So henri once again shows his ignorance by proving our point. Inmate called Mrs. Kane at her residence and then hung up. Evidence PROVES this (1) call happened (2) Mrs. Kane admitted as much (3) caller was male (4) Kane phone number on the murder club....evidence evidence evidence - these FACTS are NOT opinion they are FACTS aka EVIDENCE
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Merged Jeffrey MacDonald did it. He really did.
- Thread starter Bob001
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Busy Dude
BYN: Beginning with his visit to Fire Island in the Summer of 1969, inmate was one busy dude.
- Inmate meets 4 people acquainted with his brother who just happen to match the descriptions of the mythical hippie home invaders.
- Inmate was having sexual relationships with several women including the wife of Colonel Kingston and a 19 year old girl who lived in the neighborhood.
- Inmate was working a full ER shift, he had two moonlighting jobs, and he was seeking a third moonlighting job just prior to the murders.
- Inmate was planning a romantic getaway with his former high school flame with the ruse being a trip to Russia to serve as the team's physician.
No wonder that at 3:30 in the morning on 2/17/70, his lack of impulse control caused him to call Mrs. Kane at her home. By that time, his brain was a mountain of scrambled eggs.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BYN: Beginning with his visit to Fire Island in the Summer of 1969, inmate was one busy dude.
- Inmate meets 4 people acquainted with his brother who just happen to match the descriptions of the mythical hippie home invaders.
- Inmate was having sexual relationships with several women including the wife of Colonel Kingston and a 19 year old girl who lived in the neighborhood.
- Inmate was working a full ER shift, he had two moonlighting jobs, and he was seeking a third moonlighting job just prior to the murders.
- Inmate was planning a romantic getaway with his former high school flame with the ruse being a trip to Russia to serve as the team's physician.
No wonder that at 3:30 in the morning on 2/17/70, his lack of impulse control caused him to call Mrs. Kane at her home. By that time, his brain was a mountain of scrambled eggs.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
That's just opinions. A witness in court must speak only as to facts,notsome very emotional strange belief. This is what JTF has said about the Mrs. Kane phone call on his website. It is certainly not conclusive evidence to put a man into prison for the rest of his life. The police should be more careful about arresting and charging people, instead of shooting them dead, or allowing sick people to die in police custody:
FIFY and the bolded is the sum total of your argument.
Any word on which Bunny that quote came from? Easter is the odds-on favorite but if it's Playboy we need to see photographic proof.
Thorn In His Side
BStrong: Bunny is a fellow MacDonald Case researcher who assisted me in constructing my website. For a decade plus, Bunny was a major thorn in Henriboy's side, and she was the first researcher to discover that Henri posted on several true crime forums under several different tags. She eventually grew bored with the landlord's parlor games and decided to no longer feed the beast.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BStrong: Bunny is a fellow MacDonald Case researcher who assisted me in constructing my website. For a decade plus, Bunny was a major thorn in Henriboy's side, and she was the first researcher to discover that Henri posted on several true crime forums under several different tags. She eventually grew bored with the landlord's parlor games and decided to no longer feed the beast.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
BStrong: Bunny is a fellow MacDonald Case researcher who assisted me in constructing my website. For a decade plus, Bunny was a major thorn in Henriboy's side, and she was the first researcher to discover that Henri posted on several true crime forums under several different tags. She eventually grew bored with the landlord's parlor games and decided to no longer feed the beast.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
Ah, now I understand.
Henri McPhee
Illuminator
So henri once again shows his ignorance by proving our point. Inmate called Mrs. Kane at her residence and then hung up. Evidence PROVES this (1) call happened (2) Mrs. Kane admitted as much (3) caller was male (4) Kane phone number on the murder club....evidence evidence evidence - these FACTS are NOT opinion they are FACTS aka EVIDENCE
Jeff MacDonald was very friendly with the wife and daughter of his original Colonel, Colonel Kingston, and there are some suggestions he knew those females intimately. The ironic thing is at the Article 32 proceedings in 1970 all three of them spoke most highly of Jeff MacDonald. There were always friendly relations and social gatherings between the two families. Colonel Kingston seemed to be a nice chap. His next Colonel, Colonel Kane, was a dour Irishman who did not take kindly to MacDonald seeing his wife. Mrs. Kane was a bit of 'hell hath no fury' like a woman scorned, or being dumped. There is no hard evidence MacDonald phoned Mrs. Kane in the middle of the night. That's just pure speculation.
