Cont: Man shot, killed by off-duty Dallas police officer who walked into wrong apartment p2

[Distracted1]

Right, but levely isn't a word that I have ever seen before. I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist in the English language, but either way I get it.



Noted, I phrased that before I had looked at the CNN video and was working off of memory.

The discussion I have been having isn't emotionally based. My point is that you guys seem to dismiss everything up to the point of shooting as if it didn't exist. Then you say, "Well, she saw a man in her apartment, thought it was a robber, and shot him." If anything that fits more into the definition of cherry picking than anything else.

She is responsible for all of her actions. She's responsible for where she parked, for going in an apartment that wasn't hers, for approaching that apartment at all, for opening a closed door, for not seeing the numerous clues that should have pointed her to the fact it wasn't her apartment.

Then, to go even further, according to reports she turned the lights on, and without even bothering to take a mental inventory, repeatedly shot at a man that was in his own home.

I get it's easy to dismiss all of that as if it's a side note but it isn't.

ETA: In fact, she even claimed that the door was ajar before she walked into it. Which means she had the keen awareness to notice the door was ajar but didn't even pause to call out before going into her apartment when she was under the impression that someone was already in it. Negligent homicide.

Do you have a link to the description of events that has her turning the lights on before confronting Jean?

 

[GlennB]

Proper word or (evidently) not, could you glean its pretty clear meaning in context?

Could you have been bothered to look it up, once people doubted it was actually a word, rather than squabble about it?

 

[Thermal]

Right, but levely isn't a word that I have ever seen before. I'm pretty sure it doesn't exist in the English language, but either way I get it.



Noted, I phrased that before I had looked at the CNN video and was working off of memory.

The discussion I have been having isn't emotionally based. My point is that you guys seem to dismiss everything up to the point of shooting as if it didn't exist. Then you say, "Well, she saw a man in her apartment, thought it was a robber, and shot him." If anything that fits more into the definition of cherry picking than anything else.

She is responsible for all of her actions. She's responsible for where she parked, for going in an apartment that wasn't hers, for approaching that apartment at all, for opening a closed door, for not seeing the numerous clues that should have pointed her to the fact it wasn't her apartment.

Then, to go even further, according to reports she turned the lights on, and without even bothering to take a mental inventory, repeatedly shot at a man that was in his own home.

I get it's easy to dismiss all of that as if it's a side note but it isn't.

ETA: In fact, she even claimed that the door was ajar before she walked into it. Which means she had the keen awareness to notice the door was ajar but didn't even pause to call out before going into her apartment when she was under the impression that someone was already in it. Negligent homicide.

What kind of Alice in Wonderland trip are you guys on with this "you guys who dismiss everything"? I'm more adamant then most about not excusing a god dam ed thing

 

[Distracted1]

Still waiting on an answer on what crimes wouldn't be invalidated by just going "LOL I thought the situation was different."

Can't actually think of one.
If the mistake is a reasonable one. And no other motives apparent. And the act would not be criminal if the perpetrator was not mistaken.

 

[plague311]

Do you have a link to the description of events that has her turning the lights on before confronting Jean?

I'll see if I can track it down, I've read about 6 articles today. I might be wrong, and I'll concede it rather than even bother to look for it.

Imagine I didn't even say it.

ETA: Does that completely and entirely change the charges if the lights were on or off?

 

[plague311]

What kind of Alice in Wonderland trip are you guys on with this "you guys who dismiss everything"? I'm more adamant then most about not excusing a god dam ed thing

The only points I've seen you contest are post her entering the door. If I'm wrong, point out where I'm wrong.

Can't actually think of one.
If the mistake is a reasonable one. And no other motives apparent. And the act would not be criminal if the perpetrator was not mistaken.

That is one of the strangest thing I've ever heard. You just opened the door for every single criminal to get off free without any issues at all. I could walk into anyone's house I wanted to, shoot them in the face, and say, "I reasonably thought this was my house."

After all, I didn't know the people. No other motive for me to do it is apparent.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Can't actually think of one.

1. That's goddamn functionally insane.

If the mistake is a reasonable one. And no other motives apparent. And the act would not be criminal if the perpetrator was not mistaken.

