Elizabeth Warren Ancestry Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
wareyin said:
ETA: care to expound on this? Which posters, and what are they saying which makes those Republican claims correct?
Click to expand...

See, this is exactly what Joe and I are talking about. You are conflating one side of the issue with "Republicans". It's reductionism to an absurd level.

The point is that one can believe both that A) Warren made a claim that she has Cherokee ancestry B) Be wrong about that C) be right about having native american ancestry D) have used it for brownie points in the past E) it not being a big deal F) Trump is a big fat liar. All these things can be true at once but they are not espoused by the same "sides" of the discussion.

No, I get to assume that when someone repeats Republican talking points that are at odds with reality that that person got that information from the only group making that claim.
Click to expand...

Have fun with that, then.
 
So, to sum it up, Fauxcahontas was lying about being an Indian, and she presented proof of it beyond any doubt. So, that's that. That pig being entirely covered with lipstick in this thread doesn't change that a bit. Hope this helps.
 
BrooklynBaby said:
So, to sum it up, Fauxcahontas was lying about being an Indian, and she presented proof of it beyond any doubt. So, that's that. That pig being entirely covered with lipstick in this thread doesn't change that a bit. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

She never said she "was an Indian". She said she had Native American lineage (Cherokee and/or Delaware by family lore). And she does.
"the results strongly support the existence of an unadmixed Native American ancestor in the individual’s pedigree, likely in the range of 6-10 generations ago."
Click to expand...
(DNA report)

Researchers told us the test results fit with Warren’s account of her Native American ties. Warren has said that she was told her great-great-great-grandmother was Cherokee.
Click to expand...
(Politicfact)


According to Schurr, the most that can safely be said is that Warren’s test results "may reflect a genetic contribution from a tribe living in what is now the United States."

The DNA test can’t prove every part of Warren’s family story, but the researchers we reached said it is consistent with her account.
Click to expand...
(Politifact)

Hope this helps but somehow, I doubt it.
 
BrooklynBaby said:
So, to sum it up, Fauxcahontas was lying about being an Indian, and she presented proof of it beyond any doubt. So, that's that. That pig being entirely covered with lipstick in this thread doesn't change that a bit. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...


DONNY GRAPE JUICE still covered in juice. Wouldn't it be funny if he uses the money he gets from Avenatti to pay off his bet to Fauxcahontas by actually giving it to a Charity? Nah, he'd never do that.
 
Pterodactyl said:
Why is taking a DNA test offensive exactly in this context? I read the release and I don’t understand.
Click to expand...

Its spiritual tribal mumbo-jumbo. Many NAs find the whole idea of DNA offensive in and of itself. The problem for them is that DNA proves their creation myths to be scientifically wrong.

Native American creation myths reject evolution and the idea that their ancestors migrated to the Americas from outside. They hold that Amerindian peoples originated in North America.

Now, when you view the pronouncements from the Cherokee Tribal representatives through the lens of their religious beliefs, you get a better idea of where they are coming from. They are not so much criticizing Warren for claiming Native American ancestry; if they were, they would have done so long ago. No, they are offended by they way she went about it, i.e. her use of DNA, which to any spiritual Native American believer, is tantamount to heresy.

NOTE: Australian Aboriginals have a similar attitude to DNA; its a manifestation of evil spirits. Despite the fact that there is overwhelming archaeological and DNA evidence that Aboriginals migrated to Australia from Africa via the North Coast of the Indian Ocean, arriving in Australia about 40 to 50,000 years ago, they utterly reject this. Their creation myths involve something they call "The Dreamtime"; the time before time. Like Native American myths, The Dreamtime myth tells them they originated in Australia.
 
Is there a single Warren defender here that would have marked themselves as a minority law teacher if they we're in her position?
 
I enjoy the posts desperately trying to make fetch Donny Grape Juice happen.

Basically the entire Native American community is up in arms about warren’s idiotic stunt, but....

Donny Grape Juice! Har har!
 
If you think Warren handled this well just think how well she would do as president.

The first Native American president that is.
 
BobTheCoward said:
Is there a single Warren defender here that would have marked themselves as a minority law teacher if they we're in her position?
Click to expand...

Who gives a flying frickin' F about that? Did she break a law? No. Did she gain from it? No. Did she hurt anyone? No. Did she traumatize anyone? No. The only reason Trump supporters keep harping on that is because they're trying to make a mountain out of a molehill and divert from the fact that the DNA test showed she has NA ancestry just like she always claimed. Give it a rest. The desperation is starting to stink.
 
Belz... said:
See, this is exactly what Joe and I are talking about. You are conflating one side of the issue with "Republicans". It's reductionism to an absurd level.
Click to expand...

No, I'm sorry, but the "one side" making false claims are Republicans. Or do you somehow imagine that the Liberal Party of Canada has weighed in on this with their own lies?

Belz... said:
The point is that one can believe both that A) Warren made a claim that she has Cherokee ancestry B) Be wrong about that C) be right about having native american ancestry D) have used it for brownie points in the past E) it not being a big deal F) Trump is a big fat liar. All these things can be true at once but they are not espoused by the same "sides" of the discussion.
Click to expand...

