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Greta Thunberg - brave campaigner or deeply disturbed?

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Scorpion said:
I just tweeted her the following message.



Dear Greta, I am currently defending you in a debate on the following forum, and I invite you to join the forum and speak for yourself. They are saying you are a puppet of adult handlers, and I am saying I think you have a mind of your own.
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Me, me, me.
 
Giordano said:
Are we really down to speculating about the food on board Thunberg’s boat with the hope of again somehow taking a swat at her?? Is she really vegan? Will she remain vegan?

My god, step back and look at what some of this thread has become.

I am going to take a break before I go insane.

Just a point of fact: I personally know of vegetarians maintaining their diets over multi week sailboats passages; I don’t know of any reason vegans could not.
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It's not that, really. We're taking swats at boat owning folk. I don't think anybody, anywhere doubts Thunberg is vegan. The fish spearion couple on the other hand....

Hope that helps with the sanity thing.
 
Orphia Nay said:
The 2040 filmmaker, Damon Gameau, made "That Sugar Film", which was a huge detriment to would-be dieters, making extreme statements that were too hard for people to live by.

I think this film will be just as extremist. There are other ways I'd use the time to learn.
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I wouldn't say it's extremist. Utopian would be a better word.

You've got things like aerial shots of urban areas with gardens on the roofs and hanging off the balconies along with shots of happy people growing tomatoes on those balconies. Electric mass transit that's so awesome that parking lots are no longer used so those are now farms.

And self driving cars. I don't know why those are in there, but they are.
 
Let's be clear. This couple lives off the YouTube views of their boating vlog. Greta is a big draw for certain demographics right now. Giving her a ride translates directly into cash for them. Instead of paying dollars for passage like a normal person, Greta is paying celebrity bucks. The only question is whether she knows that's the deal, or whether she believes it's conviction alone that inspires her ferrymen.
 
theprestige said:
Let's be clear. This couple lives off the YouTube views of their boating vlog. Greta is a big draw for certain demographics right now. Giving her a ride translates directly into cash for them. Instead of paying dollars for passage like a normal person, Greta is paying celebrity bucks. The only question is whether she knows that's the deal, or whether she believes it's conviction alone that inspires her ferrymen.
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Oh yea. I was reading somewhere that searches and inquiries on hitching rides on sailboats is way up. Could be a spin off benefit for people selling passage on their boats.
 
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being a fan. Lots of people are fans of lots of other people for lots of reasons. It doesn't mean we idolise her or believe that she can do no wrong, as some of the anti-fan-club crowd would have you believe. Just that we respect and admire what she does.
 
cullennz said:
That was harsh

I apologise

Just maybe putting it into simple statements, might be more inclusive to people not on here.

Mind you they tried that and are now changing
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That was the point, yes.


Steve said:
Seems to me the main criticism of Thunberg here is that she is doing exactly that.
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And then we have this:

theprestige said:
I'm agnostic about the requirements for addressing COP25. I assume the organizers and attendees know what criteria makes sense for them.

I'm trying to relate her attendance back to the arguments offered in this thread for her attendance: That she knows something the other attendees don't, and that her message to them would be more effective if delivered in person.

As to whether she knows better than the other attendees: I'm skeptical. The primary audience at COP25 appears to be policy makers and subject matter experts. Call them the diplomats and the scientists.

I doubt she knows more than the scientists attending COP25. Her message is that she's listening to the scientists, and so should the rest of us. Surely the scientists attending COP25 are listening to themselves, and each other. If one of them is ignorant of something, they have other scientits in attendance to set them straight via personal encounter. The scientists probably don't need Greta at COP25.

What about the diplomats, the policy makers? Does Greta know things about policy that they don't? The whole point of COP25 is to get diplomats and scientists together. Even if Greta has policy ideas that haven't occurred to the diplomats, she got them from the scientists. If the diplomats aren't listening to those same scientists that they're going to COP25 specifically to talk to in person, why would they listen to Greta?

Given that Greta's main source of science and policy information seems to be the same people and organizations that put on and attend the COP conferences, why does Greta need to go there and talk to them at all?

I'm skeptical that anyone attending COP25 doesn't already know everything Greta knows, if not more.

I'm skeptical that anyone attending COP25 who doesn't already know what Greta knows, needs to hear it from Greta as opposed any of the other diplomats and scientists also attending COP25.