2. That what pray tell is a "unreasonable mistake" if blundering into the wrong apartment and shooting the unarmed person sitting in their doesn't qualify?

 

[Thermal]

Could you have been bothered to look it up, once people doubted it was actually a word, rather than squabble about it?

Truth be told, I did doubt it for a second but my spell check didn't object. Also, having a level gaze or being level headed is commonplace enough language that an adverb structure shouldn't be so difficult. Lastly, I didn't give a ****. I thought plague311 was kidding when he said 'whatever that means', and quickly clarified and dropped it.

Its "you guys" that are squabbling about it. Pedantic much?

 

[Belz...]

Proper word or (evidently) not, could you glean its pretty clear meaning in context?

Well, here's the full context:

Was it the only bowl not in the sink? I didn't catch the inventory on that.

I mean, it doesn't matter one way or the other. I see sidebars like that as a good test of objectivity. Are we projecting the most innocent activities we can on Jean, with confirmation bias, or looking levely?

Without your explanation I would struggle a bit and ask for clarification.

ETA: And by the way, the word you're looking for is "levelly" with two Ls. For some reason Google didn't catch that when I looked earlier. As I was posting this one I thought that, if it meant what you say it meant, it should have two Ls and I searched that. So apologies for saying it's a made-up word, though it's certainly not one I encountered before, to my knowledge.

Levelly: In a level or even manner.

 

[Thermal]

The only points I've seen you contest are post her entering the door. If I'm wrong, point out where I'm wrong.

On the earlier voluminous thread, I discussed every element brought up, from driving to the wrong floor to working a long day to what people should reasonably expect in apartment living, to the red door mat and deadbolt structure and everything else brought up. On part one, I believe I was one of the more vocal posters. Please don't ask me to provide dozens of quotes for you when they are rather easy to spot. On virtually any page.

 

[Distracted1]

What I am hoping is that while mistake of fact may excuse her entering the wrong apartment, it will not be found to excuse reckless disregard of life. As mentioned upthread, a maintenance or other emergency worker could have been there, as well as an intruder. She showed utter disregard for other human lives no matter where she thought she was. Actually, not just disregard. She didn't give a fat rats ass who they were. They just didn't deserve to live. **** her.

I agree.
No duty to retreat is a stupid law.
Perhaps Jeans' death will serve as an example of just how stupid it is.

 

[Thermal]

Well, here's the full context:



Without your explanation I would struggle a bit and ask for clarification.

ETA: And by the way, the word you're looking for is "levelly" with two Ls. For some reason Google didn't catch that when I looked earlier. As I was posting this one I thought that, if it meant what you say it meant, it should have two Ls and I searched that. So apologies for saying it's a made-up word, though it's certainly not one I encountered before, to my knowledge.

Levelly: In a level or even manner.

So we have like four posters lambasting me over not doubling an L?

Tis a silly place

 

[Distracted1]

I'll see if I can track it down, I've read about 6 articles today. I might be wrong, and I'll concede it rather than even bother to look for it.

Imagine I didn't even say it.

ETA: Does that completely and entirely change the charges if the lights were on or off?

If the circumstances are different, then they are different. A is A.

 

[Distracted1]

The only points I've seen you contest are post her entering the door. If I'm wrong, point out where I'm wrong.



That is one of the strangest thing I've ever heard. You just opened the door for every single criminal to get off free without any issues at all. I could walk into anyone's house I wanted to, shoot them in the face, and say, "I reasonably thought this was my house."

After all, I didn't know the people. No other motive for me to do it is apparent.

That post would serve as evidence of your criminal intent at your trial.

You would also need to commit your crime in a State that has both "no duty to retreat, or Castle doctrine" as well as the legal concept of "mistake of fact".

The staged mistake would, of course, need to be convincing.

Do you believe Guyger intended to go to the wrong door?

 

[plague311]

On the earlier voluminous thread, I discussed every element brought up, from driving to the wrong floor to working a long day to what people should reasonably expect in apartment living, to the red door mat and deadbolt structure and everything else brought up. On part one, I believe I was one of the more vocal posters. Please don't ask me to provide dozens of quotes for you when they are rather easy to spot. On virtually any page.