I'm a bit surprised that there doesn't seem to be documented phone records to prove the matter one way or the other. There would be now.
inmate was very friendly with the wife and daughter of his original Colonel, Colonel Kingston, and there are some suggestions he knew those females intimately.
"very friendly" is exactly what we have been pointing out to you. "very friendly" as in he was dropping trou at EVERY available opportunity. He also was VERY FRIENDLY with several daughters of his neighbors, and he had a "hot and heavy" affair during the Article 32 - the indecency of which is that Colette, Kimmie, and Kristy were barely in their graves - inmate has proven often that he is a slime bag.....
His next Colonel, Colonel Kane, was a dour Irishman who did not take kindly to MacDonald seeing his wife.
What the hell does Colonel Kane's ethnicity have to do with anything? Nothing at all, your racist, idiotic, slanderous, vicious, petty, scheming, nasty, bilious comments are insulting - knock it off.
Mrs. Kane was a bit of 'hell hath no fury' like a woman scorned, or being dumped.
PROVE IT!
There is no hard evidence MacDonald phoned Mrs. Kane in the middle of the night. That's just pure speculation.
It is NOT speculation...it is CIRCUMSTANTIAL.
Circumstantial Evidence, by definition, proves a fact from which an inference of the existence of another fact may be drawn. A finding of guilt may be based on circumstantial evidence so long as it cannot be reconciled with any other RATIONAL conclusion.
I'm a bit surprised that there doesn't seem to be documented phone records to prove the matter one way or the other. There would be now.
Why the surpise henri? this happened in the days BEFORE computerized telephone systems. In fact in 1970 it was still amazing that NASA had a computer that could fit into a single room. Yes, there would be records of the calls made from that apartment because there are now COMPUTERIZED telephone systems. Also, the 911 system is now in existence all across the USA so that there would probably be a recording of the call inmate made to the operator.
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
pure speculation.
All their posts boiled down to the essence.
Phone Calls
Fortunately, the Army's policy of logging incoming calls resulted in a documented record of inmate's two calls to Fort Bragg dispatch. Last time I checked, most residences in 1970 America did not keep a log of incoming calls. Ergo, when reporting the incoming phone call to the CID, Mrs. Kane had to rely on her memory.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
Fortunately, the Army's policy of logging incoming calls resulted in a documented record of inmate's two calls to Fort Bragg dispatch. Last time I checked, most residences in 1970 America did not keep a log of incoming calls. Ergo, when reporting the incoming phone call to the CID, Mrs. Kane had to rely on her memory.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
Perspective
The following comparison provides perspective as to why the legal system bends over backwards for "certain" individuals and lays the hammer down on others. In the early 80's, twenty-seven young black men were found murdered in Atlanta and Wayne Williams was convicted of murdering two of the victims. The totality of the forensic evidence that led to his conviction consisted of 17 carpet fibers.
The source of these 17 fibers were carpeting on the floor of Williams' car and from carpeting in his parent's residence. The carpeting was from the living room area of the residence and Williams was living with his parents at the time of the murders. Fibers found on the victim's clothing matched these two source materials.
Although it was powerful evidence of guilt, prosecutors in that case had next to nothing when compared to the physical evidence collected in the MacDonald Case. A betting man would have wagered on Williams getting far more shots at a new trial than Jeffrey MacDonald, but Williams has only received two opportunities to prove his innocence.
Yup, just two shots whereas inmate has received EIGHT opportunities to prove his innocence. What is going on here? Well, Williams is African-American, he was unemployed at the time, and living on the dole. MacDonald is Caucasian, Princeton educated, and was practicing medicine at the time of the murders.
