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Mueller Investigation pt5

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Barr might not be lying, but he isn't following any precedent.
His job is to keep the public's trust in the judicial system, and he is working hard to undermine it at every step.
 
kellyb said:
Mueller finding "no collusion" seems to be true, ...
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All we know so far is that Mueller didn't find evidence of criminal conspiracy with the Russian government to influence the election -- not quite the same thing as "no collusion." I do believe that eventually, the Mueller report will raise more questions than it answers.
 
Won't make a different to the "durr hurr he coulda shot man on 5th avenue and itd be cool" knuckle-draggers, but I hope the things in the report do make a difference to the fence-sitters, or whatever fans he has that can actually be swayed.
 
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kellyb said:
Mueller finding "no collusion" seems to be true[...]
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Going by what Barr quoted and later testified to Congress, what Mueller said was that he couldn't establish criminal conspiracy beyond a reasonable doubt. That's very different to "no collusion".
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Going by what Barr quoted and later testified to Congress, what Mueller said was that he couldn't establish criminal conspiracy beyond a reasonable doubt. That's very different to "no collusion".
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I get the strong sense that Mueller decided there was no convincing evidence of anything illegal happening there, no matter what you call it.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
Going by what Barr quoted and later testified to Congress, what Mueller said was that he couldn't establish criminal conspiracy beyond a reasonable doubt. That's very different to "no collusion".
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This is an incredibly important distinction.

The court couldn't establish OJ was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt either, but that doesn't mean "no murder".
 
Well, the report has now been released.
https://www.justice.gov/storage/report.pdf

Firstly, No Russian collusion. End of.
Secondly, Barr didn't lie when he published his summary.
Thirdly, No evidence of obstruction, sufficient to bring charges.

I can hear the Liberals weeping and gnashing their teeth from here... and I live in the UK ! :D

I wonder how MSNBC will spin this ? :P
 
Cavemonster said:
This is an incredibly important distinction.

The court couldn't establish OJ was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt either, but that doesn't mean "no murder".
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I don't think Mueller was held to "beyond reasonable doubt" standards, was he?
 
Roofgardener said:
Well, the report has now been released.
https://www.justice.gov/storage/report.pdf

Firstly, No Russian collusion. End of.
Secondly, Barr didn't lie when he published his summary.
Thirdly, No evidence of obstruction, sufficient to bring charges.

I can hear the Liberals weeping and gnashing their teeth from here... and I live in the UK ! :D

I wonder how MSNBC will spin this ? :P
Click to expand...

Are you a speed reader?
 
Roofgardener said:
Well, the report has now been released.
https://www.justice.gov/storage/report.pdf

No collusion.
Barr didn't lie.
No evidence of obstruction, sufficient to bring charges.

I can hear the Liberals weeping and gnashing their teeth from here... and I live in the UK ! :D

I wonder how MSNBC will spin this ? :P
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You've read it already? I'm genuenly impressed.

On a more serious note -- there definitely was collusion. Set Abramson et al have established as much long ago. Get over it already.

Edit: love the backpedalling. "Okay, so there is evidence, but not enough to press charges, so it doesn't count!".

Like hearing global warming deniers. "No global warming! ...okay, there's global warming, but it's not caused by huma... oh, it is? Okay, so it is, but it's good for us!".
 
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Cavemonster said:
This is an incredibly important distinction.

The court couldn't establish OJ was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt either, but that doesn't mean "no murder".
Click to expand...

One thing we know is that the Grifter in Chief attracted parasite grifters running their own scams. We'll see if Mueller managed to figure out what the hell was going on.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
Barr might not be lying, but he isn't following any precedent.
His job is to keep the public's trust in the judicial system, and he is working hard to undermine it at every step.
Click to expand...

Well, they have caught him in a lie already

In his initial summary, Barr said that the OLC memo about not indicting a sitting president was not a consideration. Mueller disagrees, and says clearly that it impacted greatly on their ability to make a decision, including an inability to subpoena the Trump for an interview.
 
According to the BBC - "Justice Department website crashes" - not exactly unexpected :)
 
The Great Zaganza said:
His job is to keep the public's trust in the judicial system
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Not really. His job is to be trustworthy, but it's only beneficial for the public to trust the judicial system to the extent that the system is trustworthy. Why should he maintain trust in a system if the system isn't trustworthy?
 
smartcooky said:
Well, they have caught him in a lie already

In his initial summary, Barr said that the OLC memo about not indicting a sitting president was not a consideration. Mueller disagrees, and says clearly that it impacted greatly on their ability to make a decision, including an inability to subpoena the Trump for an interview.
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Mueller was ultimately unable to subpoena Trump for an interview because he couldn't describe an alleged crime and he couldn't describe what necessary information he could obtain from Trump that he couldn't get by other means.
 
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