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Cont: Breaking: Mueller Grand Jury charges filed, arrests as soon as Monday pt 2

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theprestige said:
Huh. You've never found a reason to criticize the CIA?
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That would be a surprise. The CIA has done a LOT of things that are quite worthy of criticism, after all. The FBI's much cleaner, but there have been some doozies in the past, if I recall correctly.

Either way, I tend to hold the opinion that he's attacking the intelligence agencies for much the same reason that he's attacking the media. Namely, so that fewer people will believe the negative reports about him, regardless of their actual truth.
 
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Aridas said:
That would be a surprise. The CIA has done a LOT of things that are quite worthy of criticism, after all. The FBI's much cleaner, but there have been some doozies in the past, if I recall correctly.

Either way, I tend to hold the opinion that he's attacking the intelligence agencies for much the same reason that he's attacking the media. Namely, so that fewer people will believe the negative reports about him, regardless of their actual truth.
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yes
 
Ziggurat said:
Seriously?
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:v:

That's an incredibly distorted POV. Poor Donald. He only colluded with the Russians and a number of other foreign governments to get elected, and he's likely been money laundering for decades. But poor widdle Donnie feels so picked on by those mean FBI and CIA agents who've seen the evidence against Trump.
 
Aridas said:
That would be a surprise. The CIA has done a LOT of things that are quite worthy of criticism, after all. The FBI's much cleaner, but there have been some doozies in the past, if I recall correctly.

Either way, I tend to hold the opinion that he's attacking the intelligence agencies for much the same reason that he's attacking the media. Namely, so that fewer people will believe the negative reports about him, regardless of their actual truth.
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Yep.

And the FBI had a much dirtier record before some other agencies took over domestic spying on political protesters.

So what? It's absolutely not relevant in this discussion.
 
Ziggurat said:
You say that like it's a one-way street. But it isn't. It never was.

https://www.bizpacreview.com/2017/1...gence-agencies-treated-president-trump-574591

"“So let’s put ourselves here in Donald Trump’s shoes,” Morell said. “What does he see? He sees a former director of CIA and a former director of NSA, Mike Hayden … criticizing him and his policies. Right? And he could rightfully have said, ‘What’s going on with these intelligence guys?’”

Morell continued: “Then he sees a former acting director and deputy director of CIA criticizing him and endorsing his opponent. And then he gets his first intelligence briefing after becoming the Republican nominee. And within 24 to 48 hours, there are leaks out of that that are critical of him and his then-national security advisor, Mike Flynn.”

Morell said it’s no wonder President Trump has attacked the intelligence agencies (which employ countless Obama holdovers even at the upper levels), given the constant press leaks and withering public condemnations from current and former officials."

The intelligence community's own hostility to Trump has already backfired.
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Let's look at that article, shall we?

It's dated Dec 2017, citing a Dec 2017 article.

I think it's safe to assume Samantha Chang is a right-wing blogger given she's cherry picked and distorted much of what Morrell actually said in the cited article: Politico: the actual Morrell interview transcript.

For example, here's the whole quote in context about putting oneself in Trump's shoes:
The second was in August of 2016, when I became political, when I endorsed Hillary Clinton with an op-ed in The New York Times, and that was a very difficult decision for me, because I had never been political before. I worked at this nonpolitical agency, bright red line between intelligence and policy, and intelligence and politics. So, I had never played that role before.

But I was so deeply concerned about what a Trump presidency might look like from a national security perspective, and believed that there was such a gap between Secretary Clinton and Donald Trump with regard to how well they would protect the country, that I thought it extremely important to come out and say that.

Glasser: Okay, so, flash-forward a year. Was that a mistake?

Morell: So, I don’t think it was a mistake. I think there were downsides to it that I didn’t think about at the time. I was concerned about what is the impact it would have on the agency, right? Very concerned about that, thought that through. But I don’t think I fully thought through the implications.

And one of the ways I’ve thought about that, Susan, is—okay, how did Donald Trump see this? Right? And from—it’s very important—one of the things we do as intelligence analysts is make sure that our guy—the president—understands the other guy. Right?

So, let’s put ourselves here in Donald Trump’s shoes. So, what does he see? Right? He sees a former director of CIA and a former director of NSA, Mike Hayden, who I have the greatest respect for, criticizing him and his policies. Right? And he could rightfully have said, “Huh, what’s going on with these intelligence guys?” Right?

Glasser: It embroiders his narrative....

Morell: ... So, I think there was a significant downside to those of us who became political in that moment. So, if I could have thought of that, would I have ended up in a different place? I don’t know. But it’s something I didn’t think about.
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He's not saying anywhere in that interview that Trump was right, that the CIA and FBI were unfair or anything like that. Morrell says Trump truly worried all of them from Brennan to himself.

Here's what he really thinks about Trump:
... Morell: The best place to start is with a caveat, is I have no insight into the FBI investigation or the two investigations being done by the Intelligence Committees in the House and Senate. So, this is really me being an analyst, looking at everything that’s available, right?

The first thing I’d say is that there may be a benign explanation for all of this. What might that be? The benign explanation is that Vladimir Putin, understanding who Donald Trump was as a person, understanding how narcissistic he is, played to Donald Trump by saying he was a great guy—right? Had the potential to be a great leader, et cetera, et cetera.

And Trump responded exactly the way Putin wanted him to by reciprocating, right? Great leader, et cetera, et cetera. Right? Maybe what he did in Ukraine and Crimea was all right....
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Trump might not be a criminal, could be Trump is just a dupe.
If you think Morrell is siding with Trump or thinks Trump is being falsely accused you need to read the actual transcript, not Ms Chang's carefully cherry picked half dozen lines.

Morrell is saying they could have done things better, but he's just as concerned about Trump as a lot of other people are.
 
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When our understanding of the facts change, the narrative needs to change.

Republicans should stop denying collusion, and all real Americans should start thanking Russia for saving us from Clinton.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
If you think Morrell is siding with Trump
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I never said anything of the sort. In fact, the fact that Morell (would people start spelling his name correctly? There's only one 'r') was and is anti-Trump means saying that Trump had reason to distrust the intelligence community is an admission against interest. It lends credibility to his statement.

Unlike you, Morell is actually capable of introspection and understanding other perspectives.
 
Cain said:
When our understanding of the facts change, the narrative needs to change.

Republicans should stop denying collusion, and all real Americans should start thanking Russia for saving us from Clinton.
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Why are you betraying your country? No really, I'm curious.
 
Ziggurat said:
There's only one 'r') was and is anti-Trump means saying that Trump had reason to distrust the intelligence community is an admission against interest. It lends credibility to his statement.
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Give it up. If the intelligence agencies doing their jobs is sufficient to cause Trump to be concerned about them, the only person that reflects badly on is Trump. Trump is about as right to be concerned about them as thief is to be "right" concerned about the police.
 
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