TERFs crash London Pride
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caveman1917
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I don't know Joe, what percentage of Flat Earthers have to be murdered before you'll be going around saying the Earth is flat out of "basic respect and decency"?
Rolfe
Adult human female
More in hope than expectation again.
https://sarahditum.com/2018/09/10/six-years-in-the-gender-wars/
https://sarahditum.com/2018/09/10/six-years-in-the-gender-wars/
luchog
Neo-Post-Retro-Revivalist
Yawn. Oh look, more anti-trans crusaders elevating personal opinion and denying verifiable facts. How surprising.
Yes, we're fully aware that you're hoping that transpeople will cease to exist. But posting yet more anti-trans propaganda and people whinging about being called out on their bigotry will not accomplish that.
So, still no chance of an actual, scientific source, or at least reliable journalistic source. Oh well, one continues to live in hope after all.
You what? 6 people? Hate to tell you this, but there were a whole lot more than 6 transpeople killed during that time, and there have been several times that so far this year.
Transpeople obviously don't deserve basic respect and dignity, only marginalization and erasure, since they're a fundamental, existential threat to women by their mere existence.
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caveman1917
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Here you go. Now how about you come up with some actual data rather than these ridiculous evidence-free rants?
Porpoise of Life
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Wait, who said we were only talking about the UK?
If you go to the map you end up with well over a thousand victims, rather than 6...
If you go to the map you end up with well over a thousand victims, rather than 6...
caveman1917
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The thread is about the UK and the statistics discussed so far have been about the UK.
luchog
Neo-Post-Retro-Revivalist
Oh look, more goalpost moving and cherry picking. You're aware that there is a whole world that exists outside the UK, yes? And that in that world, transgender people get murdered?
Pretending to be ignorant of data posted earlier in this very thread just makes you look like an idiot and a woo, as much as posting cherry picked data and evidence-free rants from anti-trans crusaders does.
caveman1917
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Oh look, more goalpost moving and cherry picking. You're aware that there is a whole world that exists outside the UK, yes? And that in that world, transgender people get murdered?
Pretending to be ignorant of data posted earlier in this very thread just makes you look like an idiot and a woo, as much as posting cherry picked data and evidence-free rants from anti-trans crusaders does.
Edited by kmortis:
Removed to comply with Rule 12 & Rule 0
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kellyb
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Kind of a nitpick, but she says:
"Established" is a somewhat slippery scientific concept, but there is evidence strongly suggesting that something of the sort is going on.
I linked to it here:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12400808&postcount=1026
More back and forth between JJ and I here:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12401852&postcount=1035
luchog
Neo-Post-Retro-Revivalist
The thread title is about a specific protest in the UK, which was an attack on transgendered people as a class, and the subsequent postings by the various anti-trans people in this thread have attacked transpeople as a class. Restricting this one small part of the overall larger discussion is nothing but self-serving goalpost moving and cherry-picking to ignore the greater problems faced by transpeople, including the fact that a fringe of radical feminists are trying to erase the existence and validity of transpeople while claiming that they themselves are being erased by the existence of transpeople.
I also linked to a collection of data on the subject just a few pages earlier in this thread:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=12417105#post12417105
The data is increasingly supporting the hypthosis that transgenderism is a neurological phenomenon, that the internal body image is hard-wired and out of sync with physical sex in these cases; and appears to have both genetic and developmental components. Of course, that was just dismissed by the anti-trans crusaders as "trans activist propaganda".
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luchog
Neo-Post-Retro-Revivalist
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kellyb
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We went down the murder rate rabbit hole when JJ said:
She was talking about the UK homicide rates, and that's not cherry picking.
Information Analyst
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caveman1917
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caveman1917
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Feel free to show the data being inaccurate. Of course you can't, it's after all not very hard to verify, we are talking about just 8 events - all of which were widely publicized and verifiable. So all you have left is to attack the venue where the results were presented. But if the results themselves are easily verified as accurate, then it doesn't matter where they were presented, does it? So let me make a guess, this is basically how your reasoning went:
"Oops, this data contradicts my preferred belief, what can I do now? Well I obviously can't say the results are false, it is after all so friggin easy for anyone to verify for themselves. Hmmm, I could attack the venue the results were presented. Of course this has no bearing on the actual truth of the results, which again can simply be verified by anyone, but people are stupid so they'll probably fall for that anyway. But then I still have the problem that I have no basis for attacking the venue. Hmmm, I could just launch an unsupported attack on the venue, simply telling everyone of my own personal dislike for it without support. People are stupid after all, I'll just call this stuff 'Information Analysis' or something and they'll fall for it."
Let me guess, you're a liberal too?
Rolfe
Adult human female
The actual definition of argumentum ad hominem.
We're in a bit of a circular argument here. Every forum in which statistics are presented to counter the trans-activists' lies is rejected on the grounds that it doesn't support the trans-activist position. Reams of thoughtful analysis is discounted (probably without even reading it) because the writer doesn't support the trans-activist position.
We've already seen that even when a research paper is peer-reviewed and published in a reputable journal, attacks from trans-activists can force the journal and the researcher's university to repudiate the study, on the ground that it seems to upset trans people.
I've become a bit disillusioned by the quality of debate in this forum since the heady days of the early 2000s when we were shredding people with unscientific beliefs, but I'm still rather startled it's got as bad as this.
caveman1917
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I think it's a nice illustration of the marketplace of ideas, where the ideas most profitable for capital accumulation rise the top. Current-day gender ideology is quite profitable to capital in various ways, whereas left-wing critiques of gender are quite unprofitable to capital (in no small part because they invariably come with critiques of capitalism).
kellyb
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You're the only anti-capitalist "TERF" I've encountered.