Merged The Roy Moore Batcrap Crazy Remark Thread/Roy Moore Is Done

[ahhell]

Regulation and regulatory agencies working at cross purposes and delaying some times necessary things is definitely a thing. I work in civil infrastructure and can list numerous examples.

A water agency in West Coast had the local fire control district saying they needed to cut back all of the vegetation on a river but the Army Corp of Engineers wouldn't let them because it was wild life habitat.

A coastal town that took 3 years to get a permit to build a water treatment plant because the coastal commission wouldn't let them work in the water. Meanwhile they were dumping raw sewage into the bay.

And these are projects that government agencies were trying to get built, what's it like for a private organization?

 

[ChristianProgressive]

I've always thought it weird that Christians are against abortion. God kills children left and right in the the bible. God gives man the permission to take an unruly child to the edge of the village and stone the child. God sends a she bear to kill 42 children who tease Elisha.

Happy is the one who takes your babies and smashes them against the rocks
Psalm 137:9

1) Old Testament, not new Testament

2) "children" is better translated from the original as "youths". In context, Elisha was being menaced by the ancient equivalent of a street gang.

3) The Bible forbids murder (again, using the proper terms), not all killing.

 

[quadraginta]

<snip>

In other words, in the only place the bible specifically talks about abortion, it says to cause an abortion for an unfaithful wife.

In contrast, the bible does explicitly forbid things like, say, adultery. So much does it forbid adultery that it is one of the 10 commandments that folks like Moore think we should all be seeing everywhere.

So given the option between someone who thinks that people should be free to choose an abortion if they want and an adulterer, why is adultery acceptable but the pro-choice position is not?

Because women don't count in fundi-Christianity.

Men will never have to carry a child, so they couldn't care less if a woman has a choice in the matter or not.

Adultery, OTOH, is a pastime men often enjoy, so prohibitions against it tend to get overlooked by 'true believers' when convenient.

Kind of like their stance against alcohol.

"How do you tell a Baptist from an Episcopalian?

The Episcopalians drink in public."
​

 

[Hellbound]

"How do you tell a Baptist from an Episcopalian?

The Episcopalians drink in public."
​

That's not right.

There's a direct correlation between the number of Southern Baptists and the number of arrests for public intoxication...

 

[rwguinn]

1) Old Testament, not new Testament

2) "children" is better translated from the original as "youths". In context, Elisha was being menaced by the ancient equivalent of a street gang.

3) The Bible forbids murder (again, using the proper terms), not all killing.

10 commandments are Old Testament. You don't get to pick and choose, especially when you Cherry-pick...

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[lobosrul5]

3) The Bible forbids murder (again, using the proper terms), not all killing.

Except when God tells you to.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

It's not that it can't happen here, but that it seems that the US has historically had a weakness in one key aspect compared to other democracies - namely the assigning of electoral boundaries.

Off topic, it ties my hands or I would answer.

 

[Hellbound]

Oh, and by the way, Elisha wasn't "menaced" by anyone...that's an interpretation. The bible says nothing about any implied threat, nor gives any indication of violent gang or even violent action. The only action the youths took was to laugh at and mock Elisha for being bald.

ETA: It's 2nd Kings 2:23 to 2:25

23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. “Get out of here, baldy!” they said. “Get out of here, baldy!” 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys. 25 And he went on to Mount Carmel and from there returned to Samaria.

All they did was jeer. Elisha, instead of turning the other cheek or any of the other actions that supposedly represent the will of God, instead turns around and curses them. Death sentence for mockery.

Not only that, they told him to get out of a place he had no intention of staying in the first place...he could have just walked by and kept going.

Sounds a lot like todays party of the religious right.

 

[acbytesla]

1) Old Testament, not new Testament

I'm not sure what difference that makes. Jesus didn't come to change a jot or a tittle of the law. And these are examples of the behavior of an unchanging God.

2) "children" is better translated from the original as "youths". In context, Elisha was being menaced by the ancient equivalent of a street gang.

No, it isn't.

3) The Bible forbids murder (again, using the proper terms), not all killing.

I didn't say it didn't say that it doesn't

God also allowed Jepthah to sacrifice his daughter. Ordered Abraham to sacrifice his son only to take it back at the last moment. Made a bet with Satan which allowed Job's wife and children to be sacrificed. Killed the first born of Egypt after he himself hardened the Pharaoh's heart. Told Moses to kill all of Amalkites including the women and children. And there are at least 2 dozen similar stories.

And let's not forget sentencing all unbelievers eternal torture. New Testament.

Just an overall good guy.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

You may be right.