Hmmm, I wonder why the current 4th Circuit Court has a soft spot for inmate and why Williams' defense team can't put a dent in a singular forensic link to the crimes?
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
The following comparison provides perspective as to why the legal system bends over backwards for "certain" individuals and lays the hammer down on others. In the early 80's, twenty-seven young black men were found murdered in Atlanta and Wayne Williams was convicted of murdering two of the victims. The totality of the forensic evidence that led to his conviction consisted of 17 carpet fibers.
The source of these 17 fibers were carpeting on the floor of Williams' car and from carpeting in his parent's residence. The carpeting was from the living room area of the residence and Williams was living with his parents at the time of the murders. Fibers found on the victim's clothing matched these two source materials.
Although it was powerful evidence of guilt, prosecutors in that case had next to nothing when compared to the physical evidence collected in the MacDonald Case. A betting man would have wagered on Williams getting far more shots at a new trial than Jeffrey MacDonald, but Williams has only received two opportunities to prove his innocence.
Yup, just two shots whereas inmate has received EIGHT opportunities to prove his innocence. What is going on here? Well, Williams is African-American, he was unemployed at the time, and living on the dole. MacDonald is Caucasian, Princeton educated, and was practicing medicine at the time of the murders.
Hmmm, I wonder why the current 4th Circuit Court has a soft spot for inmate and why Williams' defense team can't put a dent in a singular forensic link to the crimes?
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
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Henri McPhee
Illuminator
The thing about that Williams case is that the FBI "only said it could be" hair and fiber department may have got it right there. There were no similar murders after Williams had been caught and imprisoned. In the MacDonald case it's all opinions and sloppy forensic work and assumptions and jumping to conclusions and disregarding of leads and suspects. There is no real proof. It was an unsafe verdict by very bad judges. MacDonald is innocent.
The following comparison provides perspective as to why the legal system bends over backwards for "certain" individuals and lays the hammer down on others. In the early 80's, twenty-seven young black men were found murdered in Atlanta and Wayne Williams was convicted of murdering two of the victims. The totality of the forensic evidence that led to his conviction consisted of 17 carpet fibers.
The source of these 17 fibers were carpeting on the floor of Williams' car and from carpeting in his parent's residence. The carpeting was from the living room area of the residence and Williams was living with his parents at the time of the murders. Fibers found on the victim's clothing matched these two source materials.
Although it was powerful evidence of guilt, prosecutors in that case had next to nothing when compared to the physical evidence collected in the MacDonald Case. A betting man would have wagered on Williams getting far more shots at a new trial than Jeffrey MacDonald, but Williams has only received two opportunities to prove his innocence.
Yup, just two shots whereas inmate has received EIGHT opportunities to prove his innocence. What is going on here? Well, Williams is African-American, he was unemployed at the time, and living on the dole. MacDonald is Caucasian, Princeton educated, and was practicing medicine at the time of the murders.
Hmmm, I wonder why the current 4th Circuit Court has a soft spot for inmate and why Williams' defense team can't put a dent in a singular forensic link to the crimes?
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
Although I am 100% certain that Wayne Williams is rightfully convicted, I am shocked that in all these years he has only been given two appeals. However, I am fairly certain that he doesn't have former US Marshals willing to commit perjury for him. Nor has a pathetic doped up attention seeking person come forward to confess, recant, confess, recant, confess, recant and so on......I do not see any high profile lawyers coming forward to pick up the mantle of Wayne Williams and I have never seen him on any talk shows doing his best Bob Hope schtick. Perhaps that is the true difference?
desmirelle
Critical Thinker
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Apparently, we're right about the man crush thing. Williams needs Henri's help far more than Macdonald, but Henri ignores the lesser evidence of the Williams case in favor of a white man who trained as a doctor.
