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Elizabeth Warren Ancestry Thread

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Trump has already gotten a lot of mileage out of this, it's naive to think it will go away if he faces her in the election.
 
Puppycow said:
If it's 1/64, that means you would have to go back 6 generations to find a pure-blood American Indian.
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jimbob said:
Which is consistent with her family lore.
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Like this:

kookbreaker said:
It is remarkably desperate. Odd thing is the same people decrying this are the same folks who would walk all over Native American rights in a heartbeat. Then suddenly they are rending their shirts over this injustice.

The real thing is: Warren mostly talked about her NA ancestry with regards to the bigotry that was faced by her Grandparents and how they had to elope because of the bigotry regarding Indian blood, even if it was 3 generations previous to the couple.
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Exactly. It confirms her story - and it's a bit harsh when a lot of the critics seem to subscribe to the one drop theory.
 
Marcus said:
Trump has already gotten a lot of mileage out of this, it's naive to think it will go away if he faces her in the election.
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He thinks he can beat her by screaming "Pocahontas!! Pocahontas!!!" over and over. Even some of his base will get tired of it.
 
kookbreaker said:
He thinks he can beat her by screaming "Pocahontas!! Pocahontas!!!" over and over. Even some of his base will get tired of it.
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By 2020, he might struggle to remember what his preferred insult is. I can just see him calling her sleepy Joe, or even Uncle Vlad.
 
jrhowell said:
It hurts him more than her at this point and since he thinks it is a brilliant slur there is no chance of him backing away from it.
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Next he's going to draw a feathered headdress in Sharpie on her photo and declare it shows her imposturing.
 
jrhowell said:
It hurts him more than her at this point and since he thinks it is a brilliant slur there is no chance of him backing away from it.
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I'm starting to come around to this line of thinking. She has the Cherokee nation asking him to stop, but he won't. He would never be able to stop. It is sort of a brilliant trap based on on his inability to change.
 
Marcus said:
That's not how they do it, they frown on DNA tests.
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Why then should one complain about someone "possessing only a tiny amount of the blood" when talking about tribal affiliation in particular? Why not instead focus upon what it actually takes to claim membership in a particular tribe? That seems like the best way to respect tribal decisions about membership and identity, even if it does happen to allow for members with overwhelming European-American ancestry.
 
d4m10n said:
Why then should one complain about someone "possessing only a tiny amount of the blood" when talking about tribal affiliation in particular? Why not instead focus upon what it actually takes to claim membership in a particular tribe? That seems like the best way to respect tribal decisions about membership and identity, even if it does happen to allow for members with overwhelming European-American ancestry.
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If she was, say, 1/4 Cherokee, while this wouldn't by itself make her a member of the Cherokee Nation, it would take the sting out of the "Pocahontas" taunt, particularly in those instances where she has described her race as "Native American".
 
Marcus said:
If she was, say, 1/4 Cherokee, while this wouldn't by itself make her a member of the Cherokee Nation, it would take the sting out of the "Pocahontas" taunt...
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Because the taunt itself is based on a popular misconception of what it takes to be a tribal member. People assume—quite wrongly—that if you're ≥ 95% European-American ("white as mayonnaise") you cannot possibly be a member of any tribe, but in fact many tribes have not formalized a blood quantum requirement, choosing instead to go off of a set of tribal rolls from the turn of the 20th century.

Then again, maybe I misunderstand what the "sting" is really supposed to be here. It's admittedly hard for me to empathize with the MAGA mindset.
 
I am not a fan of Elizabeth Warren but I have to say there is something about her appearance that reminds me of a couple of acquaintances who were part Cherokee (at least they claimed to be).
 
Originally Posted by Marcus
If she was, say, 1/4 Cherokee, while this wouldn't by itself make her a member of the Cherokee Nation, it would take the sting out of the "Pocahontas" taunt...

