2020 Democratic Candidates Tracker - Part II

[Skeptic Ginger]

And then I hear Warren again. Sigh.

She's going on and on with more and more things she thinks everyone is going to want to do and everyone likes as her platform.

She sounds more like Bernie tonight (CSPAN).

Who does that leave? Klobuchar. Surely there is someone besides an old white guy. Tammy Duckworth why didn't you run? Can we talk you into it?

 

[Aridas]

He wasn't even elected as an "out" homosexual in the city he is Mayor.

Actually, he was elected while "out," for his re-election.

But he doesn't have the experience to stand up to the Republicans just like Obama didn't. We got a good POTUS with Obama, so how did we end up with Trump? We missed something. Obama missed something.

I'm actually not sure that "experience" would have helped much. Especially when it came to how the GOP pretty much tripled down on their laugh while America burns strategies. Obama is smart, diplomatic, and a guy who did his best to get everyone to move forward together. Where he failed was that he didn't do much to truly call out or hold them accountable for their wrongdoings and that there was far too much complacency when it came to the political races other than President.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Actually, he was elected while "out," for his re-election.

How does that predict what will happen in a national election?

I'm actually not sure that "experience" would have helped much. Especially when it came to how the GOP pretty much tripled down on their laugh while America burns strategies. Obama is smart, diplomatic, and a guy who did his best to get everyone to move forward together. Where he failed was that he didn't do much to truly call out or hold them accountable for their wrongdoings and that there was far too much complacency when it came to the political races other than President.

I'll agree to disagree with you on this one.

 

[kellyb]

So he was telling them not to support Liz and Sanders?

Yeah, he was telling them something like that. I think this quote from Fox has probably been taken out of context, and Obama was talking about M4A specifically, but he said:

“The average American doesn't think we have to completely tear down the system and remake it. And I think it's important for us not to lose sight of that,” Obama said.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

Warren's distinction in funding from Bernie, and her perceived switch to slow roll out (which depends on getting it passed in the third year, which is when you would expect Republicans to have made gains and for her to be in lame duck mode) might put her in a position no one wants, rather than a happy medium.

But some voters didn’t detect a large difference between the two — aside from timing.

“She’s a week late for me,” said Conni Miller, 59 of Waverly, who came to Warren’s town hall even though she just committed to support Buttigieg largely because of his heath-care plan.

A key part of Warren’s gambit is to remain close enough to Sanders’s plan so that his voters would, at some point, support her. But among Sanders’s supporters gathered Saturday afternoon, there was deep skepticism.

“I think it’s terrible,” said Eduardo Barrio, 23, of San Bernardino, Calif. “She’s not going to be fighting for it.”

“There’s a gap [between] them,” he added. “She’s clearly the second-best option, but why have the copy when you can have the OG?”

Linky.

 

[kellyb]

Obama:

“Voters, including Democrats, are not driven by the same views that are reflected on certain left-leaning Twitter feeds, or the activist wing of our party,” he said. “And that’s not a criticism to the activist wing. Their job is to poke and prod and text and inspire and motivate. But the candidate’s job, whoever that ends up being, is to get elected.”

He totally holds people with "left-leaning Twitter feeds" in contempt, I believe.

I can't help but be reminded of this:
https://www.npr.org/2016/01/22/464013732/bernie-sanders-revives-debate-over-single-payer-health-care

UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN: My question is, why have they taken single-payer off the plate?

(APPLAUSE)

BARACK OBAMA: We got the little single-payer advocates up here.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

I want to delve in more about Obama, his coalition, and legacy, but for the quote, I found funny results in an Iowa poll (pdf) (A+ on 538) that really drilled things down and has nice crosstabs.

51-41 want a candidate more moderate rather than more liberal than most Democrats.
55-43 want a candidate that promises to find common ground rather than fighting for a bold progressive agenda.

54-42 want a candidate that promises fundamental systematic change to American society rather than returning Washington to normal.

Hmm...

 

[kellyb]

Warren's distinction in funding from Bernie, and her perceived switch to slow roll out (which depends on getting it passed in the third year, which is when you would expect Republicans to have made gains and for her to be in lame duck mode) might put her in a position no one wants, rather than a happy medium.



Linky.

We'll see. She's definitely lost her "media darling" status she had for a minute there.

I believe this is inaccurate:

A key part of Warren’s gambit is to remain close enough to Sanders’s plan so that his voters would, at some point, support her.

Liz is a genuine single payer proponent, but there are a lot of different things called single payer all over the world. The phrase is kind of a misnomer a lot of the time.

Most people really just want any sort of UHC system that will work, and will fix things like the half a million Americans a decade who die from lack of health care, and the astronomical numbers of medical bankruptcies. That is the goal.

I'm not (and never have been) worried about getting enough of Sanders' supporters. That's up to Bernie, and he's good at communicating with his base.

 

[Childlike Empress]

I want to delve in more about Obama, his coalition, and legacy, but for the quote, I found funny results in an Iowa poll (pdf) (A+ on 538) that really drilled things down and has nice crosstabs.

51-41 want a candidate more moderate rather than more liberal than most Democrats.
55-43 want a candidate that promises to find common ground rather than fighting for a bold progressive agenda.

54-42 want a candidate that promises fundamental systematic change to American society rather than returning Washington to normal.

