Cont: Mueller Investigation pt3

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Beelzebuddy said:
Don't get me wrong, if it does all burn down overnight I'll gladly bring the marshmallows. I'm just cynical enough that I won't be holding my breath. The GOP has further depths they can stoop to before they hit rock bottom.
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Oh I am not holding my breath, but I also think that Trump's position is more precarious than it might seem.

The facade is strong, and his base might still be deluded but I'm sure that his important political allies are only calculating whether it is better for them to support or flip. If a couple decide to flip, then suddenly the arithmetic changes for the rest and they'd probably also flip - after all, being faithful to a liability is not good for one's political welfare.
 
jimbob said:
If your image is of a Glorious Leader and a strongman, then having what seems like toilet paper on the sole of your shoe undermines that.
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" (Trump is) a poor man's idea of a rich man, a stupid man's idea of a smart man, and a weak man's idea of a strong man."
- jfb @ Apollohoax.net
 
smartcooky said:
" (Trump is) a poor man's idea of a rich man, a stupid man's idea of a smart man, and a weak man's idea of a strong man."
- jfb @ Apollohoax.net
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Yes, but I doubt that even Grandpa Simpson was shown on TV failing to get an umbrella through a door. He's becoming the stupid man's idea of a near equal.
 
quadraginta said:
There are no depths of integrity, hidden or visible, to be found in GOP Senators. There isn't even any surface veneer of integrity anymore.

But one thing they have demonstrated they have in abundance, to their very core, is a diamond-hard sense of self-preservation.

They hitched their wagon to the Trump train because they saw it would be to their advantage politically. After the midterms they have to be wondering about the wisdom of that.

If they ever see him to be a weakness, and a threat to their position they would drop him like a hot turd and cheerfully claim they had always felt that way, and anyone who pointed out that their record disproved that would be castigated for being lying Democrat flunkies who were using Fake News.
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The problem for the GOP is that so many republican voters have drunk the Trump kool-aid that they are pretty much the party of Trump. Lets say the republicans turn on Trump.... the senators start opposing him (or even acting to impeach), or they find someone to run against him in the 2020 primaries. Yes, some republican voters will stick continue to vote for the party out of reflex, but many voters will see it as an attack on "their guy"and will decide to sit out the 2020 elections.

In an election where a state's electoral college votes can be won or lost on a few thousand votes, the potential loss of disaffected Trump voters would be devastating to them.
 
Segnosaur said:
The problem for the GOP is that so many republican voters have drunk the Trump kool-aid that they are pretty much the party of Trump. Lets say the republicans turn on Trump.... the senators start opposing him (or even acting to impeach), or they find someone to run against him in the 2020 primaries. Yes, some republican voters will stick continue to vote for the party out of reflex, but many voters will see it as an attack on "their guy"and will decide to sit out the 2020 elections.

In an election where a state's electoral college votes can be won or lost on a few thousand votes, the potential loss of disaffected Trump voters would be devastating to them.
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I think the best chance would be to sell oneself to the Republicans as Having Always Acted In The Best Interests Of The Party And Country And Having Realised That Trump Is Ultimately Bad For Both. It's a comforting lie that they can tell themselves so that they don't need to admit to the wilful blindness over Trump - which, regardless of the investigation, is getting more obvious in general behaviour every week.
 
jimbob said:
I think the best chance would be to sell oneself to the Republicans as Having Always Acted In The Best Interests Of The Party And Country And Having Realised That Trump Is Ultimately Bad For Both. It's a comforting lie that they can tell themselves so that they don't need to admit to the wilful blindness over Trump - which, regardless of the investigation, is getting more obvious in general behaviour every week.
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Yes, the thing is to avoid the sunk cost fallacy and find the best path forward. If the Republican leadership gets their head out of their butts about Trump, they could use the machine they developed to effectively turn the Trumpists around and back into their fold, and turned from Trump. I doubt they will, because outside of Trump there is none I see with the will, power and influence to turn them around.

Right now there is not a strong enough threat from the Dems - I think there are folks building off this last election though, to create a serious threat. The Republicans may not be ready to face it.
 
If the GOP is going to turn on Trump, they need Fox News on their side. What are the chances of that happening?
 
The Great Zaganza said:
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The GOP senate is going to ride this out until 2020, even if Trump handed Putin the entire NOC list in Helsinki .
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The pivot point will be how the public reacts because the GOP is not going to look well if there is a public outcry. As long as there's no public outrage then your post is correct.

Election fraud is one thing, but Trump's financial crimes are an unknown variable. Why is Donnie Jr telling people he thinks he'll be indicted?

Then there is this: BuzzFeed: The Planners Of The Trump Tower Meeting Moved Millions, And Mueller Is Now Investigating - Documents show suspicious transfers began six days before the controversial meeting.

And this story: NYT: Trump’s Corruption: The Definitive List - The many ways that the president, his family and his aides are lining their own pockets.
 
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Turns out Whitaker has a history of politically motivated witch hunts:

Writing in Politico, the state senator representing Iowa’s 21st District recalled how President Donald Trump’s acting Attorney General, Matthew Whitaker, harassed him, with the help of the FBI, in 2006 in a case that was eventually thrown out by a jury after 25 minutes.

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“Whitaker’s office clearly wanted to give the evangelical right within the Republican Party a trophy, and that trophy was me—one of the state’s most prominent young Democrats at the time,” he wrote before warning, “People should be very concerned with Whitaker’s elevation to acting attorney general. The DOJ is supposed to be blind to politics. Whitaker clearly is not.”
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Linky.
 
Tsukasa Buddha said:
Turns out Whitaker has a history of politically motivated witch hunts:

Linky.
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All the people around Trump are like Whitaker. He started out with a couple people like Kelly, Maddis and Tillerson that were only marginally out there. Kelly turned out to be a piece of work, Tillerson was a tad too close to the oil companies and I don't know if Maddis is closer to rational. But soon after, the regulars that were no doubt recommended to Trump by DC insiders began to fall by the wayside, replaced with extremists and various nutjobs, many straight from Fox News. If you believe some CT that plays into Trump's imaginary world, you're in. That's seems to be where Whitaker comes from.

Also, he's the second one (Kavanaugh was the first) that reportedly was putting streamers out in front of Trump to try to get his attention. Want a highly paid job in the Trump admin, make sure Trump hears about how you would support his propaganda fantasy.
 
House Democrats plan to push forward on a probe of whether President Donald Trump played a role in hush payments to two women in 2016 who alleged decade-old affairs with the then-Republican presidential nominee, a Democratic aide on the House Oversight Committee told NBC News.
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Linky.

I don't think it will legally get Trump, even if he violated the law. He's above the law until Republican Senators determine otherwise.
 
Tsukasa Buddha said:
Linky.

I don't think it will legally get Trump, even if he violated the law. He's above the law until Republican Senators determine otherwise.
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Agreed. Clinton was impeached for perjury...lying about having sex with Lewinski, for god's sake... and obstruction. Let's see what the Senate does if Mueller has evidence of those from Trump. I think there's a good chance of the latter. The former? Since when has he said a damn thing under oath even though he lies through his teeth every single day. His lawyers won't let him near Mueller knowing he'd commit perjury in five minutes.
 
There is not going to be any turning on Trump from GOP.
If they stick with Trump 2020 they lose the presidency.
If they turn on Trump they lose the presidency and their jobs.
They have to stick through it.
 
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