Because the taunt itself is based on a popular misconception of what it takes to be a tribal member. People assume—quite wrongly—that if you're ≥ 95% European-American ("white as mayonnaise") you cannot possibly be a member of any tribe, but in fact many tribes have not formalized a blood quantum requirement, choosing instead to go off of a set of tribal rolls from the turn of the 20th century.

Then again, maybe I misunderstand what the "sting" is really supposed to be here. It's admittedly hard for me to empathize with the MAGA mindset
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It's simple really. In the popular conception, Warren claimed to be NA to advance her career, but is not NA. Her small amount of NA blood is not enough to ameliorate this perception, at least not completely. Hence the sting in the Pocahontas narrative.
 
Marcus said:
Originally Posted by Marcus [qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/helloworld2blues/buttons/viewpost.gif[/qimg]
If she was, say, 1/4 Cherokee, while this wouldn't by itself make her a member of the Cherokee Nation, it would take the sting out of the "Pocahontas" taunt...




It's simple really. In the popular conception, Warren claimed to be NA to advance her career, but is not NA. Her small amount of NA blood is not enough to ameliorate this perception, at least not completely. Hence the sting in the Pocahontas narrative.
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Why does the accuracy of a racial taunt the big deciding detail? If you call a hispanic a dago the accuracy of the epithet is what is most important?
 
Marcus said:
In the popular conception, Warren claimed to be NA to advance her career, but is not NA.
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It would indeed be ethically iffy to claim minority status in order to advance one's career, if one never suffered from the usual disadvantages attendant thereto, but this would be true regardless of one's fractional ancestry.

Marcus said:
Her small amount of NA blood is not enough to ameliorate this perception, at least not completely.
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If she'd've turned out to be ¼ NA, it still wouldn't change the fact that she passes as white and has few cultural ties to any particular tribe; I'm really just not getting this focus on blood quantum.
 
Marcus said:
It's simple really. In the popular conception, Warren claimed to be NA to advance her career, but is not NA. Her small amount of NA blood is not enough to ameliorate this perception, at least not completely. Hence the sting in the Pocahontas narrative.
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There is no indication that her career was ever impacted by her indication that she was NA. We have been over this several times in this thread. The people who hired her have said they were entirely unaware of the claim and that it would not have impacted their hiring decision anyway.

The bar card is the most absurd one, though. No one sees what is on your bar card but the State Bar.
 
ponderingturtle said:
Why does the accuracy of a racial taunt the big deciding detail? If you call a hispanic a dago the accuracy of the epithet is what is most important?
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The whole idea of "Pocahontas" is not making fun of Warren because she's NA, but because she's not.
 
Originally Posted by Marcus
In the popular conception, Warren claimed to be NA to advance her career, but is not NA.

It would indeed be ethically iffy to claim minority status in order to advance one's career, if one never suffered from the usual disadvantages attendant thereto, but this would be true regardless of one's fractional ancestry.

Originally Posted by Marcus
Her small amount of NA blood is not enough to ameliorate this perception, at least not completely.

If she'd've turned out to be ¼ NA, it still wouldn't change the fact that she passes as white and has few cultural ties to any particular tribe; I'm really just not getting this focus on blood quantum.
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We're really in agreement here, she passes for white, she has no cultural ties, she's not NA. If she was a Cherokee citizen, or had a significant blood percentage, her (previous) claim would have a better basis. Now of course she has renounced any claim, it's the basis for the Cherokee Nation accepting her apology.
 
Dr. Keith said:
There is no indication that her career was ever impacted by her indication that she was NA. We have been over this several times in this thread. The people who hired her have said they were entirely unaware of the claim and that it would not have impacted their hiring decision anyway.

The bar card is the most absurd one, though. No one sees what is on your bar card but the State Bar.
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I agree it's rather weak, but let me put it this way: If you were filling out a form, and it asked for your race, would you check "Caucasian", or "Native American" , because you had heard that your great great grandfather had a bit of the blood?



Let me be clear, I will vote for her if she is running against Trump, I just don't think we should discount this as possible ammunition to be used against her.
 
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