Cont: School shooting Florida - pt 2

The criticism of the laudable efforts of the Parklands students that genuinely had me laughing was along the lines of 'no way did they organise such a powerful effort on Social Media'

Because as we all know, teens really struggle with Social Media and need dedicated support from the older generation.

:rolleyes:
 
applecorped said:
It's good to know that massive trauma doesn't affect one's ability to troll.
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Pain and trauma are often channeled into humor. It's where the best comedy comes from. Which is why it does my heart good to read your posts and know your life must be completely trauma-free.
 
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CaptainHowdy said:
That doesn't mean that I buy into the ridiculous conspiracy theory that the students themselves organized a grassroots movement in response to a mass shooting at their school and that's taken over the world bcause tehey have the moral imperative.
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That's not the conspiracy theory. That's the fact. The conspiracy theory is that these kids are being manipulated into an anti-gun agenda by Liberals. The fact on that is that they were not manipulated into that agenda but driven to it by paid for lawmakers who will not do anything about the gun crisis in the U.S.

These kids are feeling genuine moral outrage but that outrage is being manipulated by adults behind the scenes and channeled to push a political agenda and has been starting on the day of the shooting.
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No. these kids are too strong of character to be manipulated like that. The people being manipulated are the weak minded people who regurgitate NRA, and FAUX News, lies about these kids to further the gun nut agenda.

I don't see any problem with criticizing these kids or calling them out for their BS.
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And by calling them out, you mean making up lies about them and then having your minions restate those lies as if they were gospel.

They are public figures who deserve to be mocked, ridiculed, and held accountable for what they say and do as much as any public figure.
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Public figures should be mocked, ridiculed, and held accountable for what they say when they say things that are stupid, incorrect, or outright lies. Your beef is with the gun nutters, NRA, FAUX News, and individuals like Ted Nuggent. That's where the BS is coming from.

The fact that they are children doesn't mean we should tread lightly in dealing them or worry about hurting their feelings. They don't get a pass just because of what they experienced. The kids who are not in the limelight shouldn't be hounded by the press but Emma and David should have everything they say fact checked and not taken at face value.
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You better hope these kids don't get wind of the fact that you are repeating the lies against them. It hasn't gone well for any of the adults who have done the same thing. FAUX News has a reporter taking a surprise vacation because she thought like you do that these were just kids and she was the big, tough adult. These kids don't seem to have any trouble defending themselves when they are given the platform.
 
Border Reiver said:
It is very much an attack on the arguer, not the argument. Far more easy to pull off than arguing against what is actually being said. By belittling the survivors, it allows people on the other side to demean the argument without having to actually deal with what is being said, making it easier to dismiss.
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What is being said, specifically? What gun control measures are Emma and David proposing? Specifically.
 
Worm said:
The criticism of the laudable efforts of the Parklands students that genuinely had me laughing was along the lines of 'no way did they organise such a powerful effort on Social Media'

Because as we all know, teens really struggle with Social Media and need dedicated support from the older generation.

:rolleyes:
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And people ask me why I think that large swaths of the public believe these kids did all this on their own?
 
qayak said:
That's not the conspiracy theory. That's the fact. The conspiracy theory is that these kids are being manipulated into an anti-gun agenda by Liberals. The fact on that is that they were not manipulated into that agenda but driven to it by paid for lawmakers who will not do anything about the gun crisis in the U.S.



No. these kids are too strong of character to be manipulated like that. The people being manipulated are the weak minded people who regurgitate NRA, and FAUX News, lies about these kids to further the gun nut agenda.



And by calling them out, you mean making up lies about them and then having your minions restate those lies as if they were gospel.



Public figures should be mocked, ridiculed, and held accountable for what they say when they say things that are stupid, incorrect, or outright lies. Your beef is with the gun nutters, NRA, FAUX News, and individuals like Ted Nuggent. That's where the BS is coming from.



You better hope these kids don't get wind of the fact that you are repeating the lies against them. It hasn't gone well for any of the adults who have done the same thing. FAUX News has a reporter taking a surprise vacation because she thought like you do that these were just kids and she was the big, tough adult. These kids don't seem to have any trouble defending themselves when they are given the platform.
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And people ask me why I think that large swaths of the public believe these kids did all this on their own?
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
After letting this nonsense soak in a bit more, I am reminded of my father who during my high school years told me the commies were recruiting kids on college campuses to oppose the Vietnam war.

:sdl:


It was absurd then and it's absurd now thinking someone is manipulating these teen activists. They couldn't be more sincere, IMO.