Ignorance Is Bliss
BYN: Similar to the MacDonald Case, the landlord knows little about the forensic evidence presented at trial in the Williams Case. The FBI did NOT merely state that the carpet fibers could have come from Williams' car and/or his parents living room. They determined that the material used to construct the carpeting in the Williams home was unique to the point where they could confidently state that the fibers found on the victim's clothing MATCHED the carpeting in the Williams home.
I like your take on the reasons why inmate has had 6 more shots at a new trial than Wayne Williams. It is interesting to note that an FBI informant told two FBI agents that several members of a white supremacist group bragged about killing several of the victims in the Williams Case. This information was the main reason why Williams got his 2nd shot at a new trial.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BYN: Similar to the MacDonald Case, the landlord knows little about the forensic evidence presented at trial in the Williams Case. The FBI did NOT merely state that the carpet fibers could have come from Williams' car and/or his parents living room. They determined that the material used to construct the carpeting in the Williams home was unique to the point where they could confidently state that the fibers found on the victim's clothing MATCHED the carpeting in the Williams home.
I like your take on the reasons why inmate has had 6 more shots at a new trial than Wayne Williams. It is interesting to note that an FBI informant told two FBI agents that several members of a white supremacist group bragged about killing several of the victims in the Williams Case. This information was the main reason why Williams got his 2nd shot at a new trial.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BStrong
Penultimate Amazing
The thing about that Williams case is that the FBI "only said it could be" hair and fiber department may have got it right there. There were no similar murders after Williams had been caught and imprisoned. In the MacDonald case it's all opinions and sloppy forensic work and assumptions and jumping to conclusions and disregarding of leads and suspects. There is no real proof. It was an unsafe verdict by very bad judges. MacDonald is innocent.
No similar murders at Ft. Bragg after your man crush was convicted.
It was the safest verdict. A murderer was convicted and sentenced.
Spot On
BStrong: Outstanding rebuttal to Henriboy's specious talking points. Oh, wait, I forgot about Helter Skelter. A classic case of true crime reverse engineering.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
BStrong: Outstanding rebuttal to Henriboy's specious talking points. Oh, wait, I forgot about Helter Skelter. A classic case of true crime reverse engineering.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com
desmirelle
Critical Thinker
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2016
- Messages
- 483
JTF:
In post #3662, you left out the self-admitted Eskatrol (speed in a legal form at that time) that Macdonald was taking.......
In post #3662, you left out the self-admitted Eskatrol (speed in a legal form at that time) that Macdonald was taking.......
Under The Radar Admission
DESMIRELLE: Yup, he certainly had a full schedule prior to becoming one of the most notorious mass murderers in North America. In regards to the Eskatrol "issue," the following Article 32 testimony has been one of the more underrated aspects of this case discussion.
Segal: Have you ever used any other hallucinogenic drug?
MacDonald: No, sir. Well, now — let me be perfectly honest. You know what medical people consider and what the people who, general lay people, consider to be drug abuse, are really different. I have taken diet pills, for instance, amphetamines, and amphetamines are considered — they are not with LSD in that hallucinogenic category, but they can — they can in certain situations cause hallucinations.
Segal: Is it correct that diet pills are actually classified as dangerous drugs or legend drugs in various jurisdictions?
MacDonald: Right.
Segal: Again, I am addressing myself to a hallucinogenic such as LSD.
MacDonald: No, I have not taken that.
Segal: Mescaline?
MacDonald: No.
Segal: Peyote?
MacDonald: No.
Segal: Any drug which you understand to be commonly viewed by law enforcement authorities as a hallucinogenic drug as abuse and has no really standard medical purpose.
MacDonald: No, sir, I've never taken such a drug.
Clifford Somers never questioned MacDonald on this issue, thus missing the opportunity to get MacDonald on record regarding the amount of amphetamines he was using, and whether or not he was using them around the time of the murders.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com/html/misc_evidence.html
DESMIRELLE: Yup, he certainly had a full schedule prior to becoming one of the most notorious mass murderers in North America. In regards to the Eskatrol "issue," the following Article 32 testimony has been one of the more underrated aspects of this case discussion.
Segal: Have you ever used any other hallucinogenic drug?