No desire to ask you to provide stuff for me as long as you don't expect me to have seen those posts. I read the first few pages when it started, but only came back to this one when it got bumped.

That being said, again, there was a big lit up wall sign that had the apartment number on it and all.

 

[plague311]

That post would serve as evidence of your criminal intent at your trial.

Jesus. Obviously I hadn't made this post in the circumstance I had mentioned. Also, rumor has it they allowed her to clean up her social media during this entire thing as well. So you never really know, do you?

You would also need to commit your crime in a State that has both "no duty to retreat, or Castle doctrine" as well as the legal concept of "mistake of fact".

The staged mistake would, of course, need to be convincing.

Do you believe Guyger intended to go to the wrong door?

My argument is negligence, so her intent doesn't matter to me.

 

[Belz...]

So we have like four posters lambasting me over not doubling an L?

I blame it on Google.

 

[Distracted1]

No desire to ask you to provide stuff for me as long as you don't expect me to have seen those posts. I read the first few pages when it started, but only came back to this one when it got bumped.

That being said, again, there was a big lit up wall sign that had the apartment number on it and all.

It is an interesting discussion that is actually covering some of the same ground for the umpteenth time.
You might wish to read the last thread.

 

[Thermal]

No desire to ask you to provide stuff for me as long as you don't expect me to have seen those posts. I read the first few pages when it started, but only came back to this one when it got bumped.

That being said, again, there was a big lit up wall sign that had the apartment number on it and all.

Yes, and we discussed that and much, much more. In agonizing detail. I personally don't think the lit up number matters. Do you glance at your house numbers when you go to the door? Doubly so if lit up with other lights around it? The big bold red mat is more problematic for me, as well as potted plants in the hall on one floor and not the other, IIRC.

But it all boils down to shooting in the dark in a multi family unit for me. She did not own the property, and Apartment personal have the right to be there unannounced for service, especially emergency work. Even if she was in her own apartment, she was a freaking ghoul to pop off at someone (or something, like her dog) that she couldn't even see. Cops are trained to apprehend criminals without shooting them, I believe, so she had formal training in NOT panic shooting like a frightened civilian. **** her. With a chainsaw.

 

[Blue Mountain]

<snip>
Things people should ******* know -----> Where they live LoL. I mean, seriously?

<snip>
Entering someone else's apartment isn't "a mistake". It's negligent by the very literal definition of that word.

Do you live in an apartment block or a house? I'm going to repeat an earlier post because you seem to have missed it.

I'm going to disagree, from personal experience.

I live in a multi-floor apartment block. The floors are not like a suburban neighbourhood where houses generally have distinct shapes and paint jobs, different lawns and ornaments, different fences, etc. Every floor is decorated exactly the same: the carpet and colour scheme are identical to other floors. Every door is in the same location and has the same general look to it.

I have on more than one occasion left the elevator at the wrong floor, walked all the way to where my apartment is on my floor—ignoring obvious clues like a door having or not having a wreath or hanger of some sort on it ("Oh, it looks like the owner changed it")—only to stop at what I thought was my door and pause because something "seemed wrong" about it. Perhaps it had a different lock, or scratches and small gouges on the door frame looked wrong. Only then did I actually look at the apartment number, prominently visible on all the doors, and determine I was on the wrong floor. (Why didn't I look before? Because I thought I was on the correct floor!)

The real kicker? The elevator announces the floor number as the doors open. I missed even that obvious clue. And I wasn't stupid out of my mind tired; I was either thinking about something or listening to a podcast on my phone.

I'll add that I likely would notice an unexpected red mat in front of what I thought was my door, pause to ask why it was there, and then realise I was on the wrong floor. In all the years I've lived in this block no one has ever gifted me a door mat.

The apartment numbers are lit up, she parked on the wrong floor, she went into a place that wasn't hers when the door was closed, she didn't do any due diligence and with no regard started shooting at someone.

Every. *******. Thing. She. Did. Was. Wrong.

This part I agree with.