Oddly, many of the same people making such accusations are oblivious to or they dismiss the manipulation that went on and is going on via internet trolls and bots injecting and amplifying fake stories into the social media stream.
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And people ask me why I think that large swaths of the public believe these kids did all this on their own?
 
CaptainHowdy said:
What is being said, specifically? What gun control measures are Emma and David proposing? Specifically.
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So, you don't know what it is they are asking for, but whatever it is, they are being manipulated, etc. etc.?

https://marchforourlives.com/how-we-save-lives/


Now, I can't say for sure whether Emma and/or David specifically endorse each and every one of these points as written. I just know that whoever owns the web site "March for Our Lives" approved putting those points up, and I know that Emma, David, and the others were instrumental in creating "March for Our Lives".

If you really want to know about Emma, I know that she gave a speech where she had a bunch of people shouting "We call B.S." The "B.S" statements were talking points of the NRA. That's probably a good place to start in understanding her views on gun issues.
 
CaptainHowdy said:
And people ask me why I think that large swaths of the public believe these kids did all this on their own?
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What about their statements makes you think that Worm, qayak, or Skeptic Ginger believes that the students did all this on their own?
 
I was reading a blog yesterday that pointed out how none of the rightwingers were complaining after Columbine when parents (adults, right?) were using the stories about their kids to promote their own (religious) agenda. Despite the fact that most of the stories even turned out to be apocryphal, and they knew they weren't true (esp the part about getting shot after admitting they believed in God), they continued to go right ahead with the message and selling the books.

Where were the rightwing complaints about that? Nah....

Of course, there were leftwing complaints, but more about the fact that it was based on untrue stories.
 
Indeed, I've heard at least one 'adult' be very careful to not jump in and manipulate, conscious of the fact that this is not his fight. He just sent a message along the lines of "What you're doing is great. If I can help in any way, then let me know, but just keep doing what you're doing."
 
BrooklynBaby said:
Hogg convinced me to join the NRA, so it's not like he accomplished nothing. Trump's voter approval is up to 51% at Rasumssen, and more guns were sold in March than any other March in history, so he had some commendable accomplishments.
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A lot of those guns were sold to leftists. Ask the Romanovs or the French aristocracy how that worked out.
 
CaptainHowdy said:
And people ask me why I think that large swaths of the public believe these kids did all this on their own?
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No, we didn't ask. Wide swaths of the public believe this is a kid led movement because kids are leading it.

What we are asking is why you believe these kids are to blame for what happened and why you don't think they should be allowed to express their frustration at a system that has utterly failed them?
 
applecorped said:
It's good to know that massive trauma doesn't affect one's ability to troll.
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Yes. Yes, it is avery good thing. Human powers of recovery are quite remarkable.

eta - It is also good to know that they were able to return to school and continue learning so soon after the traumatic events. Would you agree?
 
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pgwenthold said:
I was reading a blog yesterday that pointed out how none of the rightwingers were complaining after Columbine when parents (adults, right?) were using the stories about their kids to promote their own (religious) agenda. Despite the fact that most of the stories even turned out to be apocryphal, and they knew they weren't true (esp the part about getting shot after admitting they believed in God), they continued to go right ahead with the message and selling the books.

Where were the rightwing complaints about that? Nah....

Of course, there were leftwing complaints, but more about the fact that it was based on untrue stories.
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There were a lot of people spreading the idea that Columbine was an attack of Christians. But there is zero evidence that anyone was targeted for their religion beliefs. They were shot because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. The bomb attempt in the cafeteria made it clear that the killers were not picking and choosing victims.

Some fundamentalist churches in the area did use it to promote their message. One remanent of that still exists in Colorado. You can get special license plates with a Columbine flower that say "Respect Life". Supposedly these are to honor the Columbine victims. But everyone in the state knows the plates are really an anti abortion message.

The gun lobby was somewhat restrained after Columbine but blocked almost anything from being done. They dropped the pretense of being respectful and polite after Sandy Hook. The kids who survived Columbine believed that the adults would do something. Some of them appeared alongside their parents at rallies but let the adults take the lead. The kids at Parkland had a lifetime of watching establishment politicians send thoughts and prayers after each massacre but do nothing to stop it from happening again. The message that guns matter more than people couldn't have been more clear when Congress failed to ban bump stocks after Vegas.
 
Worm said:
The criticism of the laudable efforts of the Parklands students that genuinely had me laughing was along the lines of 'no way did they organise such a powerful effort on Social Media'

Because as we all know, teens really struggle with Social Media and need dedicated support from the older generation.

:rolleyes:
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Oh yes... anyone making such a stupid statement shows that not only do they not understand social media, they severely underestimate its power.
 
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