MacDonald: No, sir. Well, now — let me be perfectly honest. You know what medical people consider and what the people who, general lay people, consider to be drug abuse, are really different. I have taken diet pills, for instance, amphetamines, and amphetamines are considered — they are not with LSD in that hallucinogenic category, but they can — they can in certain situations cause hallucinations.
Segal: Is it correct that diet pills are actually classified as dangerous drugs or legend drugs in various jurisdictions?
MacDonald: Right.
Segal: Again, I am addressing myself to a hallucinogenic such as LSD.
MacDonald: No, I have not taken that.
Segal: Mescaline?
MacDonald: No.
Segal: Peyote?
MacDonald: No.
Segal: Any drug which you understand to be commonly viewed by law enforcement authorities as a hallucinogenic drug as abuse and has no really standard medical purpose.
MacDonald: No, sir, I've never taken such a drug.
Clifford Somers never questioned MacDonald on this issue, thus missing the opportunity to get MacDonald on record regarding the amount of amphetamines he was using, and whether or not he was using them around the time of the murders.
http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.com/html/misc_evidence.html
Henri McPhee
Illuminator
JTF:
In post #3662, you left out the self-admitted Eskatrol (speed in a legal form at that time) that Macdonald was taking.......
That's a load of bollocks, if you pardon my French. The matter is explained at this website, and it was demolished by MacDonald lawyer Gary Bostwick at the McGinniss trial in 1987:
http://dingeengoete.blogspot.co.uk/2012/07/dr-jeffrey-macdonald.html
The Mother of Invention
Completely unencumbered with any facts, McGinniss invented a story to explain how a man that everyone agreed was a man who loved and cared for his wife and children could suddenly become the raging maniac that killed the three of them.� McGinniss found out that in the year before the murders that MacDonald had taken some diet pills to lose weight.� In fact, he had taken just a few prescription diet pills, but not near the time of the murder.� McGinniss decided on his own that MacDonald was taking 2-3 pills a day which would have represented a significant overdose.� The author then imagined that in a rage brought on by amphetamine psychosis, MacDonald suddenly slaughtered his family because his little girl wet the bed.� McGinniss formulated this tale despite the fact that all of the tests done on MacDonald when he was taken to the hospital shortly after the murders were negative for drugs.
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No henri it is not "bollocks" which btw is not french. INMATE HIMSELF ADMITTED THAT HE WAS TAKING ESKATROL WHICH IS AMPHETAMINES. He admitted taking it at the Article 32 although he downplayed it, he also admitted it (was the first thing he wrote) in his list of "things you should know" for his attorneys.
Joe McG said that his amphetamine psychosis WAS A THEORY and ONLY HIS THEORY but it was BASED ON FACTS. FACTS like inmate was taking amphetamines. Oh, and has been pointed out myriad times, Joe McG's theory wasn't published/mentioned/discussed until more than 4 years post conviction so his theory had/has nothing to do with why your man crush is still in prison.
Inmate slaughtered his family, was the amphetamine ingestion a catalyst? perhaps. However it is not the be all end all of what happened. FACT 1: INMATE INGESTED ESKATROL AKA AMPHETAMINES. FACT 2: INMATE SLAUGHTERED HIS FAMILY. FACT 3: HE IS RIGHTFULLY CONVICTED.
Joe McG said that his amphetamine psychosis WAS A THEORY and ONLY HIS THEORY but it was BASED ON FACTS. FACTS like inmate was taking amphetamines. Oh, and has been pointed out myriad times, Joe McG's theory wasn't published/mentioned/discussed until more than 4 years post conviction so his theory had/has nothing to do with why your man crush is still in prison.
Inmate slaughtered his family, was the amphetamine ingestion a catalyst? perhaps. However it is not the be all end all of what happened. FACT 1: INMATE INGESTED ESKATROL AKA AMPHETAMINES. FACT 2: INMATE SLAUGHTERED HIS FAMILY. FACT 3: HE IS RIGHTFULLY CONVICTED.
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