and have held the door for cops since I do that for everyone when we walk into the same building because I'm not a douche.

The two hilites mean absolutely ******* nothing. I don't even know why you bothered hiliting them. It certainly doesn't change anything.

The hilites show that you are projecting onto the kid what has not been attributed to him. Only his mom made these claims, and her credibility and objectivity are widely questioned.

As I said earlier, she is fair game for cursing out and insults and the rest. The kid is not.

Great, she had to get the information from somewhere. Where did she come up with this "my son is the victim" story she's been peddling?

Would you agree it's equally as likely as any other possibility that Tyler lied to his mom about how these fights started, and the events that took place leading up to them, that caused this specific altercation on the bus? Perhaps he's not the target of bullying he's implying.

Yes, I agree that pretty much all the interpretations are on equal footing, with so little evidence put forth, and highly questionable evidence at best. Which is what I am arguing here: how can anyone run with a narrative or conter narrative with so little to work with? No one in this tale is packing much objective data. Not yet.

What does projection mean in this sense? I'm really not sure how I'm projecting anything about myself onto this situation. I'm evaluating evidence available.

Not projecting about yourself in the psychological usage. Just projecting motivations and credibility (or lack thereof) on the actors, who are a blank page in terms of what we actually know.

I think at this early point, all judgement is premature. The woman can't be labeled psychotic over freaking retweeting memes, and the boy can't be labeled anything at all. The attacking student with the new video you introduced is likewise on shaky grounds for being viewed as impartial/objective in terms of her narrative. There is no wiggle room here to conclude anything about the players, yet so many post some pretty firm conclusions.

 

[cullennz]

Still trying to work out why everyone is going on about the kids mother when the thread is about the kid.

Edited by zooterkin: 

<SNIP>
Edited for rule 11.

Heads up. The thread is called

14-year-old Florida boy beaten for supporting Trump

Not

14-year-old Florida boy beaten for supporting Trump because his mother is a complete far right nut job, lets talk about the mother and not the kid beaten up by the nutcase other kid and make excuses, as there is a Trump link and therefore it must be the kids fault and the mothers

Odd. But quite funny.

 

[Thermal]

Still trying to work out why everyone is going on about the kids mother when the thread is about the kid.

Edited by zooterkin: 

<SNIP>
Edited for rule 11.

Heads up. The thread is called



Not



Odd. But quite funny.

Right, but the mother is the claimant and speaking on his behalf...so she says. The kid didn't do or say anything in the OP, except maybe 'ouch'

 

[cullennz]

Right, but the mother is the claimant and speaking on his behalf...so she says. The kid didn't do or say anything in the OP, except maybe 'ouch'

Have you seen the video?

It was on a bus, not school grounds, the bully was a complete violent nutcase, and the cops obviously should intervene no matter how much posters question it.


With regard to the incident the mother nuttihood is irrelevant.

Until they get to somesort of formal inquiry and show the kid did something bad and it was pay pack

And another heads up. Wearing a Trump 2020 hat, as is alleged in the thread OP doesn't count as bad

 

[Thermal]

Have you seen the video?

It was on a bus, not school grounds, the bully was a complete violent nutcase, and the cops obviously should intervene no matter how much posters question it.


With regard to the incident the mother nuttihood is irrelevant.

Until they get to somesort of formal inquiry and show the kid did something bad and it was pay pack

And another heads up. Wearing a Trump 2020 hat, as is alleged in the thread OP doesn't count as bad

The thing is, we have no idea what actually happened. Who started the OP video fight? The police and school are vague, just saying a verbal altercation. and the second video suggests the boy may have been scrapping earlier, so deciding who is the original instigator may never get resolved.

The hat thing does play into the meme of Trump hat wearers getting picked on though. Remember the MAGApirate and others? People like politically themed violence to reinforce their worldviews, and there is always some 'other' to frame as the real bad guys.

 

[cullennz]

The thing is, we have no idea what actually happened. Who started the OP video fight? The police and school are vague, just saying a verbal altercation. and the second video suggests the boy may have been scrapping earlier, so deciding who is the original instigator may never get resolved.

The hat thing does play into the meme of Trump hat wearers getting picked on though. Remember the MAGApirate and others? People like politically themed violence to reinforce their worldviews, and there is always some 'other' to frame as the real bad guys.

Fair point, but I find the hat, the mother's political weirdoness totally irrelevant to what we do know from evidence, which is the video of a bully going nuts and pelting someone in a frenzy, not wearing any hat.

Even her mates backed off when she lost it.

The mother is obviously unreliable as she is a freak and so too anyone who wasn't there, connected to the psycho chick.

Until we have evidence otherwise it is just a nutty bully beating another kid up and going full Berserker