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There hardly is any argument in real life. At least I've never been faced with males entering or trying to enter female only spaces*. On the internet however things take on different relative proportions (in case you had not noticed)
*Actually the only analagous instances I can remember are the reverse, from young usually intoxicated women using the male toilets in busy bars/clubs because the lines were shorter. That was a hundred years ago when I was a student.
I've never been screened for whether I'm biological male or female when I've used gender segregated bathrooms either
As I said the onus is on you to use the designated one. Most laws work via voluntary willing compliance. If you were to try use the wrong one and were detected, then in most instances you could be removed.
You know you're kidding yourself, right?!
And please don't use disablist slurs against pigmies!
By the way, the sex differences seem to be rather consistent, so have you considered that they may even 'dwarf' the differences between species?!
The same reason it's more than reasonable to conclude that a person of African descent who was born up in and grew up in Sweden, speaks perfect Swedish and is for all practical purposes indistinguishable from any Swede is in fact Swedish. To refuse to acknowledge this just because they happen to have African descent means that one is nothing short of a racist scumbag.
I don't need to measure the shape of someones skull or analyze their mitochondrial DNA to determine someones "Swedishness" because that's something that exists, for a lack of a better term, in the spirit of their being. They exhibit the qualities of someone who is "Swedish".
"Swedishness" and exhibiting "the qualities of someone who is "Swedish"" sounds quite esoteric. I think that you just need to see their passport. It's as simple as that.
Easily solved! There are already cubicles for the disabled, and my guess is that they're empty most of the time, so redefine them: Cubicles for whomever can't (or isn't allowed to) use the ordinary ones.
They are?! I don't think so. Women can't use the men's and men can't use the women's. It's silly, really, but those are the rules for the time being.
I've never heard of this or similar problems in Denmark or in the rest of Scandinavia, but maybe I'm just ill-informed.
But I'm not sure what you're getting at with your question.
They are?! I don't think so. Women can't use the men's and men's can't use the women's. It's silly, really, but those are the rules for the time being.
Please, please don't see this as a left and right thing. This side of the pond it is very left-wing Labour women who set the ball rolling and started to challenge their own political party on the subject. Left-wing SNP women are getting in on the act now too, with some success.
Also bear in mind that the driving force behind the trans lobby is a very right-wing one, coming from a very similar place (if not the same place) to men's rights activism. Trans rights activism is very very similar to men's rights activism, it's just that in this case the men are wearing dresses and makeup.
I'm reconciled to the fact that I'm on the same side here as a couple of people I can't stand politically - Claire Heuchan and Frances Barber - and in opposition to some if not many in my own party. It cuts across party lines.
Your feeling of connection or lack thereof is not why those categories are tied together. They are united in many forms of treatment by society and arguments used against accepting, tolerating, accommodating, etc, these groups.
For example, the argument that there are more people who are trans than before because it is being 'forced' and 'trendy', and not genuine, is exactly the argument used against lesbians, bisexuals, and gays. It's also the same fallacious reasoning used in arguing modernity is wrong/bad/immoral because there are 'more autism' and 'in my day, ADHD wasn't a thing', and a thousand other silly beliefs. What they mean is that those people went untreated or were forced to hide.
I'm certain that the number of trans and bi people who are 'out' increasing is not down in any meaningful way to an increase in the number of people who are those things but to the consequences of being those things becoming less severe. But of course they are still severe, so fantasies that bad behavior by people who are trans is because of their being trans or the consequences of claiming to be trans are 'too low'. As if being raped by a trans woman is inherently more wrong than being raped by a cis man or cis woman.
Or course there isn't some magical unity for these groups. A lot of the worst bias comes from inside these groups to the others. 'Gold Star' lesbians are often extremely cruel to bi women, especially bi women dating cis men. They use a lot of the same arguments against bi women that people this thread use against trans women.
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While I'm under no delusion this information has much chance of changing the ideas of the participants of this thread, for the lurkers or the off chance someone actually cares, I'm going to point out that the augtogynephilia hypothesis is widely discredited. It is fundamentally flawed, factually wrong, and rests entirely on the idea that the overwhelming majority of trans women have not only lied/been deluded about a wide range of their personal experiences and feelings, but lied in ways that are consistent with each other over a long period of time, over several countries. As an idea, it is not accepted by mental-health bodies.
