The Trump Presidency 13: The (James) Baker's Dozen

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jimbob said:
No, it just needs those in the positions supposed to act as checks and balances to fail to do their job.
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Who is failing to do their job? And what exactly do you think their job is that they're failing to do?

Trump is setting a bad precedent. I believe that the US has a similar idea about legal precedent as the UK.
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There's some pretty major differences which are relevant here.
 
Ziggurat said:
I know most illegal immigration occurs at legal points of entry. I'm not sure about drug smuggling and human trafficking. And yes, obviously the wall cannot stop what comes through legal points of entry. Not sure why that matters here, though.
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Drug smugglers will need to have their US receivers come down to the boarder and get the drugs passed through Trump's "see-through wall," and human traffickers will need to remember to stop at Home Depot to get a ladder and rope or a reciprocating saw. Reason Number One for why it's a stupid idea is that it won't work.
 
WilliamSeger said:
Drug smugglers will need to have their US receivers come down to the boarder and get the drugs passed through Trump's "see-through wall," and human traffickers will need to remember to stop at Home Depot to get a ladder and rope or a reciprocating saw. Reason Number One for why it's a stupid idea is that it won't work.
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This is pretty much it. A wall will not work unless it's patrolled and/or monitored. But, you can do electronic patrolling and monitoring, just as effective, without the added expense of a wall.

We're paying extra for our border to have flames painted on the side, in the mistaken belief that it will be faster.
 
Ziggurat said:
Who is failing to do their job? And what exactly do you think their job is that they're failing to do?
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The Senate for starters
There's some pretty major differences which are relevant here.
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The idea that once one has opened the bottle, the genie is out is the same.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
changing the constitution is always the LAST step.
First comes packing the courts to allow for massive gerrymandering, media control and election tampering; THAT gives you the votes necessary for changing the Constitution.
Trump is absolutely following the Dictator's handbook.
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No, the first step is to get elected.

OMG! Obama was following the Dictator's handbook! He got elected! :rolleyes:

The sky isn't falling, Trump isn't going to become a dictator, and it was the Democrats who were considering packing the courts.
 
WilliamSeger said:
Drug smugglers will need to have their US receivers come down to the boarder and get the drugs passed through Trump's "see-through wall," and human traffickers will need to remember to stop at Home Depot to get a ladder and rope or a reciprocating saw. Reason Number One for why it's a stupid idea is that it won't work.
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This is a policy objection. There's nothing special about thinking the other party's preferred policies won't work.
 
Ziggurat said:
This is a policy objection. There's nothing special about thinking the other party's preferred policies won't work.
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But there's something very "special" about living in a world of delusion, and the closest Trump (or anyone else) has come to making the case that his Magic Wall will work is to say walls are like wheels, in fact they're older than wheels.
 
phiwum said:
It's not clear to me why Zig is refusing to clarify his point, such as it is. He was responding to this.



Zig isn't denying that the current emergency is a farce (at least not in this latest exchange). He's focusing on the rather dull question of whether this is the only such farce.

Of course, Ziggurat, the criticism here has less to do with whether or not previous claimed emergencies deserved to be called such, but whether this one does. And a remarkable feature of the current declaration is this: Congress explicitly refused to grant money for building a wall and the emergency is simply a way to thwart the will of Congress. I feel pretty confident that a national emergency has never been used thus before.
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exactly


Ziggurat said:
No. Trump is the symptom. And the world won't fall apart if this national emergency stands and he builds the wall.

JoeMorgue said:
The world won't fall apart if a lot of stuff happens. That shouldn't be our standards.

The sitting President of the United States of America wasting 6.5 billion (or whatever number got pulled out of whoever's ass last) to never actually get around to building a racist boondoggle that wouldn't even solve the problem that doesn't exist shouldn't be the kind of thing we accept with a shrug and a Bob-like "Well it makes a minor point about some Polysci talking point so all's good in the hood."

This wall, either as an actual thing that eventually happens or a political talking point that nobody is pretending will ever happen, is not worth some minor "Take the Presidential Power down a notch" win.
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Indeed and whilst the world mightn't fall apart, individual US citizens would get harmed by this contrived emergency.
 
jimbob said:
Indeed and whilst the world mightn't fall apart, individual US citizens would get harmed by this contrived emergency.
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That's the standard objection to any policy you don't like. And you might even be right. But it's still just a policy objection.
 
WilliamSeger said:
Uh-huh, so can I assume that you don't want a "quite common" president, much less a "special" one, deciding how to spend tax money?
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I will probably never get the president I actually want, let alone the government spending policies I want. I've come to terms with that.
 
JoeMorgue said:
Because Trump is reading the stage directions along with his dialog.

There's an open secret, unspoken "I'm totes doing this for political reason but everyone knows that and is playing the same game" to 99% of politics. Hell that subtext is politics.

Problem with Trump is that A) he does it with things that aren't political footballs and B) he has not concept of just not outright saying it.
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He can't help himself. "Hey Russia, steal Hillary's emails and leak them".
 
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