Hmm...

The demand is for genuine people working in voters interest. They don't have to (and shouldn't) promise communist or capitalist heaven, just work in the people's interest instead of for third party interest's big money like it is today in that absurdly corrupt system. Dunno what is so hard to understand.

 

[kellyb]

55-43 want a candidate that promises to find common ground rather than fighting for a bold progressive agenda.

At least that puts Biden's "elect me, and the republicans will become sane again!" talking point into some sort of context. He's not insane like that, maybe. He's just telling people what many of them want to hear.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Given how much Obama profited from his social media campaign, it is a bit rich of him to dismiss it when it comes to Sanders, Warren or Yang.

 

[Tsukasa Buddha]

At least that puts Biden's "elect me, and the republicans will become sane again!" talking point into some sort of context. He's not insane like that, maybe. He's just telling people what many of them want to hear.

No, Biden is definitely insane like that.

Painfully well understood is President Barack Obama’s minimal success at compromising with Republicans except in the most emergent circumstances. And in three of the most dire deadlocks of this decade, the accords reached at the last minute happened only after a frustrated president handed Biden his proxy.

Consider:

• Extending the Bush-era income tax rates just before their expiration date at the end of 2010, in return for a boost in jobless benefits and cuts in payroll taxes designed to help the middle class.
• Raising the limit on the national debt hours before a potential default in the summer of 2011, in return for a decade of guaranteed spending limitations.
• Averting the fiscal cliff in the final hours of 2012, increasing taxes for the wealthiest but preserving some lower taxes for the vast majority of the nation.

Linky.

Now, some view this history positively, and some negatively, as we saw in the earlier debate between Biden and Bennnet, but it definitely seems like his genuine belief.

 

[TragicMonkey]

I'm confused. Who cares what Obama thinks about anything? It was nice while it lasted, sweetie, but that was last weekend. We've moved on and are looking for next weekend. Been there, done that, next.

 

[Delvo]

The media keeps asking him & Hillary what they think of their party's current leftward trend because the media is against that trend and hopes they can use famous non-lefty Democrats to talk people out of going with it. (That's also why they've been working so hard to pretend Bernie doesn't exist.)

 

[JoeMorgue]

I'm confused. Who cares what Obama thinks about anything? It was nice while it lasted, sweetie, but that was last weekend. We've moved on and are looking for next weekend. Been there, done that, next.

Yes because the last thing any Democrat seeking to win the Presidential election is listen to the last Democrat to do it... twice.

The Dems are gonna "The only answer is to be as left as possible" all of us into another 4 more years of a psychopathic manchild in the White House.

 

[kellyb]

Yes because the last thing any Democrat seeking to win the Presidential election is listen to the last Democrat to do it... twice.

The Dems are gonna "The only answer is to be as left as possible" all of us into another 4 more years of a psychopathic manchild in the White House.

Why don't you centrists start your own centrist party?

It wouldn't even suffer from the spoiler effect.

If you have NYT access, you can read Thomas Friedman suggesting just such a thing a while back:

https://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/24/opinion/sunday/24friedman.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/24/opinion/24friedman.html

 

[Craig4]

I'm confused. Who cares what Obama thinks about anything? It was nice while it lasted, sweetie, but that was last weekend. We've moved on and are looking for next weekend. Been there, done that, next.

I imagine that it's because he's been elected president twice and knows something about how to win elections.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Why don't you centrists start your own centrist party?

1. Because I'm not a "Centrist" just because I don't agree with Twitter about literally everything.
2. Because I don't goddamn want to and don't have to justify to you or anyone else.
3. Because unless the Democrats rope in the base impulses of their Twitter cause-purity brigade or at least stop treating them like the American voter base they are going to lose in 2020 and I don't want that. I'm a liberal Democrat, not a fanboy for the Democratic Party. Supporting them does not mean loving them.

 

[Craig4]

I think he's far smoother than Biden.

I'm just concerned that the United States is not ready to vote for a gay man to be POTUS. I also KNOW the African American vote is essential to win and I also know that people of color are inclined to be more prejudiced against gays. Mayor Pete may be able to win a Democratic caucus in Iowa or say in SF, Seattle or NYC, but I don't know if he can win a state wide election. He wasn't even elected as an "out" homosexual in the city he is Mayor.

Do we really think he can sway enough votes in Michigan, Ohio, Virginia, NC, Pennsylvania etc?

Yes. He's polling a dead heat against Trump in Pennsylvania and Florida and he's within three points in Texas. That's all without campaigning in any of those states. His ground game in Iowa is turning out to be formidable. It doesn't look like he's going to make the mistakes Clinton did in 2016.

 

[kellyb]

1. Because I'm not a "Centrist" just because I don't agree with Twitter about literally everything.
2. Because I don't goddamn want to and don't have to justify to you or anyone else.
3. Because unless the Democrats rope in the base impulses of their Twitter cause-purity brigade or at least stop treating them like the American voter base they are going to lose in 2020 and I don't want that. I'm a liberal Democrat, not a fanboy for the Democratic Party. Supporting them does not mean loving them.

What's the difference between you and a centrist? Centrists are basically people who think Liz is too far left, and Trump too far right. They can be Democrats, but they can be independents, too. If you think Liz is too far left, and you're "not a fanboy for the Democratic Party", you're a centrist.