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Anti-Muslim Terrorist Attack in... NZ?

The Atheist said:
One final point at this stage - I've seen lots of commentaries and editorials saying we're all to blame for the tragedy. Our way of life, casual racism, promotion of anti-immigration rhetoric and failing to smack racists in the mouth means we are all responsible for allowing this crime to happen.

I'm ok with that.

But on the flip side of the coin, wouldn't that mean that all muslims should take responsibility for muslim terrorists?

Life ain't a one-way street.

As my good pal Jesus used to say: "As ye sow, so shall ye reap".
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I'm not okay with that. All, in that context, is meant as a euphemism for pale skinned people of European ancestry.
 
The Atheist said:
One final point at this stage - I've seen lots of commentaries and editorials saying we're all to blame for the tragedy. Our way of life, casual racism, promotion of anti-immigration rhetoric and failing to smack racists in the mouth means we are all responsible for allowing this crime to happen.

I'm ok with that.

But on the flip side of the coin, wouldn't that mean that all muslims should take responsibility for muslim terrorists?
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Of course. And Tamika Mallory must take responsibility for the tragedy in Pittsburgh by calling a fascist Jew-hater the greatest of all time. Try suggesting that in polite company.
 
I am truly shocked at how many people want to throw Freedom of Speech out the window.
I have now come to the opinion that the left is just as hostile to freedom of Speech as the right.
 
dudalb said:
I am truly shocked at how many people want to throw Freedom of Speech out the window.
I have now come to the opinion that the left is just as hostile to freedom of Speech as the right.
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I'm telling you, the political spectrum is actually a circle, and the extremes meet up on the other side.
 
Belz... said:
I'm telling you, the political spectrum is actually a circle, and the extremes meet up on the other side.
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Oh, I know that.
I will never watch that video, but I think when you talk about sending somebody to prison for ten years for mere posseion of it, you have slid down the slippery slope a long way.
And on both sides it is a bunch of self righteous jerks, who take it upon themselves to decide what people can cannot read and watch.
And it's all for the public good. It is always for the Public Good. when they come to take away your freedom, they always have wonderful sounding reasons for doing so.
Don't seem much difference between a religious fundy saying you can't watch stuff because it will send your soul to hell, or a someone on the left saying you can't watch something because it will "hurt society." Both are vague abstracts. In the end, both just want power, and see free speech as a threat to it, and so mcome up with great sounding reasons for taking it away.
 
dudalb said:
I am truly shocked at how many people want to throw Freedom of Speech out the window.
I have now come to the opinion that the left is just as hostile to freedom of Speech as the right.
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Yep, and all it took was for 50 people to die and "the left" arguing that viewing the murderer's film of their deaths be inappropriate to the point of criminality.
 
dudalb said:
Oh, I know that.
I will never watch that video, but I think when you talk about sending somebody to prison for ten years for mere posseion of it, you have slid down the slippery slope a long way.
And on both sides it is a bunch of self righteous jerks, who take it upon themselves to decide what people can cannot read and watch.
And it's all for the public good. It is always for the Public Good. when they come to take away your freedom, they always have wonderful sounding reasons for doing so.
Don't seem much difference between a religious fundy saying you can't watch stuff because it will send your soul to hell, or a someone on the left saying you can't watch something because it will "hurt society." Both are vague abstracts. In the end, both just want power, and see free speech as a threat to it, and so mcome up with great sounding reasons for taking it away.
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It's for the good of the victims and their families. Not that you would care about them. They are simply water for the tree of liberty.
 
The Atheist said:
No, that won't wash. Just about every workplace has extremely strict rules about use of company computers.



Just a quick note on NZ & terrorism: while the Rainbow Warrior is well known, it's not widely known - or been mentioned anywhere I've yet seen or heard - we have had one prior domestic terrorist act.

In 1984, someone planted a bomb at Trades Hall in Wellington. Whatever the intention was, it was thwarted by exploding when only the caretaker, Ernie Abbott, was in the building, killing him.

The killer has never been found and it's one of our enduring mysteries as to who did it and why.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/good-reads/9872178/Wellingtons-unsolved-Trades-Hall-mystery
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Of course, you're forgetting 1982 - Neil Roberts.... "We have maintained a silence closely resembling stupidity"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wanganui_Computer_Centre_bombing
 
dudalb said:
And on both sides it is a bunch of self righteous jerks, who take it upon themselves to decide what people can cannot read and watch.
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You mean like the people who demand free speech no matter what the cost in human lives?

How about you get another thread going on the subject, because it's not part of this discussion.

I'll gladly put more than my $0-02 on the subject, but not here, especially since it's not something enshrined in NZ law.
 
dudalb said:
I am truly shocked at how many people want to throw Freedom of Speech out the window.
I have now come to the opinion that the left is just as hostile to freedom of Speech as the right.
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This is more of a NZ thing than a Left/Right thing.*





*Although, I will allow that it also has some anti-troll aspects rolled into it too.
 
dudalb said:
I am truly shocked at how many people want to throw Freedom of Speech out the window.
I have now come to the opinion that the left is just as hostile to freedom of Speech as the right.
Click to expand...

Don't clutch those pearls too tightly.
 
dudalb said:
Oh, I know that.
I will never watch that video, but I think when you talk about sending somebody to prison for ten years for mere posseion of it, you have slid down the slippery slope a long way.
And on both sides it is a bunch of self righteous jerks, who take it upon themselves to decide what people can cannot read and watch.
And it's all for the public good. It is always for the Public Good. when they come to take away your freedom, they always have wonderful sounding reasons for doing so.
Don't seem much difference between a religious fundy saying you can't watch stuff because it will send your soul to hell, or a someone on the left saying you can't watch something because it will "hurt society." Both are vague abstracts. In the end, both just want power, and see free speech as a threat to it, and so mcome up with great sounding reasons for taking it away.
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No one is going to get 10 years for the video*

I'd be extremely surprised if anyone got more than a large fine

* With the obvious exception of the bloke that made it
 
smartcooky said:
Of course, you're forgetting 1982 - Neil Roberts....
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No, I'm only counting incidents where someone other than the attacker was killed.

I class Roberts as just another suicide, even though it's officially called terrorism. If we expand the definition far enough you could call the Queen St riots and Springbok Tour protests terrorism as well.
 
William Parcher said:
This is the woman I described in post #1089. She wasn't returning to the mosque to check on her husband. She was escaping the grounds but didn't make it.



Another false story is now very common and a mural has been painted to honor a man. He is described variously as tackling or attempting to tackle or take the gun of the shooter during the massacre at Al Noor. In actuality, he tried to run down a hallway (his only escape path) without the shooter seeing him. It was necessary to run near the shooter to get to the hallway and he chose to do it while the shooter was looking away. But he must have been heard because the killer turns and shoots him just as he begins his run down that hallway. This is the only person to move towards the shooter. The stories say he tried to tackle but instead he was trying to get out.
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I think you are having a conversation with yourself. No need to include us in it.
 
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dudalb said:
I am truly shocked at how many people want to throw Freedom of Speech out the window.

I have now come to the opinion that the left is just as hostile to freedom of Speech as the right.
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As I have explained already the video is designed to radicalise the impressionable. Just as ISIS did so well with their beheading videos.

This isn't just free speech but you can't tell fire in a crowded theatre. This is teaching you how to set the theatre on fire.
 
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