Greta Thunberg - brave campaigner or deeply disturbed?

[Minoosh]

And this presumption some have that a 16-year-old can't have reached her state without parental manipulation is very odd to me. I was passionately against the Vietnam War when I was 12, and my position never changed. That wasn't coming from my parents or even from the news, except the bare facts. It seemed like a cluster **** because it was a cluster ****. And that really wasn't something with such global physical effects on the environment, except for the tangential fear of mutually assured destruction.

To look back and say that MAD was never going to happen - and that it would have no measurable effect on the planet - and that furthermore it will never happen seems like an article of pure faith.

Teenagers have every right to try to change the world.

If Thunberg is demanding some immediate action that is not physically possible then she can be criticized on that basis. If she's spouting unsupported hyperbole that is drastically misinforming the public, likewise. But she has every right to speak and to seek a platform for her activism.

How mature and independent can a teenager be? IMO, just as mature and independent as an adult. It depend on the individual, not some immutable fact of biology.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

OK

 

[Minoosh]

Oh, I don't know..

Maybe the Geological time scale, or something similar...

OK, so no evidence related to the time frame that we generally consider when we talk about, for example, human civilization. No reason to take any action in the present, because after all the sun will eventually burn out.

Nothing people do matters in the scale of billions of years. Is that your position? It's what Mao thought about global nuclear war as well. Sure, it would be a big deal on Earth, but probably not the solar system, let alone the universe. But even he saw that it would be kind of a big deal on Earth. You're denying that would even be measurable on Earth.

 

[luchog]

Here's an interesting and highly accurate take on the negative reactions to Greta Thunberg:

Attacks on Greta Thunberg Come from a Coordinated Network of Climate Change Deniers

Excerpt:

That’s because a large subsection of the commentariat driving the abuse of Greta is part of an established network of radical free-marketeer lobby groups — a network that has firm ties to the fossil fuel industry and funders of climate science denial.

Greta first shot to prominence in Europe, and that’s where the earliest mudslinging emerged.

Arron Banks
@Arron_banks
Freak yachting accidents do happen in August ... https://twitter.com/CarolineLucas/status/1161656057023934464 …

Caroline Lucas
✔
@CarolineLucas
Bon voyage to @GretaThunberg for her 2-week zero-carbon trip by sail across the North Atlantic

She’s carrying the vital message to the UN that time is running out to address the #ClimateEmergency

View image on Twitter
2,695
2:11 PM - Aug 14, 2019
Twitter Ads info and privacy
12.7K people are talking about this

Banks’ tweet was one of the most high-profile. He is among the most prominent funders of Brexit, with long-standing ties to the UK Independence Party and its former leader Nigel Farage. UKIP’s politician, Neil Hamilton, was one of the first to be called out for posting what was perceived by many as a bullying tweet directed at Greta, who is 16 years old.

Far-right wanna-be fascists don't like an outspoken female who might affect their bottom line, no surprise there.

And on the other side of the pond:

It’s perhaps unsurprising to find that many of the U.S. commentators verbally assaulting Greta also have ties to the Heartland Institute, given the organisation’s Big Oil funding and long-history of promoting climate science denial.

The institute’s website published a long blog post by one of its ‘policy experts’, Gregory Wrightstone, who attempted to refute many of Thunberg’s arguments for climate action. “It is time for her to go back to school to learn what she doesn’t know and to unlearn so much of what she has been taught,” he concluded.

Many other critics of Greta in the U.S. are tied to another of Heartland’s funders, the Koch family, owners of the U.S.’s largest private energy company.

Marc Morano, communications director of campaign group Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow (CFACT), and a regular speaker at Heartland Institute events, has a long history of spreading misinformation about climate change.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Oh, I don't know..

Maybe the Geological time scale, or something similar...

How is that evidence?

 

[Ziggurat]

And this presumption some have that a 16-year-old can't have reached her state without parental manipulation is very odd to me. I was passionately against the Vietnam War when I was 12, and my position never changed. That wasn't coming from my parents or even from the news, except the bare facts.

