Cont: Mueller Investigation pt3

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What worries me is that whatever Mueller finds, the Senate is now firmly in Trump's pocket and Trump will make damn sure so is the new AG. Even if the House brings impeachment charges, the Senate will never convict.

In another forum, a Republican assured me that, if it were found that Trump had committed a serious criminal act, that the GOP controlled Senate would convict. That was two years ago and I said I hoped she was right. Sadly, I don't think we can assume the current cowardly Senate would convict Trump of anything so bound to him as they are.
 
Stacyhs said:
What worries me is that whatever Mueller finds, the Senate is now firmly in Trump's pocket and Trump will make damn sure so is the new AG. Even if the House brings impeachment charges, the Senate will never convict.

In another forum, a Republican assured me that, if it were found that Trump had committed a serious criminal act, that the GOP controlled Senate would convict. That was two years ago and I said I hoped she was right. Sadly, I don't think we can assume the current cowardly Senate would convict Trump of anything so bound to him as they are.
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I think the only way it could really happen would be if Mueller can bring some undeniably serious charges with rock-solid evidence, and they are somehow made public (like, say, having to testify before Congress). Basically, if the public becomes so hostile to Trump that the Republicans realise they have to cut their losses. I'd think the closer this happens to the 2020 elections, the more likely it is to happen, as they'll be more nervous about those elections and losing control of the White House.

They can take the same approach that some Republican commentators did after the Helsinki press conference, and start crying about how Trump had betrayed them and wasn't the man they had thought he was. Anybody who doesn't already believe that the party has been obstructing things like the House Russia probe will be able to convince themselves that that's true.
 
Squeegee Beckenheim said:
I think the only way it could really happen would be if Mueller can bring some undeniably serious charges with rock-solid evidence, and they are somehow made public (like, say, having to testify before Congress). Basically, if the public becomes so hostile to Trump that the Republicans realise they have to cut their losses. I'd think the closer this happens to the 2020 elections, the more likely it is to happen, as they'll be more nervous about those elections and losing control of the White House.

They can take the same approach that some Republican commentators did after the Helsinki press conference, and start crying about how Trump had betrayed them and wasn't the man they had thought he was. Anybody who doesn't already believe that the party has been obstructing things like the House Russia probe will be able to convince themselves that that's true.
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Sadly, so many conservatives have drunk the Trump Kool Aid so thoroughly that nothing will convince them that anything Mueller finds is credible. If his tax returns show him to have committed fraud, they won't care. It wouldn't matter if there's video and audio tape of his obstructing justice, committing perjury, or making racist comments; they will claim it's all faked. Sad but true. We see it already.
 
Stacyhs said:
Sadly, so many conservatives have drunk the Trump Kool Aid so thoroughly that nothing will convince them that anything Mueller finds is credible. If his tax returns show him to have committed fraud, they won't care. It wouldn't matter if there's video and audio tape of his obstructing justice, committing perjury, or making racist comments; they will claim it's all faked. Sad but true. We see it already.
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One possibility is that the Russia Investigation gets halted, all the documents are preserved, but the Democrats pursue it. They instigate a House Special Committee Investigation into Trump and Russia (appoint Robert Muller as a Special Advisor to that Committee and expose everything found by the investigation public by bringing all the players before the House to testify under oath.

They otherwise get on with the business of Government in a reasonably bipartisan fashion, doing what is best for the country, and when a Democrat President is elected in 2020, they go after Trump (who will now longer have the protection of being President) all guns blazing.
 
On the contrary: the more serious the Charge Mueller brings before the DOJ and Senate, the more certain they are to try and bury it.
 
Just the degree that Trump has gone to in order to discredit and disparage the Mueller investigation is testimony to how much he fears it. He is crapping in his pants from fear.
 
I think if all Mueller finds is campaign finance violations, perjury, underlings coordinating with WikiLeaks/Russia, or anything else that can be written off as "process crimes" then the Republicans will protect him. If it's not smoking gun level proof of direct Trump conspiracy with Putin (beyond the speech asking for Russians to find Clinton's emails) then he will survive any "minor" illegalities.
 
Sideroxylon said:
Many media pundits have it that at that stage the Democrat House calls in Muller for public questions.
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and then what ?

the whole Republican World knows that Mueller is far-left wing , Soros-funded Democrat who is abusing his position to get back at Trump for hiking his Golf Club fees.

The GOP senate is going to ride this out until 2020, even if Trump handed Putin the entire NOC list in Helsinki .
 