A: Republican claim contradicted by evidence. Gosh, if the Republicans had not made the claim, though, maybe you and Joe would have just thunk it up out of the blue? I just reread that, and I somehow misread your claim as Cherokee membership and not Ancestry. My apologies, this is correct.
B: Her only claim was NA Ancestry, and she was proven right about that claim. Guess that without the Republican claim in A, though, you and Joe still would have made this one up yourselves as well? Still incorrect, as there has been no evidence that she is wrong. It is, however a Republican claim that she is wrong.
C: Hey, you got one correct!
D: And wrong again, as shown by the Politifact and Boston Globe links. But Trump, Fox News, and the like are repeating this talking point as fast as possible. But you and Joe would have come up with it on your own, too. I'd bet you guys would have come up with this stuff had you never even heard of Warren, you're such independent thinkers!
E: Of course it's not a big deal.
F: Agreed

So, that's 3 out of 6 you got correct, and 3 out of 6 that are not true based on evidence provided, but claimed by the Republicans (Or I don't know, is Bloc Québécois weighing in by repeating the Republican talking points?)

eta: 4 out of 6, my mistake. Still, if one knows how this whole claim became public (her Republican opponent) and how it has stayed in the media (the Republican President and his personal mouthpiece Fox News) and where all these claims originated and are constantly repeated, claims that you didn't get these Republican talking points from the Republicans just look naive (at best).


Belz... said:
Have fun with that, then.
Click to expand...

These claims aren't coming out of the ether. But hey, you guys want to claim you independently came up with the identical wrong claims as the Republican party independently to somehow look better? Who am I to get in your way?
 
Last edited:
The Big Dog said:
I enjoy the posts desperately trying to make fetch Donny Grape Juice happen.

Basically the entire Native American community is up in arms about warren’s idiotic stunt, but....

Donny Grape Juice! Har har!
Click to expand...

This is no place for exaggeration.

Most of the native American community probably haven't even heard this story.
 
Belz... said:
Oh, you can. One more dodge won't change your record much.

Seriously would it hurt you so much to recognise that there is a significant portion of people who don't fall within two opposed, easily-labeled "sides"?
Click to expand...

I did. Get over yourself, "dude."
 
Stacyhs said:
Who gives a flying frickin' F about that? Did she break a law? No. Did she gain from it? No. Did she hurt anyone? No. Did she traumatize anyone? No. The only reason Trump supporters keep harping on that is because they're trying to make a mountain out of a molehill and divert from the fact that the DNA test showed she has NA ancestry just like she always claimed. Give it a rest. The desperation is starting to stink.
Click to expand...

Because we judge actions beyond them being criminal or for personal gain. Actions can demonstrate a concern for appropriateness, temperament, skepticsm, morality, etc. These questions about did she lie ordoes it validate her story are irrelevant to the bigger issue. Not a single defender would have done the same thing. That says a lot about her decision.
 
The Big Dog said:
I enjoy the posts desperately trying to make fetch Donny Grape Juice happen.

Basically the entire Native American community is up in arms about warren’s idiotic stunt, but....

Donny Grape Juice! Har har!
Click to expand...

Perhaps, DONNY GRAPE JUICE could pay off the bet by giving the money to an NA charity?
 
Stacyhs said:
Who gives a flying frickin' F about that? Did she break a law? No. Did she gain from it? No. Did she hurt anyone? No. Did she traumatize anyone? No. The only reason Trump supporters keep harping on that is because they're trying to make a mountain out of a molehill and divert from the fact that the DNA test showed she has NA ancestry just like she always claimed. Give it a rest. The desperation is starting to stink.
Click to expand...

BobTheCoward said:
This is no place for exaggeration.

Most of the native American community probably haven't even heard this story.
Click to expand...

Stacyhs said:
Hyperbole is TBD's automatic go to and all he's got. It's why I pay him no mind.
Click to expand...

"Warren’s video and subsequent release of her DNA report was a disgrace, a vicious rejection of Native sovereignty, and, more than anything, completely foreseeable. Had Warren spoken to any Native with a clear mind, this idea would have been dead on arrival."
 
The Big Dog said:
"Warren’s video and subsequent release of her DNA report was a disgrace, a vicious rejection of Native sovereignty, and, more than anything, completely foreseeable. Had Warren spoken to any Native with a clear mind, this idea would have been dead on arrival."
Click to expand...

A statement by politician does not mean the majority of the constituents is aware of the issue.
 
Stacyhs said:
She never said she "was an Indian". She said she had Native American lineage (Cherokee and/or Delaware by family lore). And she does.
(DNA report)


(Politicfact)



(Politifact)

Hope this helps but somehow, I doubt it.
Click to expand...

She was the first "woman of color" to join the Harvard faculty, according to Harvard. I'm pretty sure they didn't make that up, so it's far more likely that Fauxcahontas lied to them about it. I'm sure you would agree it wasn't Harvard that lied about it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom