Moderated Trump announces new concentration camps

[Beelzebuddy]

This theory is based in part on your efforts to push a false equivalence between America 2019 and Germany 1936.

Germany 1936 specifically again. Why not 1933, or 1931? Could you respond to the question below? Because I'd say Germany 19-whatever-this-was is just about where we're at.

I'm obviously not as intimately familiar with the Nazis as you and Grizzly Adams are, so I'm unsure of the timing. But maybe. At what point did Germany start instituting large-scale roundups of undesirables, insisting to the public they were only getting known criminals but in hindsight were clearly targeting anyone they could get away with? Was that 1936?

 

[I Am The Scum]

The party of "enhanced interrogation" and "death panels" finds themselves displeased with the accurate description of their concentration camps.

Good. I'm glad they're upset. I hope they lose sleep over it, worrying about what their grandchildren will think of them.

 

[Minoosh]

Imagine something that would make you upset, an opinion that if someone held would make your blood boil. Okay you can probably find someone with this opinion, or something close enough, with a 5 minute google search.

Five minutes? Hah! Thirty seconds should do it.

 

[Mumbles]

The party of "enhanced interrogation" and "death panels" finds themselves displeased with the accurate description of their concentration camps.

Good. I'm glad they're upset. I hope they lose sleep over it, worrying about what their grandchildren will think of them.

Political correctness run wild, and all that...

 

[Upchurch]

Words have definitions and meanings, but those often vary with context. In some contexts, "bad" actually means "good", for example.

For two generations, "concentration camp" has been used to connote certain meanings which do not apply to these detention centers. If your goal is to avoid those connotations, then you should choose a different term for these detention centers.

My theory is that the goal is actually to have exactly those connotations, even though they don't actually apply in this case. This theory is based in part on your efforts to push a false equivalence between America 2019 and Germany 1936.

What do you feel is the difference between Trump's modern concentration camps and those with more negative connotations? Do you think ours are more humane? Just and warranted?

Do you object because our concentration camps have not yet reached the levels of inhumanity that those of 1936* Germany eventually became?

This is entirely uncalled-for.

I say they're not concentration camps, because that term has strong connotations in our culture, that don't actually apply here. Calling them such is effectively the same "I'm not saying, I'm just saying" dishonesty behind the CT practice of JAQ-ing off.

Baloney.

There is a deluge of parallels. We ignore those parallels, those lessons from history, at our own peril.

If you think I'm going too far, explain how these kiddie concentration camps, separating kids from legal refugee applicants, doesn't go too far.


* yeah, what's up with that particular year?

 

[Ziggurat]

What do you feel is the difference between Trump's modern concentration camps and those with more negative connotations?

An obvious and big one is that you can leave basically whenever you want to.

 

[wareyin]

An obvious and big one is that you can leave basically whenever you want to.

The children are free to leave whenever they want? This is news to me, and probably to them as well.

 

[Upchurch]

An obvious and big one is that you can leave basically whenever you want to.

Really? Where to? They don't know where their parents are. Their parents don't know where they are. Infants and toddlers just wander out the door, do they?

eta: Actually, no. I want evidence for this claim. The only thing I can find is a claim by Michael Burgess. It's not clear to me that what he is saying is true or that he has any particular knowledge or expertise on the subject.

 

[Ziggurat]

The children are free to leave whenever they want?

Children are free to leave whenever the parents want.

Most children are not free to do whatever they want.

 

[Ziggurat]

Really? Where to? They don't know where their parents are. Their parents don't know where they are. Infants and toddlers just wander out the door, do they?

eta: Actually, no. I want evidence for this claim. The only thing I can find is a claim by Michael Burgess. It's not clear to me that what he is saying is true or that he has any particular knowledge or expertise on the subject.

Infants and toddlers are never free to do what they want, and children rarely so. This is not generally considered a problem.

Parents can leave the "concentration camps" along with their children whenever they want. Where to? Back home.

 

[Upchurch]

Children are free to leave whenever the parents want.

Most children are not free to do whatever they want.

But the parents don't know where the children are in order to make that decision.

Can you see how this argument rings hollow?

 

[Upchurch]

Parents can leave the "concentration camps" along with their children whenever they want. Where to? Back home.

You haven't been following the news, have you?

 

[Grizzly Adams]

Ok, what would your reaction be to hundreds of thousands of Canadians - mainly families and including many unaccompanied minors - fleeing violence in Canada, looking for a haven in the US?

I am uncertain how your question wasn't already answered by the very post you quoted:

...my reaction to hundreds of thousands of Canadians storming the Montana border ... wouldn't be any different from my reaction to hundreds of thousands of Central Americans doing the same in the southwest.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

You haven't been following the news, have you?

I haven't seen any news stories that cover a loss of the ability to withdraw a claim of asylum. Link?

 

[Upchurch]

I haven't seen any news stories that cover a loss of the ability to withdraw a claim of asylum. Link?

For your strawman? Nope.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

For your strawman? Nope.

For your claim that they are not allowed to leave by returning home. Which would be achieved by withdrawing their asylum claim.

Which makes it not a strawman, but simply an alternate way of describing the same thing.

Please, PLEASE figure out what the **** you're talking about.

 

[Upchurch]

For your claim that they are not allowed to leave by returning home. Which would be achieved by withdrawing their asylum claim.

Wow. Your reading comprehension is horrible. Just awful.

Or else you're being intellectually dishonest. Either way, I'm done with you.

 

[Beelzebuddy]

There's another good chronological touchstone. In which years would "technically the Jews can still leave Germany" have been an excuse?

 

[JoeMorgue]

There's another good chronological touchstone. In which years would "technically the Jews can still leave Germany" have been an excuse?

All of them. The Germans started the Holocaust largely because they couldn't find any country to ship the Jews off to.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

Parents can leave the "concentration camps" along with their children whenever they want. Where to? Back home.

You haven't been following the news, have you?

I haven't seen any news stories that cover a loss of the ability to withdraw a claim of asylum. Link?

For your strawman? Nope.

For your claim that they are not allowed to leave by returning home. Which would be achieved by withdrawing their asylum claim.

Which makes it not a strawman, but simply an alternate way of describing the same thing.

Please, PLEASE figure out what the **** you're talking about.

Wow. Your reading comprehension is horrible. Just awful.

Or else you're being intellectually dishonest. Either way, I'm done with you.

Please point out what I have failed to comprehend. Because I don't see it. You appear to be saying they are not allowed to return home. If that's not what you're saying, perhaps the blame lies with your ambiguity and not my comprehension.