Cont: Breaking: Mueller Grand Jury charges filed, arrests as soon as Monday pt 2

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Well, that backfired:

Manafort's lawyers requested a delay in his trial because he's too far away from his lawyers to effectively prepare for trial. The judge ordered him moved to a detention facility closer. His lawyers objected, saying that he wouldn't be safe - although the actual reason is that he is in constant communication with his lawyers, and gets "VIP treatment" - including a private suite with private shower, his own phone line (on which he is in constant contact with his lawyers), and his own laptop with "all [his] files like I would at home.", which can be used in his private suite. The judge has rejected the objection and ordered him moved, noting that he will be as safe as - and treated the same as - all the other prisoners.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Well, that backfired:

Manafort's lawyers requested a delay in his trial because he's too far away from his lawyers to effectively prepare for trial. The judge ordered him moved to a detention facility closer. His lawyers objected, saying that he wouldn't be safe - although the actual reason is that he is in constant communication with his lawyers, and gets "VIP treatment" - including a private suite with private shower, his own phone line (on which he is in constant contact with his lawyers), and his own laptop with "all [his] files like I would at home.", which can be used in his private suite. The judge has rejected the objection and ordered him moved, noting that he will be as safe as - and treated the same as - all the other prisoners.

I very much enjoy that his top-dollar lawyers just argued him out of his VIP luxury cell into a large gen-pop prison. Delicious.

 

[theprestige]

evasion.

Practicality. It's not worth the effort to translate your analogy, craft my reply, translate my reply back to the analogy, and then argue about translation errors.

By the time you're done explaining which parts of your analogy are properly analogous to which parts of the thing itself, you'll have made the exact same argument in terms of the thing itself. Why don't we just skip to that part?

 

[Cabbage]

Practicality. It's not worth the effort to translate your analogy, craft my reply, translate my reply back to the analogy, and then argue about translation errors.

By the time you're done explaining which parts of your analogy are properly analogous to which parts of the thing itself, you'll have made the exact same argument in terms of the thing itself. Why don't we just skip to that part?

Meanwhile, you spend more time discussing said analogy than you do responding to other points you have missed:

The fact that Manafort was acting as a Russian agent while serving as Trump's campaign manager is most certainly related to the investigation.

You keep bringing up this "process crime" thing for those who are cooperating. That's what they pled *down* to. What other bigger charges were they facing, which lead to accepting the charge(s) now on the books?

That plot of Flynn 'n kin to kidnap a Turkish cleric and turn him over to Erdogan, for a million bucks or two. Could be there was legal jeopardy there. To name just one potential charge not now levied in exchange for his cooperation.

Sure as hell looks like evasion to me! LOL

And when you posted

Exactly? Manafort is being prosecuted for stuff unrelated to the actual investigation. Flynn's on the hook for a process crime, over something that isn't actually suspicious at all. What am I missing?

...another one (of many) things you missed is Don Jr's Trump Tower meeting and the subsequent lies told about it.

Of course, if you're gullible, I can see where you might not find any of that concerning.

 

[The Big Dog]

While you're in a fact-bringing mood, can you explain what you believe the word "debriefed" means in this context?

Oh my goodness, I had absolutely no idea whatsoever that you were still on about this! That is fascinating. I mean i just quoted the entire quote, with a long article discussing all the issues.

I'd ask you whether you saw the context in which he said it, but we would certainly be wasting our time. Lets take a gander together!

“I have a pretty good idea because I have seen all the documents that they have,” Giuliani said. “We have debriefed all their witnesses. And we have pressed them numerous times.”

“You have debriefed all of their witnesses?” Bash asked.

“I think so, I mean, the ones that were — the ones that were involved in the joint defense agreement, which constitutes all the critical ones,” Giuliani replied.

No lets LASER in -whhhhhhhhooooooooooooooo------------

“We have debriefed all their witnesses. And we have pressed them numerous times.”

Hmm, he used the word "debriefed" and said they "pressed them."

I think it mean they interrogated them.

What do you think it means?

 

[plague311]

Oh my goodness, I had absolutely no idea whatsoever that you were still on about this! That is fascinating. I mean i just quoted the entire quote, with a long article discussing all the issues.

I'd ask you whether you saw the context in which he said it, but we would certainly be wasting our time. Lets take a gander together!



No lets LASER in -whhhhhhhhooooooooooooooo------------

“We have debriefed all their witnesses. And we have pressed them numerous times.”

Hmm, he used the word "debriefed" and said they "pressed them."

I think it mean they interrogated them.

What do you think it means?

[emoji106]

Waiting for your expert *snort* analysis on how extremely terrible and uneducated Manafort's lawyers are, and how bad they got "teh smack downz" because their motion got denied.

Oh who am I kidding. You aren't critical of anyone but Avanetti. We both know you wouldn't do that out of fear of leaving your political partisanship.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

I think it mean they interrogated them.

Thank you.

Man, that was like getting blood out of a stone.

 

[Emily's Cat]

I don't get it, how is it a derail? This thread is about Mueller's investigation. This thumb drive turned into a conversation piece with regards to Mueller's investigation. Maybe one of you two could educate me on the difference between thread drift and red herring/derails?

The whole "data dump" bit is fairly speculative... and what file format it is in really doesn't have anything to do with whether it's a data dump, at least I don't think it does.

I figure, IF it was a "dump", then that's kind of playing dirty by the prosecution, intended to obscure their claims and materially disadvantage the defense. But none of us know whether it's a "dump", none of us knows whether it's "categorized", or even really agree on what categorized means. So maybe distraction is a better term? I dunno, I just don't figure it's particularly relevant.

