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2020 Democratic Candidates Tracker - Part II

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Brainster said:
I suspect both sides will have a fair amount of rallies in California, if only to raise the dough.
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In my view that's not it works in California. There are so many bazllionaires out here that almost all fund raisers are invite-only events held in McMansions in Hollywood and Silicon Valley
 
Brainster said:
And framing can only work so far. Warren has gotten a lot of blowback over her refusal to admit that her plan would increase taxes on the middle class, even from a very sympathetic media.
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How to pay for her plans is not a framing issue. How she presents her plan might be.
 
SezMe said:
In my view that's not it works in California. There are so many bazllionaires out here that almost all fund raisers are invite-only events held in McMansions in Hollywood and Silicon Valley
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You get sick of reading about how some big movie star hosted a fund raiser stories at their Hollywood Mansion every election campaign.
 
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acbytesla said:
It's not going to happen.
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Of course not, it's just that every four years Ophra tries to play kingmaker in Democratic Party politics, and every four years she falls flat on her face.What makes this amusing is that Iger has shown no interest in running for public office whatsoever.
 
dudalb said:
It is just when you think you are too smart to fall for a scam, that you are most likely to fall for a scam.
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That's a meaningless cliché.

It depends totally on why/how you became educated to said scams/potential scams. There's no way educating yourself to potential scams and propaganda techniques makes you more susceptible because you are confident in your knowledge.
 
dudalb said:
Of course not, it's just that every four years Ophra tries to play kingmaker in Democratic Party politics, and every four years she falls flat on her face.What makes this amusing is that Iger has shown no interest in running for public office whatsoever.
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You might say she helped getting Barack elected.

I'm going out on a limb and say I think the nominee is going to be Warren or Mayor Pete. Both of whom are going to be difficult to elect. If Mayor Pete wasn't openly gay, I think he would be running away with it
 
acbytesla said:
If Mayor Pete wasn't openly gay, I think he would be running away with it
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Why? What's his appeal? He strikes me as Biden Junior. Bland personality, politics status quo in the worst ways. You'd think his being gay would make him more interesting but it doesn't; if anything "Mayor Pete" manages to make being gay boring.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Why? What's his appeal? He strikes me as Biden Junior. Bland personality, politics status quo in the worst ways. You'd think his being gay would make him more interesting but it doesn't; if anything "Mayor Pete" manages to make being gay boring.
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I'm ok with a bland super smart white guy with character and integrity. Especially one who is gay. The Nathan Lane character from The Birdcage is not going to fly. Obama was electable because he wasn't Jessie Jackson or someone who was stereotypically black.

Every time I've heard him speak he's demonstrated a superior grasp of the issues. He doesn't frighten anyone. He's not staging a revolution. It's a return to sanity and away from Crazy.

I like Warren's politics a lot more, but I strongly believe that Mayor Pete would be running away with the nomination and he would crush Trump. That is if he wasn't openly gay. My theory is that each President is a reaction to the last President. Boring is kind of appealing after 4 years of Mr. Whackadoodle.
 
acbytesla said:
I'm ok with a bland super smart white guy with character and integrity. Especially one who is gay. The Nathan Lane character from The Birdcage is not going to fly. Obama was electable because he wasn't Jessie Jackson or someone who was stereotypically black.

Every time I've heard him speak he's demonstrated a superior grasp of the issues. He doesn't frighten anyone. He's not staging a revolution. It's a return to sanity and away from Crazy.

I like Warren's politics a lot more, but I strongly believe that Mayor Pete would be running away with the nomination and he would crush Trump. That is if he wasn't openly gay. My theory is that each President is a reaction to the last President. Boring is kind of appealing after 4 years of Mr. Whackadoodle.
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Q
Which is why running someone who will come off to many American s like a left wing Whackadoodle is a bad idea. A choice between 2 whackaddoles will favor Trump.
I think Warren could avoid that, but Bernie, never. He comes off like the eternal Sixites radical and seems unable or unwilling to get away from that image.
And please don't tell me he is not radical by European standards. This the US,not Europe, and European standards are meaningless in a US election.
I note that some of the Bernie Bros seem unable to grasp the Dems have to win the centrist/moderate voters in the swing state to win. They prefer to think there is a vast lost tribe of progressive voters out there that will magically appear if the right candidate comes along. Of course the lost tribe theory of voters has never worked out...…

Not sure about Mayor Pete having staying power. Let's see if his surge in the polls is real or just a fluke. Back in 2012 ,in the GOP race, you has a number of candidates who made a big noise in the polls for a few weeks, then sunk to irrevelancy.
 