And what did you feel like you had to do about the Vietnam war? Do you think your parents had no effect on that? Of course they did.

Teenagers have every right to try to change the world.

Thunberg isn't trying to change the world. She's demanding other people change it for her.

But she has every right to speak and to seek a platform for her activism.

No, actually, she doesn't. She doesn't have the right to skip school to do this **** instead. She has permission from her parents to do so.

How mature and independent can a teenager be? IMO, just as mature and independent as an adult. It depend on the individual, not some immutable fact of biology.

She's... not independent. At all. And what makes you think she's got any more maturity than a typical 16 year old?

 

[Skeptical Greg]

How is that evidence?

Evidence of what?

That the human species is doomed?

Seems so to me..

Why should we be an exception?

Evidence?

 

[dann]

Trump:

...looking forward to a bright and wonderful future.

Trump must be thinking of the future after he's dead and gone.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

Or, maybe there is no such thing as a bright and wonderful future..

Or...

 

[Minoosh]

...what?

Have you watched Thunberg's UN speech? She is explicitly not happy and is scared to death about the future, and she spent her entire speech trying to get people to understand that. So how would understanding it, as she wishes, be "an attack" on her?

Sarcasm aimed at concerned teenagers is such a good look for the right.

 

[Mikemcc]

What is she scared about?

Does she live near a beach?

A lot of Southern Sweden is not massively above sea-level for a start. Even if it rise as much as predicted inundation and salt poisoning will affect a lot of Sweden's arable land in the medium to long term.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

Sounds like it's time to move to higher ground..

No reason to be scared... Just take appropriate action..

 

[Checkmite]

Thunberg isn't trying to change the world. She's demanding other people change it for her.

lol

 

[luchog]

Thunberg isn't trying to change the world. She's demanding other people change it for her.

"She's not trying to put out the house fire, she's demanding that firemen put it out for her."

Let me guess, the next line would be: "If she's so concerned about her house being on fire, she should become a fireman when she grows up."

Anyone else realize how utterly stupid and self-important that sounds?

 

[cullennz]

I was trying to work out who her speech reminded me of.

I have just realised

That odd "Leave Britney alone" video.

 

[Ziggurat]

"She's not trying to put out the house fire, she's demanding that firemen put it out for her."

Let me guess, the next line would be: "If she's so concerned about her house being on fire, she should become a fireman when she grows up."

Anyone else realize how utterly stupid and self-important that sounds?

Using the accusation of self-importance in defense of Thunberg is more than a touch ironic.

 

[applecorped]

Here's an interesting and highly accurate take on the negative reactions to Greta Thunberg:

Attacks on Greta Thunberg Come from a Coordinated Network of Climate Change Deniers

Excerpt:



Far-right wanna-be fascists don't like an outspoken female who might affect their bottom line, no surprise there.

And on the other side of the pond:

CNBC is a climate change denier?

 

[luchog]

Using the accusation of self-importance in defense of Thunberg is more than a touch ironic.

There are a number of good dictionaries online which can help you understand what that word actually means.

 

[Skeptical Greg]

"She's not trying to put out the house fire, she's demanding that firemen put it out for her."

Let me guess, the next line would be: "If she's so concerned about her house being on fire, she should become a fireman when she grows up."

Anyone else realize how utterly stupid and self-important that sounds?

No..

No more than: " Hey all you adults out there. You need to save my planet for me. "

 

[Minoosh]

And what did you feel like you had to do about the Vietnam war? Do you think your parents had no effect on that? Of course they did.

Nope. Well, they did provide an environment that encouraged reading.

Thunberg isn't trying to change the world. She's demanding other people change it for her.

Like she really could do this all by herself. Also: it's not unusual for prodigies to end formal schooling for whatever reason. I graduated HS at age 15 with more than a semester of college coursework. It's not all that unusual.

She's not independent. At all. And what makes you think she's got any more maturity than a typical 16 year old?

Provide evidence for your claim and I'll do the same. Short version, I'm basing my opinion on how she comports herself. And you? What do you base your opinion on?