 

[jimbob]

The whole "data dump" bit is fairly speculative... and what file format it is in really doesn't have anything to do with whether it's a data dump, at least I don't think it does.

I figure, IF it was a "dump", then that's kind of playing dirty by the prosecution, intended to obscure their claims and materially disadvantage the defense. But none of us know whether it's a "dump", none of us knows whether it's "categorized", or even really agree on what categorized means. So maybe distraction is a better term? I dunno, I just don't figure it's particularly relevant.

Presumably the defence lawyers can speak to their client and ask whether there is anything that might look suspicious in there.

 

[plague311]

The whole "data dump" bit is fairly speculative... and what file format it is in really doesn't have anything to do with whether it's a data dump, at least I don't think it does.

I figure, IF it was a "dump", then that's kind of playing dirty by the prosecution, intended to obscure their claims and materially disadvantage the defense. But none of us know whether it's a "dump", none of us knows whether it's "categorized", or even really agree on what categorized means. So maybe distraction is a better term? I dunno, I just don't figure it's particularly relevant.

Relevant enough for you to continuously discuss it anyway. Yes, I understand you don't see how file format is relevant. I'm not surprised.

For the last time, it has to be categorized by at least username, date and post. It has to be as that is how Mueller would ask for the information in the request and that would be the relevant information to his request. I don't get why anyone would argue with this, but here we are.

It's not burying the defense at all and it's not a data dump. If he gave them literally everything at once, then that would be a data dump. As it stands, the charges show what he found, the defense has the beginning of discovery and to imply the prosecution owes the defense anymore than that is just plain stupid. It's not on the prosecution to do the defense's legal work. They have to have evidence to support their charges. That's it.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Emily's Cat]

Lol I will admit when I am wrong. I have never had a negative experience with a tit that I can remember. You are correct.

As the owner of two tits, I can attest to having had several negative experiences with them, including (but not limited to): nipple itches, chafing, getting them caught in clothing, mammograms, and having them treated unexpectedly roughly by my spouse when alcohol was involved.

 

[Emily's Cat]

You keep bringing up this "process crime" thing for those who are cooperating. That's what they pled *down* to. What other bigger charges were they facing, which lead to accepting the charge(s) now on the books?

That's an excellent question. Do you know what those other potential charges were?

 

[Emily's Cat]

Relevant enough for you to continuously discuss it anyway.

I found it an interesting topic, but I also freely admitted that it was a derail... then you complained about me acknowledging it as being irrelevant and a distraction... so... I don't really follow why this is a bad mark on me here.

Yes, I understand you don't see how file format is relevant. I'm not surprised.

I supposed I'm not surirsed by your response either. How hard is it to just have a discussion without always trying to score points?

For the last time, it has to be categorized by at least username, date and post. It has to be as that is how Mueller would ask for the information in the request and that would be the relevant information to his request. I don't get why anyone would argue with this, but here we are.

It's not burying the defense at all and it's not a data dump. If he gave them literally everything at once, then that would be a data dump. As it stands, the charges show what he found, the defense has the beginning of discovery and to imply the prosecution owes the defense anymore than that is just plain stupid. It's not on the prosecution to do the defense's legal work. They have to have evidence to support their charges. That's it.

Okay then. You seem to have a lot more invested in this than I realized.

 

[xjx388]

As the owner of two tits, I can attest to having had several negative experiences with them, including (but not limited to): nipple itches, chafing, getting them caught in clothing, mammograms, and having them treated unexpectedly roughly by my spouse when alcohol was involved.

You are killing the mystique!

 

[theprestige]

Presumably the defence lawyers can speak to their client and ask whether there is anything that might look suspicious in there.

That seems like a perversion of justice. The defendant should be entitled to know the case that the state is bringing against them, and not have to guess at it.

Your approach would force the defendant to build a defense against every possible case that could potentially be brought. Meanwhile the prosecution can focus all their resources on the one case they actually intend to bring to trial. I think that is absolutely an unfair burden to place on the defendant.

 

[Segnosaur]

You keep bringing up this "process crime" thing for those who are cooperating. That's what they pled *down* to. What other bigger charges were they facing, which lead to accepting the charge(s) now on the books?

That's an excellent question. Do you know what those other potential charges were?

We probably don't know ALL the potential charges that could have been laid against Flynn, but some of the possibilities are:

- Lying on official documents when registering as a lobbyist for foreign interests (This was admitted to in the plea agreement)
- Lying about contacts with Russians on documents for security clearance
- Pushing for a business plan involving the building of nuclear reactors in the middle east, after he was sworn into cabinet, which would have been a conflict of interest

Unlike lying to the FBI (a serious enough charge), him lying on official documents for his security clearance or as a lobbyist were not done as a result of "prodding" by the FBI.

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/...rged-with-and-what-his-guilty-plea-means.html
https://www.vox.com/2017/12/6/16743476/michael-flynn-russia-sanctions

 

[NoahFence]

Peter Strzok is destroying these spineless republicans.

Good to see.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

I supposed I'm not surirsed by your response either. How hard is it to just have a discussion without always trying to score points?

Too difficult for you ?

Okay then. You seem to have a lot more invested in this than I realized.

 

[The Big Dog]

Smug little **** Strzok get destroyed from orbit

Democrats freak out

keep in mid that this is the same guy who was dismantled by the IG and was removed from the Russian investigation by Mueller.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Peter Strzok is destroying these spineless republicans.

Smug little **** Strzok get destroyed from orbit