For any trans people reading the thread, don't despair because attitudes here are not actually increasing, and tend not to be supported by the experts, or by governments. The haters (and those deluded to thinking they aren't haters) have the facts wrong, and unless a lot of new evidence changes how we understand the facts or the like, they are going to keep going the way of climate change deniers, 9-11 truthers, and the like. The truth will out.
If you really want to feel better, just watch ContraPoints on youtube. Here, her episode on Autogynephilia will help you laugh at the Blanchard silliness.
Tyr, we've heard all that before. It isn't just a river in Egypt with these guys. We know they've put a huge effort into providing links that people like you can post to give the impression that Blanchard, Bailly and the actual medical profession have been debunked about this, but the fact is, they have not and they are correct.
As for the question of where the huge numbers of girls were in previous generations that correspond to the wave of girls now insisting that they're boys, we know. They're not saying, oh I wish I'd had that opportunity when I was that age. They're thanking God fasting that they were born early enough that they weren't caught up in the madness of the ROGD social contagion when they were teenagers, and looking at their healthy female bodies and their happy lives as mothers or lesbians or whatever, and despairing for today's girls.
You wouldn't care to open your mind and consider that you might be mistaken about this?
Before 2007 that's exactly what would have happened, and it did happen to a number of teenage girl stars who turned out not to be girls after all. Usually some story was concocted about an injury and they vanished from the scene. SOP.
But in 2007 (I think) the athletics authorities capitulated to the trans lobby and changed the rules so that males were allowed to compete in women's events if they identified as female and "doped themselves". Semenya is a male who identifies as female so what possible grounds could there be for excluding her?
The current brouhaha was caused by her applying to be exempted from the requirement to dope on the grounds that she's actually female. If she had been female then this would have succeeded under the rules as bona fide females are allowed to compete as they are. But she isn't female and I don't know how she thought she would win that one. There's nothing in the rules that overrides the requirement for people who didn't realise they were male until they were tested. Maybe she thought the authorities would let it slide for fear of being accused of racism or discrimination.
But they simply applied the rules,and said you are male my dear so this is the position. I don't see how they could ban her while any other male who identifies as a woman is allowed to compete.
Of course I don't think any male should be competing in women's events, it's an absolute outrage that this is happening at all, but while it is allowed I don't see how they could justify discriminating against Caster Semenya by banning only her.
Before 2007 that's exactly what would have happened, and it did happen to a number of teenage girl stars who turned out not to be girls after all. Usually some story was concocted about an injury and they vanished from the scene. SOP.
But in 2007 (I think) the athletics authorities capitulated to the trans lobby and changed the rules so that males were allowed to compete in women's events if they identified as female and "doped themselves". Semenya is a male who identifies as female so what possible grounds could there be for excluding her?
The current brouhaha was caused by her applying to be exempted from the requirement to dope on the grounds that she's actually female. If she had been female then this would have succeeded under the rules as bona fide females are allowed to compete as they are. But she isn't female and I don't know how she thought she would win that one. There's nothing in the rules that overrides the requirement for people who didn't realise they were male until they were tested. Maybe she thought the authorities would let it slide for fear of being accused of racism or discrimination.
But they simply applied the rules,and said you are male my dear so this is the position. I don't see how they could ban her while any other male who identifies as a woman is allowed to compete.
Of course I don't think any male should be competing in women's events, it's an absolute outrage that this is happening at all, but while it is allowed I don't see how they could justify discriminating against Caster Semenya by banning only her.
So what? You've still refused to explain why racial discrimination of the kind that i mentioned is any different from the transphobia that has spouted in this thread.
There is no transphobia, just another attempt - in words - to protect the rights of cis women (i.e. a large majority of those identifying as female) in public areas such as changing rooms. Would sacrificing those rights to the wishes of trans women constitute misogyny in your eyes?
I'm conflicted because I know kids who certainly have behaved like the opposite gender from a very young age - possibly too young to have spotted societal cues, and one has a nonidentical, but same sex sibling who has always been utterly conventional. That convinced me that often there is something biological.
I also am aware that some self-proclaimed transwomen have abused their self-proclaimed gender to gain access to vulnerable women. I don't know how to square that. Especially if many transwomen are themselves vulnerable.
Certainly any man with convictions for crimes against women who then proclaims that he is actually a transwoman should be presumed to be claiming in bad faith.
Sports is relatively easy. If you have male chromosomes, and male response to androgens, with non-female levels of androgens, you should be considered male for the purposes of competition.
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