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dudalb said:
Q
Which is why running someone who will come off to many American s like a left wing Whackadoodle is a bad idea. A choice between 2 whackaddoles will favor Trump.
I think Warren could avoid that, but Bernie, never. He comes off like the eternal Sixites radical and seems unable or unwilling to get away from that image.
And please don't tell me he is not radical by European standards. This the US,not Europe, and European standards are meaningless in a US election.
I note that some of the Bernie Bros seem unable to grasp the Dems have to win the centrist/moderate voters in the swing state to win. They prefer to think there is a vast lost tribe of progressive voters out there that will magically appear if the right candidate comes along. Of course the lost tribe theory of voters has never worked out...…

Not sure about Mayor Pete having staying power. Let's see if his surge in the polls is real or just a fluke. Back in 2012 ,in the GOP race, you has a number of candidates who made a big noise in the polls for a few weeks, then sunk to irrevelancy.
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It's not a few weeks. He's been steadily rising in the polls right from the start. Warren really isn't that radical and even if she was, her positions would be watered down through the reality of what can get done. My problem with Bernie is 1. His age. 2. He just had a heart attack. 3. He reminds me too much of Larry David. I'm not a big fan of the idea of free education for anyone and everyone. What we really need to with education is make a fundamental change to how we approach it. I don't believe we should be encouraging everyone to get a traditional college degree. We need a more vocational approach to higher education. I'd also like a serious reform and oversight to "for profit" colleges. The exact opposite of what Trump and Devoss have been doing.

Bernie has some great ideas but, he makes a terrible candidate for the general IMV.
 
SezMe said:
How to pay for her plans is not a framing issue. How she presents her plan might be.
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She keeps trying to frame it that middle class people will pay less in total between taxes and health insurance, which may be true for some people. But suppose your employer has been paying for your health insurance. Under Warren's plan is no longer an option, and your taxes will go up and your take-home pay will go down. No doubt almost all kind-hearted employers will give their employees a big raise since they aren't paying for their health insurance, but sadly corporate Scrooges do exist, even though they are extremely rare.
 
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dudalb said:
I note that some of the Bernie Bros seem unable to grasp the Dems have to win the centrist/moderate voters in the swing state to win. They prefer to think there is a vast lost tribe of progressive voters out there that will magically appear if the right candidate comes along. Of course the lost tribe theory of voters has never worked out...…
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Are they centrist/moderate or independent? I mean those get tossed around quite frequently, but polls show Bernie Sanders having higher favorability than Trump in states like Iowa, within 2 percentage points, within the margin of error; on paper 51% to Warren and Biden's 49% in the Emerson poll, but it shows he's squarely in the same boat as the other "less radical" candidates.

Maybe in some places it's less about being "moderate" or centrist than being independent and open to different offers. Obama comes to mind. He rallied people around his progressive rhetoric winning states like Indiana and North Carolina. I can't imagine a centrist Democrat winning Indiana right now.
 
Venom said:
Are they centrist/moderate or independent? I mean those get tossed around quite frequently, but polls show Bernie Sanders having higher favorability than Trump in states like Iowa, within 2 percentage points, within the margin of error; on paper 51% to Warren and Biden's 49% in the Emerson poll, but it shows he's squarely in the same boat as the other "less radical" candidates.

Maybe in some places it's less about being "moderate" or centrist than being independent and open to different offers. Obama comes to mind. He rallied people around his progressive rhetoric winning states like Indiana and North Carolina. I can't imagine a centrist Democrat winning Indiana right now.
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I hate to say this. But policy really takes a back seat to gut reactions towards the candidates for most voters. Ideas that are touted as "radical" can be overcome by a candidate who can sell them.
 
dudalb said:
And please don't tell me he is not radical by European standards. This the US,not Europe, and European standards are meaningless in a US election.
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He's not radical relative to what the American people want either. He's only "radical" in the dishonest smear-jobs flung at him by the corporatists, whose line you're repeating for them.
 
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