Stacyhs said:
What worries me is that whatever Mueller finds, the Senate is now firmly in Trump's pocket and Trump will make damn sure so is the new AG. Even if the House brings impeachment charges, the Senate will never convict.

In another forum, a Republican assured me that, if it were found that Trump had committed a serious criminal act, that the GOP controlled Senate would convict. That was two years ago and I said I hoped she was right. Sadly, I don't think we can assume the current cowardly Senate would convict Trump of anything so bound to him as they are.
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It all might not all come down to how serious the criminality is, it could just come down to how much GOP Senators want to keep their jobs.

Trump's net approval rating is the lowest of any President back as far as Dwight D. Eisenhower over the same 659 day period that Trump has been in office.

PresidentialNetApproval.png

The Grey lines are the President being referenced
The Purple lines are Trump


The only time any President since WW2 has had a lower contemporaneous net approval rating than Trump was Harry S. Truman in 1952/53.

If the Democrats hold a House Special Committee on Elections, and the extent of Trump's perfidy becomes known to the public, his chances of being re-elected in 2020 may well plummet. Perhaps the Old White Guard might not vote to impeach, but there aren't many of them left and the younger Senators may see the writing on the wall; as November 2020 looms large in the windscreen, they could well decide to cut Dolt 45 loose.
 
smartcooky said:
It all might not all come down to how serious the criminality is, it could just come down to how much GOP Senators want to keep their jobs.
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I think this is exactly what it will be - if the results of the Mueller investigation mean that the Republicans think it would be politically or personally disadvantageous to continue to support Trump or advantageous to oppose him, they will turn on him in an instant.
 
All of the crap we've been through for the last two years could have been completely avoided if a single GOP senator had publicly stood up to Trump. None of them did. Not a single one. Oh, they'd flap their lips and wave their hands around, but when the time came they all fell in line. Either McConnell has dirt on all of them, or they want it this way. So you'll forgive me for not putting much faith in their hidden depths of integrity.
 
Beelzebuddy said:
All of the crap we've been through for the last two years could have been completely avoided if a single GOP senator had publicly stood up to Trump. None of them did. Not a single one. Oh, they'd flap their lips and wave their hands around, but when the time came they all fell in line. Either McConnell has dirt on all of them, or they want it this way. So you'll forgive me for not putting much faith in their hidden depths of integrity.
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You and Squeegee are both correct.

There are no depths of integrity, hidden or visible, to be found in GOP Senators. There isn't even any surface veneer of integrity anymore.

But one thing they have demonstrated they have in abundance, to their very core, is a diamond-hard sense of self-preservation.

They hitched their wagon to the Trump train because they saw it would be to their advantage politically. After the midterms they have to be wondering about the wisdom of that.

If they ever see him to be a weakness, and a threat to their position they would drop him like a hot turd and cheerfully claim they had always felt that way, and anyone who pointed out that their record disproved that would be castigated for being lying Democrat flunkies who were using Fake News.
 
quadraginta said:
If they ever see him to be a weakness
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IF. Cheerfully marching into kleptocracy and becoming wealthy oligarchs under an already senile dictator might be fine with them too. I don't feel comfortable relying on how those chips fall.
 
Beelzebuddy said:
IF. Cheerfully marching into kleptocracy and becoming wealthy oligarchs under an already senile dictator might be fine with them too. I don't feel comfortable relying on how those chips fall.
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That is why I actually think his inability to use an umbrella, his apparent ... um... difficulties with stairs, and his behaviour during veterans day might be important.

If your image is of a Glorious Leader and a strongmn, then having what seems like toilet paper on the sole of your shoe undermines that.

Contemptuous laughter is not a good look.

ETA: I still think that as Trump is so unlikable, even his allies of convenience will not be sad when they "have" to turn on him to preserve their political skins.

I think it will end pretty quickly once the cracks really appear. Then the investigation will be supported by all sides.
 
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jimbob said:
That is why I actually think his inability to use an umbrella, his apparent ... um... difficulties with stairs, and his behaviour during veterans day might be important.

If your image is of a Glorious Leader and a strongmn, then having what seems like toilet paper on the sole of your shoe undermines that.

Contemptuous laughter is not a good look.

ETA: I still think that as Trump is so unlikable, even his allies of convenience will not be sad when they "have" to turn on him to preserve their political skins.

I think it will end pretty quickly once the cracks really appear. Then the investigation will be supported by all sides.
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Don't get me wrong, if it does all burn down overnight I'll gladly bring the marshmallows. I'm just cynical enough that I won't be holding my breath. The GOP has further depths they can stoop to before they hit rock bottom.
 
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