And I'm skeptical that anyone attending COP25 who wasn't already sympathetic to Greta's message, will be more sympathetic if they get it from her in person. Assuming anyone like that exists. And that Greta can get to them at the conference. And that they'll agree to listen to her talk to them.

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My theory is that Greta's attendance at COP25 isn't about telling anyone there anything they don't already know. I think it is about meeting people in person, but not to try to persuade them.

I think the message is flowing out from COP25, not into it via Greta. Rather, Greta's attendance lends cachet to the proceedings. Schoolchildren who believe in Greta will see her at COP25, and believe in COP25 by extension. They'll see her with the various diplomats and scientists, and believe in those diplomats and scientists. It's good PR. It reinforces the general appeal to let the UN take charge of fighting global climate.

That's my theory, anyway. I think it's much more plausible than the theory that she has an important message for the diplomats and scientists attending COP25, and it she has to deliver it in person.
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As I see it, Thunberg needs to be at COP25 as a translator. :)

She can learn from the scientists, then translate the latest findings and plans from COP25 into simple, inclusive statements for the public, media, and her followers. I don't think she's going there to teach.

Her notoriety is a reflection of her success as a disseminator of facts, figures and also sound bites & emotional appeals.

Different types of statements reach different types of people.
 
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I meant to put this one the what-can-individuals-do thread but that swiftly slipped down the page. I was feeling bad because I wasn't doing as much as some. Then I realized I'd done a lot. I shut down my household in another city and moved in with Mom. Ten thousand miles of yearly travel, gone. Utilities on a 3-bedroom-house, gone. We live a block from the grocery store, and I stock up every visit. My teaching gigs have been nearby. Sometimes a tank of gas seems to last a month. No jet travel in 4 years and very little travel at all as I'm mainly on standby in case Mom needs me.

So my karma is pretty good. With a couple of exceptions. We suck up air-conditioning like crazy, well into October. It's in a well-insulated block of apartments, and some is nuclear/hydroelectric, but still. And I often get my exercise on an electric treadmill :o

The main thing I gave up was not physical comfort or convenience, but privacy. Of course by global standards, a 2-bedroom apartment is a palace. But in many ways my baseline standard is living in a household of one. Common in the developed world, and I wouldn't have made the change solely for environmental reasons. My point, it was a major change, not like chipping away at problems like buying powdered lemonade instead of endless plastic Diet Coke bottles. I don't think it's going to be the next big trend for reducing carbon emissions. That was just a side effect.

Greta's OK with me. A little intense, but I don't really blame her. She's probably going to be around several decades longer than I will.
 
Jeremy Clarkson is blaming Thunberg for young people losing interest in car shows like the one he hosts.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/en...thunberg-car-show_uk_5dde473fe4b0d50f3299a8f5

Jeremy Clarkson has labelled Greta Thunberg an “idiot” and blamed the climate activist for “killing” the car show.

Speaking to The Sun, he said: “Everyone I know under 25 isn’t the slightest bit interested in cars – Greta Thunberg has killed the car show."

So at least that's one good thing she's done.
 
Orphia Nay said:
That was the point, yes.




And then we have this:



As I see it, Thunberg needs to be at COP25 as a translator. :)

She can learn from the scientists, then translate the latest findings and plans from COP25 into simple, inclusive statements for the public, media, and her followers. I don't think she's going there to teach.

Her notoriety is a reflection of her success as a disseminator of facts, figures and also sound bites & emotional appeals.

Different types of statements reach different types of people.
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Scientists - "These are the facts (followed by facts)"

Greta's translation - "HOW DARE YOU!!!!!", "YOU HAVE STOLEN MY DREAMS AND MY CHILDHOOD!!!!"

Fantastic
 
Matthew Best said:
Jeremy Clarkson is blaming Thunberg for young people losing interest in car shows like the one he hosts.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/en...thunberg-car-show_uk_5dde473fe4b0d50f3299a8f5

Jeremy Clarkson has labelled Greta Thunberg an “idiot” and blamed the climate activist for “killing” the car show.

Speaking to The Sun, he said: “Everyone I know under 25 isn’t the slightest bit interested in cars – Greta Thunberg has killed the car show."

So at least that's one good thing she's done.
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So now electric cars are bad?
 
arthwollipot said:
Have you even heard any of the other things she's said? That was one speech, to one audience.
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Yes

Her other point is listen to climate scientists

I'm sure this will be a shocking revelation to the many acclaimed climate scientists listening
 
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