Nevertheless I personally saw some of the absurdity myself. For example, the parking lot and in a few other places there were these huge piles of rocks that had to be trucked in. They looked like they had just been temporarily put there for some project. I asked one of the OFW guys about them and he said that they were for small water project. I asked how long they had been there. The answer was 5 years. I asked them what the hold up was. The answer was they were waiting for the permit from the Army Corp of Engineers.

Riight, and that was definitely a well informed anecdote.

People screw up, things don't always go right. But this is nonsense claiming this anecdote proves there are too many regulations. I have plenty of examples where regulations were needed but blocked by some corporate lobbying. People died.

 

[acbytesla]

10 commandments are Old Testament. You don't get to pick and choose, especially when you Cherry-pick...

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There are in fact 615 commandments.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Regulation and regulatory agencies working at cross purposes and delaying some times necessary things is definitely a thing. I work in civil infrastructure and can list numerous examples.

A water agency in West Coast had the local fire control district saying they needed to cut back all of the vegetation on a river but the Army Corp of Engineers wouldn't let them because it was wild life habitat.

So? Since when are competing needs a surprise?

A coastal town that took 3 years to get a permit to build a water treatment plant because the coastal commission wouldn't let them work in the water. Meanwhile they were dumping raw sewage into the bay.

I'm sure this is the whole story.

And these are projects that government agencies were trying to get built, what's it like for a private organization?

These anecdotes are BS. I can give you a dozen that support the need for regulations.

Look at the Bundy case. They wanted to use federal lands without paying a fee. And the reason the lands were regulated in the first place was because before the regulations folks were overgrazing the land, a true Tragedy of the Commons.

 

[pgwenthold]

1) Old Testament, not new Testament

2) "children" is better translated from the original as "youths". In context, Elisha was being menaced by the ancient equivalent of a street gang.

3) The Bible forbids murder (again, using the proper terms), not all killing.

Begging the question.

What is murder? Killing that is not allowed.

Therefore, a commandment prohibiting murder basically says you aren't allowed to kill in situations where you aren't allowed to kill.

It's pretty worthless. All we have to do is to decide something is not murder, and it is therefore allowed.

See: abortion

 

[acbytesla]

Riight, and that was definitely a well informed anecdote.

People screw up, things don't always go right. But this is nonsense claiming this anecdote proves there are too many regulations. I have plenty of examples where regulations were needed but blocked by some corporate lobbying. People died.

I'm convinced that there are too many regs and a government that could better serve the public. But I'm not saying we should eliminate all regulations and like you I tend to be a little skeptical of many of the business regulations that some are keen to get rid of. My point is as Democrats we should be looking and working harder to pinpoint the needless ones. We are the believers that government can be a service to the public. So let's make sure of it.

 

[phiwum]

I disagree. There are soft supporters in both parties. For example, I went duck hunting with a bunch of experienced hunters yesterday. Now, I'm a liberal in a group of red necks and of course they started complaining about the fish and wildlife department. This was Oregon, not my home state of Washington. And you know what? Lots of their complaints were legitimate not just rants. But the government isn't listening and responsively either communicating or solving the issue. Big mistake.

Peeling off a few points from the other side is huge.

I'm sorry to hear that. Is your game commission not working well to conserve game? That's a matter that sportsmen should support.

 

[Darat]

10 commandments are Old Testament. You don't get to pick and choose, especially when you Cherry-pick...

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Which ones?

 

[rwguinn]

There are in fact 615 commandments.

At least. But the SPECIFIC REFERENCE, which YOU are pedanticaly being an ass about, is what the fuss is about and are in the OT, along with the 605 remaining ones you insist upon.

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[rwguinn]

Which ones?

If you nelly-ache about "yeah, well that's old testament, so it don't count", and then immediately invoke the old testament "thou shalt not murder", that's pick and choose.
Being a Jackass us entirely different. References to the 10 Commandments are universally understood to be Exodus 20.
Excessive pedantry is being a *********** jackass in this case.

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[acbytesla]

I'm sorry to hear that. Is your game commission not working well to conserve game? That's a matter that sportsmen should support.

I don't have a clue. My anecdote was just that. I am not really a hunter. I just went with them. And they were telling me stories.

 

[acbytesla]

At least. But the SPECIFIC REFERENCE, which YOU are pedanticaly being an ass about, is what the fuss is about and are in the OT, along with the 605 remaining ones you insist upon.

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My point was that the really offensive and absurd ones are in the other 605. I think we can all get on board with thou shall not kill, steal or lie. But how would you like to be stoned because you had a cheeseburger or shrimp or bacon and eggs? Or that you wore a cotton polyester blend shirt?